[Fury]

I feel the use of the tables themselves to fredders would be limited at best. (and a complete waste of effort and hard disk space 99% of the time).
I certainly don't oppose someone creating the effects, but their inclusion in the mediavps and their associated tables just feel like too limited an application.

For the most part, you can balance missions properly using the canon shivan primaries. If I don't want to use those, I'd prefer to make my own tables for shivan weapons instead of just using shivan copies of GTVA  weapons, to be honest.

You may think like that now, but let's see what you think when you've played BP: WiH in where you'll go against the GTVA weapons in the hands of quite capable AI. Shivans are hardly a challenge with their inferior primaries.

Shivans already share most secondaries with GTVA, extending that to cover remaining secondaries and all primaries is only logical extension that would benefit fredders. And since MULTI project as far as I know, is planning to have shivans as playable faction, the weapons are necessary anyway.

[General Battuta]

It could be cool for MULTI but I do think custom Shivan weapons are a better notion than reskinned GTVA ones.

[Snail]

Yeah, custom Shivan weapons like those made by LightSpeed would be a lot more interesting.

[Vrets]

Reskinned GTVA primaries would be excellent. I'd definately use them.

I don't understand why Shivan primaries are so weak. Strange balancing decision. The Shivans would be scarier if they used conservative numbers of deadly ships rather than huge swarms of nerfed fighters.

[Snail]

Reskinned GTVA primaries would be excellent. I'd definately use them.

I don't understand why Shivan primaries are so weak. Strange balancing decision. The Shivans would be scarier if they used conservative numbers of deadly ships rather than huge swarms of nerfed fighters.

It made more sense in FS1 where the three Shivan primaries were basically slightly nerfed versions of the Avenger, Prometheus and Banshee respectively. By FS2 they remained unchanged, while their GTVA counterparts got improved.

[Droid803]

It could be cool for MULTI but I do think custom Shivan weapons are a better notion than reskinned GTVA ones.

Well, if MULTI needs it, then I agree with this statement.

Still, I think that they shouldn't be just lumped with the Mediavps. At least they should be in a separate file so people who don't need it don't need to have them (ie. doesn't play multi, non-FREDder, whatever) taking up table space.

[General Battuta]

If they are required for Multi they will definitely be going into the MediaVPs, as I understand.

[Bob-san]

Why not copy the damage/minute rate and effects but keep the firing rate the same as an equivalent Shivan weapon? Include a few other sorts (for example, shield-breakers, long-range cannons, &c) for balance but forget about making a Shivan-skinned Terran primary. As it is, the Vasudans have a slight twist in primaries favoring faster firing rate

[Galemp]

I'm gonna move this thread to FreeSpace Modding, as none of these suggestions are going into the Media VPs.

[Jessnec]

Can I help you with new bitmaps ???   , for example, a shivan subach  or kayser bitmap   :

[FelixJim]

If balancing was the main issue, could one not simply copy the existing shivan primaries into a .tbm, rename "Shivan Light Laser (strong)" or whatever, and bump up the damage? That way no new models would be required, and there would be no issues with mediavps.

[Galemp]

The point is that this stuff belongs in a separate modpack, and not in the Media VPs.