Author Topic: Microsoft to buy Mojang?  (Read 4521 times)

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Offline Dragon

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Indeed, my younger brothers are crazy about Minecraft. I used to play with legos when I was their age... Maybe after M$ ruins Minecraft, they'll start playing with real toys. :)

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Notch caught lightning in a bottle, basically, and while that might deserve praise it was down to luck as much as his own skill. The real test of his abilities was whether he'd have the perceptiveness and creativity to take that idea to new and greater heights, and in that respect he, and his successors at Mojang, have failed dismally.

What heights would these be?
I've heard people talk about the potential but no one's really put it into words.

I mean, personally I think if they'd just polished up beta 1.7 and released that it'd have been an acceptable Minecraft 1.0. The terrain generation, and by extension the worlds it creates, is really the soul of the whole experience and probably the component with the most potential for development, but when they tried building on it further with 1.8 they arguably just made the landscape much less vibrant and unique. It's easy to look for some gaping fatal flaw to point to and say "I could've done that better" but I don't know if I see anything like that in Minecraft; just a lot of mediocrity being plastered over brilliance.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
My one biggest complaint about minecraft is that there aren't more randomnly generated, hostile-inhabited structures.

Just small, one-room dungeons and generic abandoned mines. How about some NPC enemy towns or castles or underground dungeons, they add bricks but the world itself still remains pretty much the same. Most of the additions focus more on building than on adventuring. They add new enemies and so forth here and there but, it's not really enough.

 

Offline deathfun

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
My one biggest complaint about minecraft is that there aren't more randomnly generated, hostile-inhabited structures.

Just small, one-room dungeons and generic abandoned mines. How about some NPC enemy towns or castles or underground dungeons, they add bricks but the world itself still remains pretty much the same. Most of the additions focus more on building than on adventuring. They add new enemies and so forth here and there but, it's not really enough.

You forgot about Strongholds which are the underground dungeons

But I get what you're saying. It'd be nice to discover the world rather than just create it
I'd also prefer that Minecraft took an approach in the Terraria direction in which the combat actually has more of a point.

By that I mean, if you take away combat in Terraria, you're missing out on a ****ton of awesome things. If you take away combat in Minecraft, you're just minimizing frustration so you can obtain your stuff to build with


That's sort of a departure from the original post though
"No"

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
My one biggest complaint about minecraft is that there aren't more randomnly generated, hostile-inhabited structures.

Just small, one-room dungeons and generic abandoned mines. How about some NPC enemy towns or castles or underground dungeons, they add bricks but the world itself still remains pretty much the same. Most of the additions focus more on building than on adventuring. They add new enemies and so forth here and there but, it's not really enough.

You forgot about Strongholds which are the underground dungeons

But I get what you're saying. It'd be nice to discover the world rather than just create it
I'd also prefer that Minecraft took an approach in the Terraria direction in which the combat actually has more of a point.

By that I mean, if you take away combat in Terraria, you're missing out on a ****ton of awesome things. If you take away combat in Minecraft, you're just minimizing frustration so you can obtain your stuff to build with


That's sort of a departure from the original post though

Isn't there only one stronghold though? And the only unique inhabitant is from what I understand silverfish.
I've never actually seen a stronghold. Or actually you're probably  talking abotu Nether strongholds, which are cool too but again would like more of that.

I want my minecraft to be more like skyrim basically. Have the world seem inhabited, by both good and bad. Have ruins and towns and places to conquer and explore. These pyramids and witches huts are good and stuff, but instead of just a jungle pyramid a big structure with one or two chests in it. why not have a run down mayan town or whatnot surrounding this pyramid or ziggarut or whatnot. Have these randomnly generated structures more randomn. Throw a spawner in there once in a while, have random tunnels underneath perhaps, etecetera.

If they could do thousands of random dungeons in Daggerfall, they can do a few random dungeons and towns and so forth in Minecraft :)


I know mods can add a lot but, I dunno. I've been watching a few of the yogscast series regarding their yogscast complete pack which is supposed to have some 1000 odd mods in it but, for the most part it just seems like the mods don't really add much to the game. There are some magical mods, which seem cool, and there are some dungeons added and lots of mobs and so forth. But on the other side, it just seems like tier upon tier of odd blocks to build. Build a block to build a new type of block and get a block to harvest other blocks easier and store the blocks in the computer but in the end for what?

