[Gee1337]

This is about the designations. I was looking through a couple of other threads and an old news letter and I spotted a picture of someone who was doing a "Shivan Battleship". It occured to me whether Battleship status on the designations had ever been considered? Okay, I know there are Juggernaughts, Super Destroyers and Carriers... but it was just a thought.

I think it could open up a whole new class as well... such as "pocket battleship" using the Graf Spee principle of "nothing smaller has more firepower and nothing bigger is faster".

Just a thought!

[wardog300k]

In Final Destination,i have one battleship,the GVBs Duat.
Duat is a special warship,fast as a corvette,armored as a juggernaut and armed as a superdestroyer.
The ship itself is ,,the most advanced warship ever constructed",and it is a one-of-a-kind.
Serving as a flagship of Vasudan first fleet,GVN and Vasudan species.

The original idea was to have a large Terran battleship that'll fill Terran's lack of a juggernaut.However after downloading OTT and finding Duat,i decided to dump the GTBs idea and replace it with a brand new Vasudan Flagship.

As for whole new class,it is actually a good idea.It could become like a larger destroyer,having pocket and super variations as well.

[NGTM-1R]

You mean a frigate? Because that's what a destroyer without a hanger is, according to most interpretations.

[Black Wolf]

Frigate isn't really a hangarless  destroyer. It's used more as a catchall term in FS. The Iceni fits that description, and is called a frigate, but the Hippocrates is a long way from it, and is referred to a few times as a "Medical Frigate".

Even amongst non cannon ships, the best known non BP Frigate I can think of is the Arpiya, which is a corvette with a fighterbay.

If I had to pick a definition for a Frigate in the FSverse, I'd say its a combat capable ship, larger than a cruiser, but which has a significant secondary purpose, e.g the Iceni is a command Frigate, the Hippo is a Medical Frigate, the Arpiya is a Spec Ops frigate etc. Etc.

[wardog300k]

It doesn't have to be hangarless.Corvettes are also supposed to be hangarless,however Moloch does have one.

[Phantom Hoover]

Corvettes and frigates have very similar niches, but I think frigates are conventionally a bit larger. There are only a few user made 'battleships', but they all seem to be bigger than a destroyer but smaller than a juggernaut.

[Gee1337]

Corvettes and frigates have very similar niches, but I think frigates are conventionally a bit larger. There are only a few user made 'battleships', but they all seem to be bigger than a destroyer but smaller than a juggernaut.

I was thinking this about the Corvettes in relation "pocket battleship", but I find that the corvette class tends to be name a little bit too loosely... for example Corellian Corvettes in Star Wars are designed for speed, not power and the corvettes in Homeworld geared more towards destroying fighters. Corvettes are a bit like Frigates to me, where the term is used a little bit too loose for my liking.

I know the Graf Spee was technically a heavy cruiser... and that description does seem to fit the Deimos class corvettes. I completely agree with what you say about Battleships, as they are meant to big hulky things like the dreadnaughts of WW1... designed to take the hits and give out more!

In all the great story telling and research that went into making FS2... I'm just wondering if maybe they were a bit slack when it came to naval designations.

I suppose a new idea for a mod could be a remake of FS2 (and maybe even FS1), but incorporate a few more classes into the games. It shouldn't have to change the storybut it could bring another element to game play.

[The E]

In all the great story telling and research that went into making FS2... I'm just wondering if maybe they were a bit slack when it came to naval designations.

If by "a bit slack" you mean "ignoring real-life precedent altogether", yes, they were. What FS2 calls a cruiser, RL navies would call a destroyer or frigate, FS2's corvettes are more akin to RL cruisers, and FS2's destroyers have no equivalent (Except maybe for weird ships like Russia's Kuznetsov class, which carries both a fighter complement and a bunch of antiship missiles).

[wardog300k]

And why is Kuznetsov weird?I really like the ship,and its better than Nimitz in both armament and look.

