Author Topic: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread  (Read 45445 times)

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
I'm sure they could've done a corridor shot on greenscreen (heck, they still might), and they absolutely could've redone all the sets as they were. Part of the idea in doing this as a CG series was to do stuff they couldn't have built physically. Personally, I always wondered exactly how they got the Vipers from one pod to the other in the Miniseries, and it irritated me that in BSG's haste to not be Star Trek, we never once saw an elevator in six years. And no one is going to be walking an injured crewman from engineering to sickbay across a mile of corridors and down thirty flights of stairs.

Did they go over-the-top in making more elaborate versions of the old sets? Yeah, probably. But as Drexler pointed out, they made sure to use the original sets as a starting point, so you could see where they line up with the versions in B&C. As far as near-unrecognizable hand-waved "refits" of sci-fi ships go, it's a lot more faithful to the original design than the U.S.S. Enterprise from the Star Trek movies was to the original TV show.

It's interesting to mention "Forward Unto Dawn," since the only thing FUD and B&C have in common are the distribution method and the rough release date. FUD was intended to be a more character and plot based exploration of its universe, to flesh out the action-oriented take the video games provide. B&C has the opposite aim, to provide an action/adventure story of the BSG universe to counterpoint the more cerebral and deliberative tone of the parent shows (remember how there was exactly one space battle in all of season 3)? Also, not negligibly, FUD had a $10 million production, while B&C was made with $2 million. For comparison, "The Lost Tales," the Babylon 5 direct-to-DVD project five years ago, also had a $2 million budget. Now, they did get a corridor, but not much else. (That budget is also why I forgive them for the candy-colored, bloom-and-flare art style. They don't have any live-action to match, like when they put in a centurion or did a set extension on the hangar on the old show, nor do they have a giant James Cameron production apparatus to get their CG perfect in isolation. It's understandable that they'd use every dirty trick in the book to set the actors into the backgrounds, even it has the effect of making the real stuff look animated rather than the animated stuff look real. Still, I like animation. Clone Wars, good stuff).

Right now, I have a feeling that my biggest issue is going to be the plot structure necessitated by developing the movie as a seven-part serial. It's like commercial breaks on steroids, since it seems part of the the aim was the make each section kind of stand-alone. I don't know if it'll be possible, since we've only seen a quarter of it so far, but maybe the longer TV and DVD versions shuffle some scenes in the edit so the plot isn't so obviously broken into discrete chunks.

 

Offline Dilmah G

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
I don't mean to be a major n00b here, but does anyone know how I get to view it in Australia? I had a brief look and it doesn't look like I can watch it here.
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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
B&C is giving us some great glimpses of Colonial hardware we've never seen before. I imagine that for the mod/game makers it's providing a lot of good fodder. So far we've seen a bunch of other large ships surrounding the Galactica (warships or support vessels do you think?), an older Raptor, what is possibly another model of Viper (and there's no reason both couldn't be in service at the same time), and now have canon proof that Battlestars aren't the only category of warship (Heavy Cruiser). We're also getting to see what things were like when the Galactica was operating as she was intended, with no shortage of resources or personnel.

Yeah the absence (so far) of any deep characterization is disappointing, but I find the complete lack of the horrible metaphysical garbage that has plagued the franchise from the start to be most refreshing. It's a straight up war story, playing the 'real world military IN SPAAAAAAAAACE' aspect to the hilt, and I'm perfectly fine with that. I would think people who have spent considerable time and effort making a game that revolves around exactly that would be more appreciative of what they're getting in this latest show.

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
This is nowhere near a good 'straight up war story'. It's not a war story and the flat characterization and lack of anything interesting happening means it's not a good story, period.

BSG had a lot of metaphysical claptrap, but also a lot of really interesting questions about utilitarian vs deontological approaches to crisis management in politics and warfare, and the difference between faithful simulation of humanity and 'the real deal'. None of that here yet.

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
The metaphysical shenanigans of BSG were quite interesting to a point. I saw the whole thing as an experiment on "how far can we go and what crazy things can we devise as we move along", but then they kinda blew it taking it too damn seriously. Particularly joyful were the first two seasons where you really did not have a clue on whether the metaphysics were real, were psychological devices, or just blatant political lies that kept the fleet united. They kept the audience guessing and in the meantime there were lots of interesting questions on how politics and religion got hold of a desperate population, how detailed and formulated and sometimes downright machiavelic the crafting of these ideas are, and what role all these have in the creation of a people. How people were moved by believing in them, the hope they gave, and the sheer tension all these promises had with the absolute absurdism of everything surrounding them.

The show was just amazingly good at portraying humanity in its entirety at its peak tension.

Theeeen it kinda wandered to somewhere boring, clumsy and facepalmworthy. But it was really something for a while.

 
Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
I feel it wandered into straight up stupid at a certain point. They spent a long time with things being ambiguous. Moore even says so on one of the commentaries. Is it coincidence or divine intervention that keeps saving Baltar, for example? For a couple seasons at least either interpretation is valid. And then the show just went off a cliff and resulted in a final season that I would rather just forget even happened. Not unlike Lost.

 

Offline StarSlayer

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
The first two seasons of Galactica were the perfect "aircraft carrier in space."  It had tight story lines and characters and solid depiction of a military unit on the run and responsible for the last vestiges of its civilization.  The mysteries of the Cylons, the questions about the overarching story of the colonies and the possibility of divine intervention just added delicious icing to the cake.  Its proof a good SciFi war story can be made for the TV that's smart and engaging.  When those mysteries were resolved in an unsatisfactory manner, for me, and the focus shifted away from a tight depiction of that carrier in space concept I felt it suffered much for the loss.

