Author Topic: Space Game Junkie covering BP  (Read 6793 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline AdmiralRalwood

  • 211
  • The Cthulhu programmer himself!
    • Skype
    • Steam
    • Twitter
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Am I the only one around here who didn't hate Wing Commander Saga?  Certainly it wasn't perfect and there was a lot of room for improvement but I found it a fun campaign overall.  If one is going to simply list standalone games based on the FSO engine, it should at least get listed (I'm not even arguing for equal discussion time).
Who are you arguing with? Nobody said anything along these lines.
I think he was responding to me:
WCS was terrible.

That being said, no, you're not the only person who didn't hate WCS; on the flip-side, I'm far from the only person who didn't like it. There was a port of WCS from the fork back to main-line FSO and it didn't generate much interest simply because... nobody cared that much about it. On the plus side, WCS was a faithful adaptation of traditional Wing Commander gameplay. On the minus side, WCS was a faithful adaptation of traditional Wing Commander gameplay.

If you really want to have an in-depth conversation about the successes and failings of WCS, I can think of multiple people here who would be happy to examine it in detail with you (assuming you can't find an existing thread covering exactly that topic)... however, this thread is probably not the best place for it. I only brought it up tangentially to briefly mention that it isn't one of my go-to examples of a standalone FSO-based game.
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Codethulhu GitHub wgah'nagl fhtagn.

schrödinbug (noun) - a bug that manifests itself in running software after a programmer notices that the code should never have worked in the first place.

When you gaze long into BMPMAN, BMPMAN also gazes into you.

"I am one of the best FREDders on Earth" -General Battuta

<Aesaar> literary criticism is vladimir putin

<MageKing17> "There's probably a reason the code is the way it is" is a very dangerous line of thought. :P
<MageKing17> Because the "reason" often turns out to be "nobody noticed it was wrong".
(the very next day)
<MageKing17> this ****ing code did it to me again
<MageKing17> "That doesn't really make sense to me, but I'll assume it was being done for a reason."
<MageKing17> **** ME
<MageKing17> THE REASON IS PEOPLE ARE STUPID
<MageKing17> ESPECIALLY ME

<MageKing17> God damn, I do not understand how this is breaking.
<MageKing17> Everything points to "this should work fine", and yet it's clearly not working.
<MjnMixael> 2 hours later... "God damn, how did this ever work at all?!"
(...)
<MageKing17> so
<MageKing17> more than two hours
<MageKing17> but once again we have reached the inevitable conclusion
<MageKing17> How did this code ever work in the first place!?

<@The_E> Welcome to OpenGL, where standards compliance is optional, and error reporting inconsistent

<MageKing17> It was all working perfectly until I actually tried it on an actual mission.

<IronWorks> I am useful for FSO stuff again. This is a red-letter day!
* z64555 erases "Thursday" and rewrites it in red ink

<MageKing17> TIL the entire homing code is held up by shoestrings and duct tape, basically.

 
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
I've enjoyed WCS quite a bit, despite its shortcomings. I think it did what it set out to do perfectly, but Ralwood summed up the main problem people have with it :
Quote
On the plus side, WCS was a faithful adaptation of traditional Wing Commander gameplay. On the minus side, WCS was a faithful adaptation of traditional Wing Commander gameplay.
And as such, it doesn't really show off much of what FSO can do.

Personally, I blame the project lead for seemingly deliberatly killing off any interest in modding the game or porting it back to FSO. However, this is not the place to discuss this. If anyone wants to discuss this further, I'd be happy to do so in the WCS subforum.


To get back on topic, I though the podcast was nice enough, though as others have mentionned, it could use a bit more planning. Having only 30 minutes of gameplay footage makes it a bit hard to sell the mod, like "Hey, this mod is great, we've barely played it ourselves, but people say its good". Having some footage of WiH would have been great, as its more visually impressive and technically complex than AoA.

Kudos to Battuta for name dropping Wings of Dawn, I think it's the TC that shows off FSO best:
- TBP is very old now, so I'm guessing it's not as impressive as it used to be.

- WCS is meant to be a Wing Commander game with more shine to it.

- Diaspora is a close second : it is meant to be Battlestar Galactica, and as such it's visually very impressive, and has been a technical boon for the engine. Gameplay-wise though, its faithfulness to the show doesn't allow much opportunity for crazyness. It's solid, it's got good replay value, but given the setting, it hasn't been that far off the classic FSO formula so far.

- WoD, being free from any kind of intellectual property, has free range to do whatever it wants to do, be it in terms of story, gameplay, character, etc. It's really pushed the enveloppe, and I feel it is worth playing even if don't care much for anime tropes, or Star Control, or visual novels, or whatever else is hidden in there.

 
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
I actually have a few hours of Blue Planet under my belt, if I may defend myself:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6K1_LepsaN-kJAcKgOKmGf_nNEoFOpTe

The video I used for the podcast was merely to provide background while we talked, which I had made the day of.

As for the rest of it, the last thing I wanted was to be disrespectful of our guest, so Seth, if I was disrespectful I apologize.

