Author Topic: A question about effects...  (Read 24910 times)

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Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
Sweet.

Hey, on this effect. Do you know the part of the explosion where it's kind of long? Elongated along the X-axis? I don't like that. You should puff it out and make it more round and full. Just looks better, me thinks -- otherwise it looks kinda like it's a 3D effect being viewed from an odd angle.

Now, if that's a huge amount of work, I totally understand. Just a minor nitpick after staring at it a lot.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2009, 11:41:31 am by General Battuta »

 

Offline Nighteyes

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Re: A question about effects...
http://files.filefront.com/exp10rar/;13697879;/fileinfo.html
Second explosion ready, these are the TGA files :), I actually like this one better, at 45 frames per second even the smaller ships look like they're breaking up nicely.
and yes, ill try to improve the original explosion, especially how it starts(long shape part)  :pimp:

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
Concur!

Is this second explosion going to require a table? I'll try to make it meself, the process seems fairly self-evident.

 

Offline Vasudan Admiral

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Re: A question about effects...
Looks great - that's just the kind of effect we need here. :)

There is a problem though in that there are two sharp clipping planes visible before about frame 100. I'd rather not go through and blur that out or otherwise conceal it if it's faster for you to do in the source file? <See attached images>



One more thing (and remember this is not a criticism, just the state of affairs in FS modding!) - for official MVP releases it's very important that we keep framecounts in all animations to an absolute minimum we can get away with. FS stores every graphic file it uses in a single array which has a limited size of 4750 slots. Into that array you need to fit every single frame of every loaded animation and image, including main hall and all interface, impact effects, shield hits, explosions, shockwaves, animated glowmaps, actual ship textures, background graphics, thruster glows, particle effects, warpmaps, missile trails - everything. AFAIK once an instance of the game breaches that limit, you begin getting texture corruption, where the game looks up the wrong textures for various things, resulting in stuff like ships being given a sun graphic as a texture or something equally bizzare.

I'm by no means saying we need to limit ourselves to the ~47 frames the original effects, but a single effect that jumps from 47 frames to 518 is excessive - and having just 3 effects doing that will straight away takes up a third of the total available slots.

I'm also not saying don't release full length, full quality stuff as you just have because doing that makes the FSU teams job much easier in scaling the framecount and memory footprint of the effect to work best with the Standard and Advanced packages. (Also the full length versions could be quite helpful for making pre-rendered cutscenes. ;) )

So yeah, basically keep up the good work and don't be concerned if we shrink stuff to get it into the MVPs. :yes:

[attachment deleted by evil Tolwyn]
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Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
Question. Can I use these .tga files, or will I need to convert them to .dds before they're usable ingame?

Wiki-fu suggests they're usable. Oddly, they aren't loading.

EDIT: I stumble towards competence: I just realized the necessity of the presence of an .eff file.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2009, 09:32:29 pm by General Battuta »

 

Offline Nighteyes

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Re: A question about effects...
Looks great - that's just the kind of effect we need here. :)

There is a problem though in that there are two sharp clipping planes visible before about frame 100. I'd rather not go through and blur that out or otherwise conceal it if it's faster for you to do in the source file? <See attached images>



One more thing (and remember this is not a criticism, just the state of affairs in FS modding!) - for official MVP releases it's very important that we keep framecounts in all animations to an absolute minimum we can get away with. FS stores every graphic file it uses in a single array which has a limited size of 4750 slots. Into that array you need to fit every single frame of every loaded animation and image, including main hall and all interface, impact effects, shield hits, explosions, shockwaves, animated glowmaps, actual ship textures, background graphics, thruster glows, particle effects, warpmaps, missile trails - everything. AFAIK once an instance of the game breaches that limit, you begin getting texture corruption, where the game looks up the wrong textures for various things, resulting in stuff like ships being given a sun graphic as a texture or something equally bizzare.

I'm by no means saying we need to limit ourselves to the ~47 frames the original effects, but a single effect that jumps from 47 frames to 518 is excessive - and having just 3 effects doing that will straight away takes up a third of the total available slots.

I'm also not saying don't release full length, full quality stuff as you just have because doing that makes the FSU teams job much easier in scaling the framecount and memory footprint of the effect to work best with the Standard and Advanced packages. (Also the full length versions could be quite helpful for making pre-rendered cutscenes. ;) )

So yeah, basically keep up the good work and don't be concerned if we shrink stuff to get it into the MVPs. :yes:
can't someone work the code and bring that limit higher? if I remember correctly the BSG team has the same problem because the galactica has so many turrets and flak, so some effects get cut off?
about the planes sharp spots... it annoys me, but maybe it will be more easy to blue it out manually, and maybe add a small glow on it...
this is about the best I got to conceal it... basically I just put another explosion on top of it, if you can do it I would be gratefull :)
there is the same problem somewhere in the first explosion, but don't fix that one, because ill redo the whole beginning of it...

