Author Topic: The debt talks  (Read 26170 times)

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Offline Bob-san

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Ah. The oil price piece was very education, Bob.

I remember the credit rating bureau's getting a lot of flak in the EU because they were all based in the US, and appeared to be biased towards it. Could there be any truth in that? What are all those ratings based on anyway?
There are European credit bureaus. The reason they're biased towards the USA is that, good or bad, right or wrong, weak or strong, the USA has had the largest economy in the world for decades now. The bias was more in setting the USA as AAA status--which wasn't really a problem prior. The problem is now getting ridiculous. Under Bush, it wasn't a problem because the government, while it had significant debt, it wasn't overburdening. Under Obama now, with a debt equaling about 100% of the GDP, it's overwhelming. If you read the actual S&P report, it basically says three things.

1) Raise revenue higher or cut spending. This recent debt plan is bull****. Don't just cap spending--actually cut it and start paying down this debt.
2) Both branches of the legislature and the administration need to decide on SOMETHING to actually do.
3) I don't care whose plan does it, but get it done!!

Uncertainty kills spending. The S&P analysis of the situation is that of a third party observer.

The credit bureaus don't use singular criteria to rate debt. Here's some considerations...
-Ability to pay debt
-Short-term (<1 year), medium-term (1-5 years), and long-term plans (5-20 years) plans on operations
-Industry trends. How does XYZ look to fare in >5 years? Will their primary product be obsolete or considered a luxury?
-Leadership strength and ability

Anyone who immediately sells their government bonds is an idiot at this junction.

One other thing to note: an important issue when considering foreign investment is the strength of the currency it's issued in. That's one reason that Moody's/S&P/Fitch are somewhat "biased" towards the USA--we have a single currency that has been the benchmark that all other currencies are weighted upon.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2011, 08:53:48 am by Bob-san »
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Offline Nuke

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mother****ing debt.k i b drunks so no more debatesz on iy
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Offline Unknown Target

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So...the stock market? Anyone concerned or no?

 

Offline Bob-san

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So...the stock market? Anyone concerned or no?
Nope. It's the perfect time to speculate IMO. If only my check came in last week instead of this coming Friday. I'd have made 5% on BAC and will probably see a 5-10% gain on Friday.
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Offline Unknown Target

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What would you suggest I invest in? Anything worth putting $500 in?

 

Offline Bob-san

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What would you suggest I invest in? Anything worth putting $500 in?
Make it at least $1,000. And Bank of America. Try to buy when they're under $7. I think prices will fall further tomorrow and stabilize on Friday. Performance on Monday will have appreciation. This all just cursory analysis, of course. YMMV. Regardless, short of unforeseen actions, BAC share prices will rise again. Don't expect much in the next month or two. Maybe after the GOP primary, assuming that Moody's and Fitch don't downgrade our sovereign debt.
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Offline Kosh

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So...the stock market? Anyone concerned or no?


Long term? Stock market is rotten, being propped up by cheap federal reserve money. Speculate only if you know what you're doing.
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Offline Unknown Target

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Eh I'll stay out of it, then.

 
I never actually considered getting in there... What are ones motivatinos for doing so?

 

Offline Unknown Target

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Great time for buying stocks when they hit rock bottom. The natural assumption is that the whole market won't fail, so eventually you'll get some pretty good returns on your investment. For instance, after the automakers got hammered, I bought in for Ford for like $6. By the time I sold it was like $14.

 

Offline Bob-san

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Great time for buying stocks when they hit rock bottom. The natural assumption is that the whole market won't fail, so eventually you'll get some pretty good returns on your investment. For instance, after the automakers got hammered, I bought in for Ford for like $6. By the time I sold it was like $14.
BAC's lowest point was about $3.20. If you held onto it for a couple years, it was worth $15 a couple weeks ago. As I've always said; if the system fails, it won't matter anyway.
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Offline Unknown Target

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Offline Bob-san

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What about this, Bob-san?

http://www.oftwominds.com/blogaug11/if-market-crashes-8-11.html
What about it? It does have some impact, at least on the companies that most people work at. Major companies are usually traded on the stock exchange and make up portions of individual retirement plans. Everyone will lose money, but it all depends on how much and where it was invested.
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Offline Unknown Target

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Well the gist I got from it was "so what if the stock market crashes, only bazzillionares will loose money". Though I understand the issue with retirement plans.

 

Offline Bob-san

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Well the gist I got from it was "so what if the stock market crashes, only bazzillionares will loose money". Though I understand the issue with retirement plans.
That's quite correct. It's also why, after further research, I see no reason that the finance companies or banks should have been bailed out. There's a reason why FDIC insurance exists and normal banks have lines of credit with larger banks and federal banks. I personally want the Federal Reserve to be revised and reformulated but I don't want it destroyed entirely. It's an important aspect of our financial system.
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Offline Kosh

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Well the gist I got from it was "so what if the stock market crashes, only bazzillionares will loose money". Though I understand the issue with retirement plans.


Most of the insiders in the stock market, those bazzillionaires, already left. Proportionally the losses sustained by your average bazillionaire is considerably less than the average joe. When the Nasdaq crashed in 2001 most people invested had their entire retirement plans and pensions wiped out. When the market crashed in 2008, same story.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Well the gist I got from it was "so what if the stock market crashes, only bazzillionares will loose money". Though I understand the issue with retirement plans.

I am clearly a bazzillionare.
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Offline MP-Ryan

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Offline Luis Dias

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MP, I think the most important stats from your page is this little snippet:

Quote
44% of Congress people are millionaires.

The president is also a millionaire. They won't let it slide.

 

Offline redsniper

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http://patrioticmillionaires.org/

Discuss.

I don't believe what I'm seeing.

Perhaps the signers believe this has little chance of actually raising taxes, so they can sign it to look good with no actual risk. How very... political...
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