[Mongoose]

4 I just flat-out disagree with. Luke's last stand was one of the best moments in the entire franchise.

[The E]

Really? You don't like his persona?
Damn Germans, no sense of humor 

That's a thing that has changed in my viewing habits, I suppose. I watched the original Plinkett reviews about the Prequels and remember liking them, but then I was also watching a lot of TGWTG and similar content at the time -- Back then, heavily persona-based reviews were a ~thing~, it's what the format of online video essay was at the time.

Nowadays, while I am not averse to personas in general (hbomberguy ftw), I much prefer a more straightforward delivery (Lindsay Ellis, Mikey Neumann, Dan Olson et al).

1. The film overall felt overstuffed

A fair criticism. Not one I share, but it's a legitimate criticism.

2. The script suits a comedy film more than an action adventure

This is entirely subjective, of course, but what exactly is wrong with that?

3. Leia should've done the hyperspace kamikaze in stead of purple haired lady

In retrospect, knowing what we know now, that could have been a good moment, but I can certainly understand the production constraints that led to that not happening.

4. Leave Luke out of the film after Rey leaves his planet

**** no. Luke's arc in this film was one of its highlights, and his last stand was the best Jedi Philosophy in action moment in the entire franchise thus far.

5. End the film just as Kylo asks Rey to join him

That would be a very different film. Like, making that choice has repercussions for the entire plot.

6. The myriad of fridge logic, and there was a lot.

This is an important video on this topic

7.  Tonal dissonance.  The aforementioned awkward comedy.  Rey going through traumatic arc similar to Luke in ESB and still being "Yippie! shooting TIEs in the Falcon is fun" after it all.  The fact that the film ends on a cheery note despite the Resistance basically being wiped out to 12 survivors in a stock light freighter.

You know how you can get beaten down by life and depression and **** and ride a momentary high of doing something that feels good, if only for a moment?
Also, let's not forget something here: Rey's arc is actually quite different from Luke's. Yes, Luke does defy Yoda and heads off to Bespin. But while Luke does suffer grievous injury and is shaken by the revelations he gets, he doesn't fail. He achieves what he sets out to do. Rey on the other hand (and every other main character, including the villains) resoundly fails. She doesn't get Luke back in the action in the way she was hoping she would. She doesn't manage to turn Kylo to the light. She can't stand up to Snoke. In TLJ (unlike other films in the franchise), characters are allowed to fail and learn from their failures. It's kind of a theme in the film.

8.  TFA was generally criticized for being a psuedo copy of ANH.  On the surface TLJ subverted a lot of tropes.  However, when you break it down beat by beat its almost formulaic in taking the plot points of ESB and simply doing the opposite.

And this is a bad thing?

IMHO, TFA being a retread of ANH isn't a criticism - It's a statement of fact, of authorial intent. It is a necessary component of what TFA needed to be.

9.  Not actually focusing on a particular storyline.  Instead of having an A storyline: Rey/Luke/Kylo with the space chase as the B storyline we have more storylines than needed and none get the focus to standout.

It's almost as if these new films are actually ensemble films.
Of course, it's inconceivable that a Star Wars film would be an ensemble film; after all, it is written that Star Wars shall only have 2 or 3 main characters. It's the LAW.
(Or, with less snark: I think the Plinkett reviews are much more about what the writers of the review want Star Wars to be than what Star Wars actually is)

If you can get past the dumb persona the Plinket Reviews of Star Wars films actually do provide a pretty in depth analysis of the content.  It's not the typical "Wah Wah they ruined my SW" crap that seems to be drowning my YouTube feed.

Really?

I mean, going back to their prequel reviews, that's pretty much the tone that I got from them. While there are legitimate criticisms to be levelled at the production of the Prequels, I get the feeling that a large part of the objection to the plot comes from a feeling of betrayal that the Jedi (to take an example) weren't the ultimate good guys that Obi-Wan described them to be in ANH.

Don't get me wrong, the prequels are still bad films, but I for one think that they say a lot more interesting stuff about Star Wars than what they get credit for.

[Firesteel]

1. The film overall felt overstuffed

A fair criticism. Not one I share, but it's a legitimate criticism.

I think for the runtime, I think having more time for the characters would have helped and condensing the Poe and Finn/Rose stuff into a single arc might have helped it feel less bloated (for me anyway). Or just embrace the ensemble nature and allow more screen time to everyone to make the Poe and Finn/Rose stuff feel less one note.