 

Offline Herra Tohtori

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Re: A question about effects...
can't someone work the code and bring that limit higher? if I remember correctly the BSG team has the same problem because the galactica has so many turrets and flak, so some effects get cut off?
about the planes sharp spots... it annoys me, but maybe it will be more easy to blue it out manually, and maybe add a small glow on it...
this is about the best I got to conceal it... basically I just put another explosion on top of it, if you can do it I would be gratefull :)
there is the same problem somewhere in the first explosion, but don't fix that one, because ill redo the whole beginning of it...



That's the object limit, too many things flying around at the same time. However even if/when this limit is upped, the projectiles still use the same effect textures so that shouldn't tax the amount of texture "slots", so it's a separate issue as far as I know.
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Offline JVLK

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Re: A question about effects...
Just watched that youtube video, looks pretty badass....great job so far nighteyes  :yes:

 

Offline shiv

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Re: A question about effects...
Can we get it in a higher resolution?
http://www.sectorgame.com/vega
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Offline Nighteyes

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Re: A question about effects...
Can we get it in a higher resolution?
Sorry but not really... my stock footage is very low rez, 320x240, its free stuff and higher rez costs lots of money... :(
so making it look good for 512x512 wasn't so hard, maybe I can make one of higher rez, but I don't know how it will turn out.
anyway can I ask what for? :)

 

Offline shiv

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Re: A question about effects...
Basically, I want to use it in Earth Defense mod ( http://www.game-warden.com/earthdefence/ ) and while big ships explode in close range you can see it's a bit too much low resolution.

Anyway, if you're good in animation mahybe you'd like to join Earth Defense team? :)
http://www.sectorgame.com/vega
The Apocalypse Vega - Join the battle! A campaign for FreeSpace 2 Open

http://www.game-warden.com/earthdefence
Earth Defense project - Coming soon...

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
Just so long as he doesn't become some kind of exclusive. I'd really like to see these effects in the MediaVPs for everybody to use.

 

Offline Nighteyes

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Re: A question about effects...
well from what I'm hearing right now, this effect is already stressing the current limit of the engine... making it anything higher rez will surly kill it, and anyway, way would you want to be close to an exploding capship?  :D (and its double the resolution of what we had before)

update* I tested the 2 explosions together, and I don't think they work well when a capship explodes, so I'm working on another version, when I have something worth showing ill update :) (possibly at the weekend when I have some time for it :))

About being exclusive, don't worry I want this be available for everyone, the whole idea is to make the game better no? mod or no mod :)

About Earth Defense, sounds like a great mod, I'd love to help out, what kind of stuff do you need?(I hope not too complex lol ) I'm currently learning after effects, I know photoshop, and a few years back I was working in maya and 3dsmax... mostly playing around with particles  :D

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
I believe what's stressing the engine is the number of frames in the effect, not the resolution of each frame. Though I could be wrong.

 

Offline aRaven

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Re: A question about effects...
just up the frickin resolution...I have 4gb ram, shouldn't be a problem ^^

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
just up the frickin resolution...I have 4gb ram, shouldn't be a problem ^^

Well you're not the only person who matters :rolleyes: :P

I've tested the explosion pretty extensively on a high-end system, and it does cause some slowdown even at current resolution, so even 4 gigs of RAM is not foolproof.

 

Offline shiv

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Re: A question about effects...
Quote
About Earth Defense, sounds like a great mod, I'd love to help out, what kind of stuff do you need?(
I'd like to talk about that on IM. Do you use any? :)
http://www.sectorgame.com/vega
The Apocalypse Vega - Join the battle! A campaign for FreeSpace 2 Open

http://www.game-warden.com/earthdefence
Earth Defense project - Coming soon...

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
Using both of the new effects (08 and 10) I'm getting extensive texture corruption on other ships, so it looks like they are bumping the 4850 limit. Can we increase that limit somehow?

 

Offline Nighteyes

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Re: A question about effects...
Quote
About Earth Defense, sounds like a great mod, I'd love to help out, what kind of stuff do you need?(
I'd like to talk about that on IM. Do you use any? :)
find me on windows live messenger: [email protected] :)
Strange about the texture corruption, I'm not having any problem with both of them running... anyway as I said, hopefully by the weekend you will have a new toy to play with  :D

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: A question about effects...
You're probably using FS2 retail. I'm using a mod with a lot of additional textures. Unfortunately, it's important to maintain compatibility if it's going to go into the MediaVPs.

The best solution would be to bump that texture cap.