[Grizzly]

Yes. Back in the 60s, Germany's economy was so strong that the present workforce in Germany wasn't sufficient, so people from Turkey and Italy (predominantly) were given incentive to work here. The expectation was that they would work here for a few years, then return home.

That, obviously, was wrong. Unfortunately, german politics have been in a state of denial about this fact, and were rather hoping the situation would take care of itself. Which was wrong as well.

So basically, the current situation is a ****ing ****fest the same conservative politicians that are now trying to Do Something (TM) rode us into. Cluster**** doesn't begin to describe it.

Same in Holland. Nobody ever figured that Holland is actually a nice play to live in (Or atleast, no politician did, they always shout HOLLAND SUCKS EXCEPT WHEN WE RULE IT) and that people actually wanted to stay here.

[StarSlayer]

So does anyone actually have any tangible evidence, metrics, anecdotes to prove that multiculturalism has failed in Germany?  Besides that the government importing a bunch of foreign workers hoping they would eventually leave but didn't?   The foreign workers wishing to remain in Germany seems more indicative of multiculturalism working then not.  If integration was a complete crap shoot I would be expecting them to be looking to return to their original country.

[The E]

So does anyone actually have any tangible evidence, metrics, anecdotes to prove that multiculturalism has failed in Germany?  Besides that the government importing a bunch of foreign workers hoping they would eventually leave but didn't?   The foreign workers wishing to remain in Germany seems more indicative of multiculturalism working then not.  If integration was a complete crap shoot I would be expecting them to be looking to return to their original country.

I don't really think so. It's just that the many, many many examples of successful integration don't get anything close to the airtime on national television than the unsuccessful examples.

[Flipside]

And, in the strictest sense, immigration is not multiculturalism. looked at closely, the whole world is multi-cultural, there isn't a society out there that isn't a mixture of several older ones. As I said earlier, from the point of view of those at ground level, there is always strife, be it Normans and Saxons, the various nation-states of Ancient Greece, the Roman Empire etc.

Given several hundred years, those cultures, with disparate languages and practices have merged together into something new and greater than the parts, but that integration always comes with problems and strife for those involved.

I wouldn't say multi-culturalism has failed, but it is hard and we have to work to make it successfull, on both sides. It will never, ever be easy. We live in a world where we expect results instantly, and some things, like the growth of societies, simply cannot happen on the time scales that we have grown accustomed to.

[StarSlayer]

Well sounds like standard growing pains then, give it another generation or two then you'll all have some new ethnic group to unite against.  What do you think worked the best for integrating the Irish into America?  The Italians showing up.

[Flipside]

Same here in the UK, during the 70's we had a lot of racial tension because of an influx of, mostly, Pakistani and African workers, now that tension has died down and a new tension has risen with Eastern Europeans. It's cycles, people hate change, but they do adapt, they may not be happy about it, but it's been the story of civilisation for thousands of years.

[Bobboau]

So does anyone actually have any tangible evidence, metrics, anecdotes to prove that multiculturalism has failed in Germany?

just wip out your multicultrometer and take a reading, most places in Germany at at 0.04 - 0.02cu when France UK and the us are all in the 7-8 range, hell even Afghanistan is higher at 0.08.

[StarSlayer]

When I read an article were a head of state makes a rather stark claim about an important issue I'd like to see some reasoning behind it, rather than use it as a punchline in some painfully irrelevant analogy about Mexicans in the Untied States. 

If there is a major failure of the assimilation of immigrants there should be evidence to support it, it isn't an unreasonable request.  For example high unemployment in the minority group, raising crime rates, negative impact to the economy etc.  Something more tangible then they are not sprechen sie Deutsch fast enough.

[Flipside]

Politicians are like that though, the largest period of time that many politicians can think ahead to is between 'now' and 'the next election'. Anything that requires patience beyond that time frame is something they don't want to consider if at all possible.