If you can get past the dumb persona the Plinket Reviews of Star Wars films actually do provide a pretty in depth analysis of the content.  It's not the typical "Wah Wah they ruined my SW" crap that seems to be drowning my YouTube feed.

Really?

I mean, going back to their prequel reviews, that's pretty much the tone that I got from them. While there are legitimate criticisms to be levelled at the production of the Prequels, I get the feeling that a large part of the objection to the plot comes from a feeling of betrayal that the Jedi (to take an example) weren't the ultimate good guys that Obi-Wan described them to be in ANH.

Don't get me wrong, the prequels are still bad films, but I for one think that they say a lot more interesting stuff about Star Wars than what they get credit for.

I generally agree with you here E. The whole Jedi hubris angle was good, just badly executed because there was still this need to keep everything black and white because it's Star Wars. I'd say the sequels are actually doing the Jedi/Sith hypocrisy thing better (at least in execution).




Still not a fan of the opening space battle

[General Battuta]

Whatever this movie’s flaws (which we’ve all talked about in this thread before - Canto Bight boring, Finn/Phasma fight dumb) it contains so many genuinely new and great scenes that I can’t rate it less than one of the best movies in the franchise. It actually moves forward from the prequels to say something about Jedi and the Force, instead of returning to the comfort of the OT. Rewatching it recently I found the first half kind of a chore but the back half is just incredible.

So many of the complaints I read are CinemaSins level pedantry. Why didn’t the characters do X? Why is the First Order so angry?? Leia did something we’ve never seen before!!! Why doesn’t everyone just hyperspace ram???? But the movie has answers for these questions if you stop and think about it; the reason they aren’t explicitly laid out in dialogue is because movies are *heavily* edited to remove all unnecessary content and to try to keep the scenes flowing. Exposition is the first thing to go. (Thus Snoke’s background is cut - it’s broadly interesting but doesn’t really matter to this story). You can’t have someone say “It’s lucky Leia trained so hard to defend and protect herself with the Force!” or “The Supremacy is such a huge target, and the Raddus is so massive, that a Hail Mary kamikaze actually has a chance to work!” And you don’t need to because the film shows you these things instead of telling you, and trusts you to say “Since I know X must be true, I wonder why it’s true?” On this note the exposition about hyperspace tracking is bad and should’ve been rewritten to just “The tracker is so big it has to be on the Supremacy, and the only way to take it out is an inside job.”

Or in other words: Bravo Rian, I love you

[Firesteel]

Battuta, that second paragraph could have been "implication is dead, thanks pedants"

The force and Jedi stuff was excellent (and I wanted more of that if nothing else) since it did indeed take what was badly executed in the prequels and actually turned it into what it should have been all along.

[Buckshee Rounds]

You know how you can get beaten down by life and depression and **** and ride a momentary high of doing something that feels good, if only for a moment?

As plausible and "realistic" as that is, the Rey-gunner scene still feels really out of place and it was one of those things I noticed while watching the film. Plinkett's right when he says that it feels more like a scene from earlier in the film rather than the climax to a bitter and hard fought escape. It's not a film-breaker by any means, but the little things do add up and it's not pedantic to point this out. It makes it difficult for me to know what I'm supposed to be feeling at this point in the film.

Also, let's not forget something here: Rey's arc is actually quite different from Luke's. Yes, Luke does defy Yoda and heads off to Bespin. But while Luke does suffer grievous injury and is shaken by the revelations he gets, he doesn't fail. He achieves what he sets out to do. Rey on the other hand (and every other main character, including the villains) resoundly fails. She doesn't get Luke back in the action in the way she was hoping she would. She doesn't manage to turn Kylo to the light. She can't stand up to Snoke. In TLJ (unlike other films in the franchise), characters are allowed to fail and learn from their failures. It's kind of a theme in the film.

While I agree that it's potentially an interesting avenue for the franchise to explore it just wasn't well-executed in the film. The characters come off as inept and somewhat buffoonish, at least from my pov. ESB established the Empire as a formidable foe with an inflexible resolve to eradicate the rebels and our heroes. In the TLJ, the First Order are no less successful in achieving their goals, I mean they virtually eliminated the Resistance entirely, but the screaming, frothing-at-the-mouth officers and lack of composure serve to make them come across as being less threatening than they should. I've seen a lot of comparisons between General silly english guy (can't remember the name) and Grand Moff Tarkin for instance. Or Piett. They had that creepy Nazi orderliness down to a tee.