Blood and Chrome so far has not been a return to form, in fact so far it hasn't captured any of the above.  I'd love a to have more of the first two seasons of Galactica with the added bonus of an entire theater of war and its attendant complexity.  BSG only dealt with a couple of military units and a few rag tag fleet of civvies, the First Cylon War offers the opportunity to depict an entire military and civilization worth of quandaries and dilemmas as they are driven to the brink by an implacable foe.  A foe that is in fact a culmination of their hubris and sins, almost like another universe I can think of.  Hell I'd forgive some of the terribad things they've done to Galactica and the Vipers if it were otherwise solid.  What's been given so far is more like a cheesy cartoon of BSG.  Popping your canopy and shooting Raiders with a pistol is straight up 80s GI Joe shenanigans.  Toaster anacondas look like they ripped off Thundercats or He-Man.  More guns, more Vipers, more lens flare a good Battlestar experience does not make.   Trying to excuse it as an war story holds no water, BSG already proved how great tightly packaged war story can be.  I admit I maybe am being a little harsh and it might improve immensely as it goes along but if the whole thing is similar to the first two episodes then I'd frankly rather watch TOS.
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Offline torc

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
i think we're judging this show a bit early... Yeah the show starts whit something very ''last action hero'' style,but if the story will be focused into the Bill's Point of view,we should see the show grow as his main character.

What worried me is that after the pilot this show will never see the light of day,and all this story will not have the time to grow and become a good BSG show...that's all.
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Offline General Battuta

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Unfortunately that's a given at this point - the show will not be picked up for series.

 

Offline karajorma

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Popping your canopy and shooting Raiders with a pistol is straight up 80s GI Joe shenanigans.

To be fair, Adama knew damn well it was a simulation and that he'd win if he killed the toaster before he was killed. He was just exploiting the game in order to win. Now if we'd seen something like that in a real life situation, I'd be just as inclined to think it was stupid.
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Offline newman

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Popping the canopy scene became more tolerable after finding out it's a sim, but otherwise I'm inclined to agree with Slayer. "It's a war story!" doesn't excuse it from lacking substance, atmosphere, or having some pretty bad design / style / editing decisions. Look no further than BSG mini / season one for an example of a well executed war story. So far, this doesn't hold a candle to it. To be fair, it's storytelling job isn't made easy by the idiotic "let's split it into 12 minute chunks" decision that only contributes to it feeling like a cartoon.
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Offline StarSlayer

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Popping your canopy and shooting Raiders with a pistol is straight up 80s GI Joe shenanigans.

To be fair, Adama knew damn well it was a simulation and that he'd win if he killed the toaster before he was killed. He was just exploiting the game in order to win. Now if we'd seen something like that in a real life situation, I'd be just as inclined to think it was stupid.

To be honest I always figured when the balloon went up against the Cylons pretty much all the meatbags on the "web" using those holo googles where going to have their brains fried.  There was something always delicious about that virtual escapism consuming all those who used it a blinding flash of destroyed synapses and obliterated neural networks courtesy of the Toasters.  In a society that is now supposed to be rejecting technology in order to survive I figured all those holo interfaces where going to be one of the first things in the trash compactor, I don't recall them in BSG.

Plus if its a legit military simulator and not Call of Duty actually destroying a fighter with your side arm is stupid.  Many of the lighter machine guns mounted on World War Two aircraft where found to be lacking in kill power and Adama's going to plug a Raider with a pistol?.
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
You are out of order, soldier. Raiders' HP was artificially low. One must check the $Armor Type figures before spreading all these libelous lies against one of the best meatbag pilots we have in our navy. Have you even bothered to read the armor.tbl of that raider son? I'll have you cleaning the decks of this ship 24/7 for a whole week if you repeat this frakkin nonsense again, understand? Carry on, soldier.

 
Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Which key do I press to pop the canopy in Diaspora? Also, when my sidearm runs out of rounds, what do I press to eject? I figure if I extend my fist while I eject, I can punch the Raider with an additional 1000 HP worth of damage.

 

Offline newman

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Which key do I press to pop the canopy in Diaspora? Also, when my sidearm runs out of rounds, what do I press to eject? I figure if I extend my fist while I eject, I can punch the Raider with an additional 1000 HP worth of damage.

We wanted to integrate this particular game mechanic as seamlessly as possible into the game; for this reason, there is no key command for this - you activate it by discharging a real sidearm (team recommends 9mm or .45 standard) into your monitor.
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Offline Frak_Tastic

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Call me crazy, but I thought both episodes (watched them twice now) were TERRIBLE.  Bad sets, recton everything, and terrible acting.  Literally nothing looked right to me except the uniforms. 

Funny thing is I thought "The Plan" was a bit fanboyish, but Blood & Chrome feels like an out-and-out foreign film knock off of the series.

I'll probably watch the rest of them anyways given the lack of scifi on tv, but I'll have to pretend it isn't BSG to enjoy it.

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
No I don't think you're crazy. The script is insultingly shallow so far - the cocky rookie out for blood, the weary vet just a few missions from retirement, the hero ace who's ALL A SHAM, the sexy and icy but slightly undercompetent civilian, the ~secret mission~. All so tired.

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
The problem ain't the clichés. The problem is the boringness of the chosen clichés and its boring execution. You can almost hear the yawning of the show's writers. Or is that my sleep deprivation?

 
Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
Now if we'd seen something like that in a real life situation, I'd be just as inclined to think it was stupid.

Not to belabor the point...

 

Offline torc

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Re: [Spoilers] Blood & Chrome - The Discussion Thread
LOL! i almost forgot! :D
indossare una divisa può avere un prezzo alto...ma a volte...è troppo alto!!! Bill Adama