Though, that being sad I think they also faff about a lot on purpose to show the mod rather than to simply get things done.

As for microsoft. well if they do indeed but it, I suspect they would leave the PC gaming side of things mod friendly but they would monetize the Xbox experience by adding some DLC and the like most likely. Maybe this same DLC would be on PC as well but of course be optional. Not sure how that would work with servers though.

Microsoft, from my perspective has supported some great games. Halo games for the Xbox, Gears of War, they have the summer indie of arcade which helped put a spotlight on games like Limbo, super meat boy, bastion, etcetera. They've done some good things, and the 360 was known for its multiplayer over the PS3. Not sure that still holds true. Minecraft however is the best selling indie game on the xbox.

I don't think they would **** it up.
And on the subject of white men trying to be hip. Remember Steve jobs? He was an older white guy who defined hip for a lot of people.

But whatver the case. It's not sold yet. And it's not screwed up yet. Though obviously some early adopters disagree.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Having found out more details about the recent implosion of the Bukkit project, I now realise that Mojang is an incredibly ****ty and unethical company. Let Microsoft have them; the two deserve each other.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline BritishShivans

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
huh, can i have some links on that, phantom?

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
This is a decent summary, but you need to dig around for a while before you see exactly how ****ed up the situation was. Read EvilSeph's original statement particularly.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline BritishShivans

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
* BritishShivans facepalms

Jesus, that's... something.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Right? I mean the people in Mojang aren't really bad people, but they just cannot handle the kind of responsibility that comes with owning Minecraft and they've caused a lot of damage because of that.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Also, some Microsoft lawyer is probably having an aneurysm after discovering that the code Mojang supposedly owns in Bukkit is under a licence that requires them to open-source Minecraft itself.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
What's unethical exactly?

The lawyer who gives his two cents seems to side with mojang on legal matters.

 

Offline Flipside

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Well, the sale has been confirmed, so I consider it a 'wait and see' situation at the moment.

If Microsoft do an 'EA' and ruin the license, then sales and player-numbers will reflect that and they will have wasted $2.5bn, let's just hope they are not that stupid.

 

Offline Aardwolf

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Is Microsoft just doing this for the potential payout? I wouldn't have been surprised if there was more to it than that. Notch, at least, has publicly expressed some opinions that might make him something of a "thorn in their side" that might consider it worth the money to shut him up.

There might be (other) "control" reasons, rather than direct "gimme that income" reasons, that affected the decision, as well.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
What's unethical exactly?

The lawyer who gives his two cents seems to side with mojang on legal matters.

I dunno what lawyer you're talking about, because VideoGameAttorney's two cents are very squarely siding with Wolfe and the DMCA takedown. As for ethics? Well, these people were basically providing the stable modding API that Mojang promised. For free. Without any support from Mojang, who hired Bukkit's best devs and secretly bought out the project only to totally abandon it. That's a ****ty way to treat people by any standard.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline The E

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Is Microsoft just doing this for the potential payout? I wouldn't have been surprised if there was more to it than that.

In pure monetary terms, Mojang and Minecraft are not worth 2.5 billion. Mojang itself is a development house that has had one incredible hit, and no followup that came even close to its success. The revenue from continued Minecraft sales, while considerable, will not pay off 2.5 billion USD anytime soon.

But, Minecraft has an incredible install base. Having access to them is worth a lot. Then there's the, for lack of a better term, cultural aspects of this. Minecraft is one of THE entry drugs into gaming. Being associated with that is certainly not a bad thing, from a marketing perspective.
Let there be light
Let there be moon
Let there be stars and let there be you
Let there be monsters and let there be pain
Let us begin to feel again
--Devin Townsend, Genesis

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
What's unethical exactly?

The lawyer who gives his two cents seems to side with mojang on legal matters.

I dunno what lawyer you're talking about, because VideoGameAttorney's two cents are very squarely siding with Wolfe and the DMCA takedown.

"the arguments that Minecraft is open source are ridiculous"
"But at the end of the day, don’t just believe one side is “good” and the other “bad” here."

What exactly are you reading again?
Because earlier you said:

Also, some Microsoft lawyer is probably having an aneurysm after discovering that the code Mojang supposedly owns in Bukkit is under a licence that requires them to open-source Minecraft itself.