Snoke at least came across as daunting and powerful, he was a credible villain. General silly english guy, Phasma and Kylo just don't strike me as credible villains that our heroes have to watch out for. This film manages to make both the heroes and villains fail utterly (to echo yourself). It could've worked, but for me at least it just makes everyone seem ****ing incompetent. I mean what is Phasma supposed to learn from her encounters with Finn? Kylo seemed like he turned a page only to go back to more or less exactly what he'd been doing since TFA. Noone's changed, noone's moved forward. Finn almost did, I feel like his bits with Rose - where she points out the unethical **** going on - was a further evolution of his character and another step away from just another dumb, evil storm trooper. I guess you could characterise his attempted sacrifice as being part of this?

The thematic stuff seems kind of inconsistent. Yoda and Luke seem to be suggesting that the whole dark side light side dynamic is no longer relevant (or that it never was? idk) and the Kylo-Rey bit aboard Snoke's ship rams this home really well (probably my favourite bit of the film tbh). But then we go right back to the light vs dark. Or if we really want to take the double dealing of arms into the equation - grey vs grey. Or light grey vs dark grey? Which ****ing colours belong to which?! I do not the evens.

Honestly TLJ isn't all that bad I think it just doesn't get its ideas and themes across in a way that's accessible for the audience.

[Luis Dias]

Couldn't make it two minutes in without getting tired of his bull**** persona.

Is there a summary of his arguments somewhere?

Oh that's a shame. It's probably the only big critical video of TLJ that I enjoyed, because it never comes from a place of "I'm ENRAGED THIS EXISTS" kind of idiotic tone and attitude that permeates all other critical videos, and instead he uses his persona to do a more objective criticism of the movie. It ends by praising Ryan Johnson for at least trying to do something different here.

I don't think it's "CinemaSins" level of criticism in any way, I do agree that the plot follows a kind of four C plots, instead of going a simpler A + B plot. Just this criticism alone is something lightyears above anything that CS could ever even remember saying. That some of these go nowhere "might be the point of them" in some level, but they are contrived, they mesh in convoluted ways and they feel hacked, rather than organic.

Many of the things that almost work in TLJ are great in concept. For instance, Rose saving Finn from his death wish suicide run and her sentence is great. But I can't fault most people when they feel cheated, because it's just not that well executed. It rather felt dangerous and almost betraying. "Oh stealing a kiss, so beautiful", all the while the rebel base door is cracked open.

Having said all of this, I do agree TLJ went for many great directions and did lots of great things. But Plinkett is correct in much of what he says as well.

[Aesaar]

I've come around to liking how buffoonish and bumbling the First Order is because it feels so much like what the Nazis were compared to Imperial Germany.

A bunch of frequently stupid people ranting about the good old days they were never a part of, who have no idea how to run a country or an army, leading a bunch of old officers only in it because what else are they going to do?

I just wish we had more character interactions between Hux and old officers like the dreadnought's captain.  I enjoyed how sick of Hux's **** that guy obviously was.

[The E]

The characters come off as inept and somewhat buffoonish, at least from my pov. ESB established the Empire as a formidable foe with an inflexible resolve to eradicate the rebels and our heroes. In the TLJ, the First Order are no less successful in achieving their goals, I mean they virtually eliminated the Resistance entirely, but the screaming, frothing-at-the-mouth officers and lack of composure serve to make them come across as being less threatening than they should. I've seen a lot of comparisons between General silly english guy (can't remember the name) and Grand Moff Tarkin for instance. Or Piett. They had that creepy Nazi orderliness down to a tee.

You know, this is something along the lines of Plinkett being pissed off at the prequel Jedis not being what he thought they would be. That, at least IMHO, is not a mistake the film made. If the First Order comes across as pathetic and less intimidating, less implacable than the Empire (despite still being powerful and definitely harmful), then I think the better reading here is to assume that that's what the film wanted to tell us, not that the film wanted to show them as equal to the Empire of old but failed at it.

By giving us a POV character who has to come to terms with his own patheticness, TLJ tells a more compelling story about the bad guys than the original trilogy did.

Snoke at least came across as daunting and powerful, he was a credible villain. General silly english guy, Phasma and Kylo just don't strike me as credible villains that our heroes have to watch out for. This film manages to make both the heroes and villains fail utterly (to echo yourself). It could've worked, but for me at least it just makes everyone seem ****ing incompetent. I mean what is Phasma supposed to learn from her encounters with Finn? Kylo seemed like he turned a page only to go back to more or less exactly what he'd been doing since TFA. Noone's changed, noone's moved forward.