That said, our stream usually wasn't as problematic as it was that night (we stream twice a week, and rarely do we have the technical problems that we had that evening), so in that respect, I'm not sure what I could've done to prevent that beforehand, since the problems would've have presented themselves until we were actually broadcasting. This is one of the downsides of doing this live, **** like this happens and then I have to fix it on the fly, if I can. I love doing it live though, so we keep trucking along.

Overall, due to the technical issues, I'll admit this isn't one of our better shows, but I'd like to think, on the whole, we do a solid job of talking to developers (because usually I'm not as distracted trying to fix stuff). I also hope we led some more people to download Blue Planet and give it a try.

 

Offline General Battuta

  • Poe's Law In Action
  • 214
  • i wonder when my postcount will exceed my iq
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
It was fun, I'd do it again. Hopefully I can work out the mic popping, I checked it pretty carefully beforehand...

 
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
I actually have a few hours of Blue Planet under my belt, if I may defend myself:
Oh I didn't mean to imply that you didn't play more than 30-ish minutes (in fact, according to youtube I watched half the recordings in that playlist), I was saying that people might get the wrong impression from short raw footage like this.

I don't know how much time you guys have to prepare these casts, but it could have been nice to edit together a background video showing off a more representative sample of the mod.

I'm just nitpiking anyway, I enjoyed listening to you guys. It's always nice to see FSO getting more coverage.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2016, 04:48:23 pm by X3N0-Life-Form »

 

Offline Spoon

  • 212
  • ヾ(´︶`♡)ノ
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
I actually have a few hours of Blue Planet under my belt, if I may defend myself:
Oh I didn't mean to imply that you didn't play more than 30-ish minutes (in fact, according to youtube I watch half the recordings in that playlist), I was saying that people might get the wrong impression from short raw footage like this.
I know I did
Urutorahappī!!

[02:42] <@Axem> spoon somethings wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> critically wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> im happy with these missions now
[02:44] <@Axem> well
[02:44] <@Axem> with 2 of them

 
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Doing a great job of making them want to cover your mod here, Spoon.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline Darius

  • Moderator
  • 211
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Enjoyed that stream very much. I always enjoy the FreeSpace podcasts as it gives an outsider's perspective just how versatile and robust the FreeSpace 2 engine is for modding.

Mirroring HerraTohtori's request: I'd like to have a listen to the recorded stream for the missing audio parts as well - let us know when an mp3 is available!

 

Offline deathspeed

  • 29
  • i can't think of a good avatar
    • Steam
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
I don't even watch Space Game Junkie (or much of anything on YouTube for that matter), but I appreciate Brian Rubin stopping in to explain things!
Maybe someday God will give you a little pink toaster of your own.

 
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Mirroring HerraTohtori's request: I'd like to have a listen to the recorded stream for the missing audio parts as well - let us know when an mp3 is available!
Oh gosh, I'm so sorry I missed that request, here it is!

https://www.spacegamejunkie.com/podcasts/sgj-podcast-174-blue-planet/

I don't even watch Space Game Junkie (or much of anything on YouTube for that matter), but I appreciate Brian Rubin stopping in to explain things!
Yay, thank you!


 

Offline procdrone

  • Formerly TheHound
  • 29
  • Balance breaker! Thats me!
    • Steam
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Spoon, beeing ignored in work even with my achievements gets me understand how you might have felt here. WoD is a wonderful total conversion, and I simply can't wait for more, your technological and logical solutions are purely amazing. Your team is doing a great job (personally im a great fan of you Spoon and Axem, here on the HLP, among other users).

However, BP has the title of beeing perfect mod out here, and its assets, solutions, etc. are often reused in other projects.
I think that WoD doesn't get its spotlight, its because its telling a totally different story, and is not linking to FS2 universe itself. Also, many people are not OK with Anime-ish esque.

Hm, I've never played Wing Commander too, so I have no word on the topic.

Podcast tho, cool beans. Was nice regardless of tech problems. additionally i would never imagine such a person to come down here and post with us :O
« Last Edit: October 12, 2016, 12:58:40 am by TheHound »
--Did it! It's RELEASED! VeniceMirror Thread--

 

Offline Cobra

  • 212
  • Snake on a Cain
    • Minecraft
    • Skype
    • Steam
    • Twitter
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Spoon, beeing ignored in work even with my achievements gets me understand how you might have felt here. WoD is a wonderful total conversion, and I simply can't wait for more, your technological and logical solutions are purely amazing. Your team is doing a great job (personally im a great fan of you Spoon and Axem, here on the HLP, among other users).

However, BP has the title of beeing perfect mod out here, and its assets, solutions, etc. are often reused in other projects.

I'm not exactly sure where you're getting "BP's assets get reused" from. In fact, pretty much everything in the mod started out as stuff cobbled together to show an advanced fleet. It wasn't until the BP project expanded that the ships and textures were upgraded and retooled into what we have now. Hell, the music is what was reused the most, and the popular ones were tracks from Final Fantasy 7: Advent Children and a Dune game sliced up and (rather masterfully by Darius) plugged into a table file.