Despite the fact this lawyer says its ridiculous. So, I really don't know what you're reading from this link.


As for ethics? Well, these people were basically providing the stable modding API that Mojang promised. For free. Without any support from Mojang, who hired Bukkit's best devs and secretly bought out the project only to totally abandon it. That's a ****ty way to treat people by any standard.

Hiring and paying people is unethical?
Allegedly gaining ownership of a property and deciding to drop it is unethical?
They dropped a property that the developers themselves decided to drop, or rather they decided to still work on it despite the original developers dropping it.

If Mojang is developing an alternative to bukkit, why would they support it?



 

Offline Aardwolf

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Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Is Microsoft just doing this for the potential payout? I wouldn't have been surprised if there was more to it than that.

In pure monetary terms, Mojang and Minecraft are not worth 2.5 billion. Mojang itself is a development house that has had one incredible hit, and no followup that came even close to its success. The revenue from continued Minecraft sales, while considerable, will not pay off 2.5 billion USD anytime soon.

But, Minecraft has an incredible install base. Having access to them is worth a lot. Then there's the, for lack of a better term, cultural aspects of this. Minecraft is one of THE entry drugs into gaming. Being associated with that is certainly not a bad thing, from a marketing perspective.

I'm reminded of the move Charles Foster Kane used to corner the newspaper market... the competition had put together the best damned news team money could buy... how could CFK possibly compete with that? So what does CFK do? He buys it.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Despite the fact this lawyer says its ridiculous. So, I really don't know what you're reading from this link.

Look, I don't mind that you don't have the time to read through what I said and referenced properly, but you shouldn't go around replying on that basis. Now, the situation here is this: the GPL, under which Bukkit is licensed, has very strict conditions requiring you to release the source code for all elements of the software you're providing. Bukkit, however, works on a basic level by taking sections of the released Minecraft binaries, rewriting them to add functionality, then reinserting them. This means that substantial sections of Bukkit's code are based on obfuscated, compiled and therefore non-GPL-compliant code from Minecraft. Whatever way you slice this, it's a licence violation. VideoGameAttorney states this very clearly in his post so I don't know how you missed that.

You have similarly misinterpreted what I said about the ethics of Mojang's policy towards Bukkit, so I leave it as an exercise for you to work out what I actually said and why it's not unreasonable.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: Microsoft to buy Mojang?
Despite the fact this lawyer says its ridiculous. So, I really don't know what you're reading from this link.

Look, I don't mind that you don't have the time to read through what I said and referenced properly, but you shouldn't go around replying on that basis. Now, the situation here is this: the GPL, under which Bukkit is licensed, has very strict conditions requiring you to release the source code for all elements of the software you're providing. Bukkit, however, works on a basic level by taking sections of the released Minecraft binaries, rewriting them to add functionality, then reinserting them. This means that substantial sections of Bukkit's code are based on obfuscated, compiled and therefore non-GPL-compliant code from Minecraft. Whatever way you slice this, it's a licence violation. VideoGameAttorney states this very clearly in his post so I don't know how you missed that.

You have similarly misinterpreted what I said about the ethics of Mojang's policy towards Bukkit, so I leave it as an exercise for you to work out what I actually said and why it's not unreasonable.

I haven't misinterpreted anything,
I simply don't believe that hiring people and paying them a salary is treating them in an unethical manner.
Similarly I don't believe that any company has a moral obligation to support a team of modders or independent developers which have taken it upon themselves to improve someone else's product. Particularly if the aims of those independent developers is in conflict with the companies own goals and projects.

On the subject of minecraft code in GPL, he says that the presence of such code would NEGATE the GPL not VIOLATE it.
There's a very clear difference between something being negated and something being violated.

A license that is negated doesn't exist.

A license that is violated exists and has been transgressed upon.

As a lawyer I would think he understands that and chose one word over other with intent.  Also his post is clearly hypothetical in nature. He's not casting judgement, he's creating various scenarios or a framework of understanding which the facts may or may not fit into. The only thing that looks funny to me is Mojang claiming they own bukkit when the developers were apparently hired not to work on bukkit but on the competing minecraft API. None of the links in the reddit list gave a clear reason for why Mojang is claiming ownership of bukkit unless I missed one of them.