[headdie]

And why is Kuznetsov weird?I really like the ship,and its better than Nimitz in both armament and look.

Nimitz is more dedicated as a carrier.
Kuznetsov is more of a mixed role ship and in that deviates from the classic categorization as a carrier
Destroyers in FS are more akin to Battle Carriers in sci-fi generalisations in that it is both a heavy direct combat vessel and a carrier for small combat ships so the Kuznetsov with its broader mission profilie more fitting description as its role is split evenly between an air launch platform and its used of anti-ship and anti-air missiles

[The E]

And why is Kuznetsov weird?I really like the ship,and its better than Nimitz in both armament and look.

The Kuznetsov's look good, yes. Whether their particular weapons mix (which was dictated by the treaties which forbid aircraft carriers from crossing the Bosporus strait; Russia calls these ships "aviation cruisers" in order to get around that, and carrying something like a direct fire battery allows them to do so with a straight face) is more or less effective than a dedicated carrier supported by a dedicated guided missile destroyer is something I hope we're never going to find out.

[NGTM-1R]

And why is Kuznetsov weird?I really like the ship,and its better than Nimitz in both armament and look.

The primary armament of an aircraft carrier is aircraft. Anything that's not about aircraft is probably dead weight; most of Kuznetsov's deployments have been with her big missile tubes empty, in reality. (Also Kuznetsov is in pretty bad shape these days by most reports; during her Med deployment last year there was a real concern she'd suffer a serious engineering casualty, possibly even something that could sink the ship.)

[Nohiki]

In my head canon, a battleship in FreeSpace would basically be a destroyer without a fighter bay, but with either more guns, or one big gun to replace the missing strike craft. Some user made ships also refer to that design as dreadnought for some reason, although IRL that's just a name for the 'all big guns' concept - I suppose Homeworld might have influenced that? In any way, it'd be a ship you would only have few in numbers and deploy when expecting to combat a larger amount of cap ships and above, probably best suited for offensive role rather than defense, where the strike craft is quite irreplaceable. 

[Gee1337]

My idea of a battleship in FS2 would be something like the Orion, but bigger and with the beam weapons on the swivel like you get on a traditional battleship.

There would be no hanger as it would be dedicated to obliterating... say the equivalent of 2 or 3 destroyers and withstanding some heavy punishment.

It would not be juggernaut size!

@ The E... yes that is basically what I meant, but I was trying to be amiable about it!

[Trivial Psychic]

Sounds like a hanger-less super-destroyer.

[karajorma]

Ah, this thread brings back memories of the battleship threads of old.

* karajorma shudders and walks away.

[qwadtep]

On another note, the GTB/GVB/SB designation is already taken by bombers. You'd need -Bb or Bc for battleships or battlecruisers, respectively.


(Super vanilla nitpicking: CV is historically a carrier designation, but  gave it to corvettes which are basically heavy cruisers, forcing modders to designate their carriers CA, which is historically a heavy cruiser designation.  )

[Mongoose]

Honestly I like the FS definition of a "destroyer" much more than the real-world equivalent.  Something with that name sounds like it should be a massive hunk of steel that kicks ass and takes names, not a comparatively-smaller vessel.  FS2's use of "corvette" never seemed to fit all that well semantically though.

[Droid803]

FS definition of "destroyer" is kind of like the Star Wars one (ya know, Imperial Star Destroyers) - about the same size and mission profile.

(Super vanilla nitpicking: CV is historically a carrier designation, but  gave it to corvettes which are basically heavy cruisers, forcing modders to designate their carriers CA, which is historically a heavy cruiser designation.  )

Cv != CV
Ca != CA

[AdmiralRalwood]

On another note, the GTB/GVB/SB designation is already taken by bombers. You'd need -Bb or Bc for battleships or battlecruisers, respectively.

The title is referring to a "Bs" designation, not the plural of the "B" designation.