You also can't say that a mod is "perfect" because of its solutions. Blue Planet and Wings of Dawn both do things that we really didn't think we're possible in the engine. WoD gave us freaking homing lasers and Blue Planet gave us a near-perfect iteration of capital ship command in-engine on what was basically the first try. They are examples to follow because they opened up the possibilities to do other crazy **** with the engine and don't have anything to do with how " more perfect" or "better" a mod is over another. You're basically saying that because Spoon's mod isn't copied enough, it isn't nearly as good or deserving of exposure as BP.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2016, 06:02:18 am by Cobra »
To consider the Earth as the only populated world in infinite space is as absurd as to assert that in an entire field of millet, only one grain will grow. - Metrodorus of Chios
I wept. Mysterious forces beyond my ken had reached into my beautiful mission and energized its pilots with inhuman bomb-firing abilities. I could only imagine the GTVA warriors giving a mighty KIAAIIIIIII shout as they worked their triggers, their biceps bulging with sinew after years of Ivan Drago-esque steroid therapy and weight training. - General Battuta

 

Online Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
I'm a big wing commander fan, in regular comms with tolwyn outside of HLP too (was original mod fredder back in the day).

I like WOD too as it captures that classic battle of the planets space opera thingy feel in my head.

I do youtube but never have listened to SGJ.

I'll either re watch that vid or listen to the Mp3.

Hail freespace!

 

Offline Cobra

  • 212
  • Snake on a Cain
    • Minecraft
    • Skype
    • Steam
    • Twitter
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
To consider the Earth as the only populated world in infinite space is as absurd as to assert that in an entire field of millet, only one grain will grow. - Metrodorus of Chios
I wept. Mysterious forces beyond my ken had reached into my beautiful mission and energized its pilots with inhuman bomb-firing abilities. I could only imagine the GTVA warriors giving a mighty KIAAIIIIIII shout as they worked their triggers, their biceps bulging with sinew after years of Ivan Drago-esque steroid therapy and weight training. - General Battuta

 

Online Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
You misspelled Cobraaaaaahhhhhhhh ;)

 

Offline Cobra

  • 212
  • Snake on a Cain
    • Minecraft
    • Skype
    • Steam
    • Twitter
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
You misspelled Cobraaaaaahhhhhhhh ;)

I'm fighting some Commander guy on copyright grounds. Maybe you can pull rank and help. :D
To consider the Earth as the only populated world in infinite space is as absurd as to assert that in an entire field of millet, only one grain will grow. - Metrodorus of Chios
I wept. Mysterious forces beyond my ken had reached into my beautiful mission and energized its pilots with inhuman bomb-firing abilities. I could only imagine the GTVA warriors giving a mighty KIAAIIIIIII shout as they worked their triggers, their biceps bulging with sinew after years of Ivan Drago-esque steroid therapy and weight training. - General Battuta

 

Offline Black Wolf

  • Twisted Infinities
  • 212
  • Hey! You! Get off-a my cloud!
    • Visit the TI homepage!
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Just listened. A few little technical difficulties, but nothing outrageous. Not much new stuff for established FS players, but we're not the target audience here. Pretty good overall!
TWISTED INFINITIES · SECTORGAME· FRONTLINES
Rarely Updated P3D.
Burn the heretic who killed F2S! Burn him, burn him!!- GalEmp

 
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Actually, aren't quite a few of UEF assets "borrowed" from Dimentional Eclipse mod?
Mito [PL] - Today at 8:52 PM
I was supposed to make a short presentation about basics of optical fibers and here I am, listening to Eurobeat while reading about quantum cryptography.

 

Offline -Norbert-

  • 211
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
It's the other way around.

Well... many UEF fighters and ships were done by Steve-O  before BP was a thing, but DE came after BP 1 and 2. If I'm not mistaken, Dimensional Eclipse even uses the updated versions of the "UEF" ships that were updated specifically for Blue Planet in cooperation with their original creator.

 

Offline AndrewofDoom

  • In A.D. 2366 war was beginning
  • 29
  • Permanent yuri goggles.
    • Skype
    • Steam
    • Twitter
Re: Space Game Junkie covering BP
Actually, aren't quite a few of UEF assets "borrowed" from Dimentional Eclipse mod?

We originally used stuff from BP, which in turn was partially remade from what Steve-O had made. We later, in turn, remade the ships that more or less fit the form (Rhea, Impervious, Block 1 Tethys , Block 2 & 3 Tethys). BP, in turn, took our remade ones and used the Impervious.

Reuseception I say.

(Yes I'm alive)
My Efforts:
SF Knight

20:08:19   AndrewofDoom: Though I find it mildly disturbing that a loli is giggling to mass destruction.
20:10:01   Spoon: I find it mildly arrousing
20:10:07   AndrewofDoom: Woah
20:10:15   Spoon: sound like my kind of loli
20:10:21   Spoon: and im not even a lolicon