Nope. All of the primary POV characters changed (except Phasma, where I do agree that the films so far have done both the character and the actress a massive disservice).

Finn almost did, I feel like his bits with Rose - where she points out the unethical **** going on - was a further evolution of his character and another step away from just another dumb, evil storm trooper. I guess you could characterise his attempted sacrifice as being part of this?

Finn's arc is about him coming to terms with the fact that, when you are faced with a great evil, you can't run away without suffering moral injury. All throughout TFA and most of TLJ, his only goal is to get away from the First Order, as fast and far as possible. Him taking a stand against that evil because it's the right thing to do and stepping into the role of actual, bona-fide hero is a massive shift in the character.
Rey's arc is about her needing to come to terms with her own past and her expectations for her future. For a long time, the hope that her parents would one day come and rescue her was propelling her forward. Then, when TFA happened, it was the idea of becoming a Jedi under the tutelage of the great Luke Skywalker. Now, after TLJ, she knows that the only one who can define her role and who can actually make things better for herself and the people she cares about is .... herself. Hers is a story of a person who thought she was self-sufficient, only to realize that she built her foundations on unstable ground; she now has to build new, stronger foundations for herself.
Poe's arc is about him learning that the capability to do great heroics and the capability to lead are two very different things. His is a story of a young, brave, capable officer learning what command responsibility actually is.
Kylo's arc mirrors Rey's: He, too, has to figure out who he is after his foundations have been knocked out from under him.

[Snarks]

Most of the points from Plinket's review pretty much echos the same critiques posted here.

None of the character arcs are inherently bad, but their execution leaves room to be desired.

I would summarize the chief issue as the character arcs not being aligned with the narrative arc for the audience itself. So the reason why the viewers are suppose to care about the characters is that the film convinces us to align our narrative experience with that of the character. This is true for most plot driven mediums, whether it be books or games. The one exception in TLJ is how the audience views Holdo because it was intended that we distrust her character in favor of Poe, but Poe as a character was so poorly executed that he seems a greater threat than the villains in the First Order.

In this aspect, TLJ is a mixed bag. There are clearly people here whose narrative experiences matches what the film intended, but there'a also quite a lot of us who felt otherwise.

I've come around to liking how buffoonish and bumbling the First Order is because it feels so much like what the Nazis were compared to Imperial Germany.

A bunch of frequently stupid people ranting about the good old days they were never a part of, who have no idea how to run a country or an army, leading a bunch of old officers only in it because what else are they going to do?

I just wish we had more character interactions between Hux and old officers like the dreadnought's captain.  I enjoyed how sick of Hux's **** that guy obviously was.

While that aspect may very well be correct, the rest of it doesn't quite line up with reality. In TLJ, this seemingly incompetent First Order apparently destroyed The New Republic and The Resistance. By comparison, Nazi Germany was pretty much defeated by 1942, arguably doomed to fail once they decided to continue a war of aggression after The Fall of France. In short, I need to be convinced that The New Republic was France in WW2 for me to accept this short of analogy, but the new trilogy hasn't quite done that. And so it just comes off as being whacky.

[karajorma]

Perhaps you've never heard of that Hitler guy. Rumour has it that he was pretty wacky.

[Buckshee Rounds]

Nope. All of the primary POV characters changed (except Phasma, where I do agree that the films so far have done both the character and the actress a massive disservice).

Finn almost did, I feel like his bits with Rose - where she points out the unethical **** going on - was a further evolution of his character and another step away from just another dumb, evil storm trooper. I guess you could characterise his attempted sacrifice as being part of this?

Finn's arc is about him coming to terms with the fact that, when you are faced with a great evil, you can't run away without suffering moral injury. All throughout TFA and most of TLJ, his only goal is to get away from the First Order, as fast and far as possible. Him taking a stand against that evil because it's the right thing to do and stepping into the role of actual, bona-fide hero is a massive shift in the character.
Rey's arc is about her needing to come to terms with her own past and her expectations for her future. For a long time, the hope that her parents would one day come and rescue her was propelling her forward. Then, when TFA happened, it was the idea of becoming a Jedi under the tutelage of the great Luke Skywalker. Now, after TLJ, she knows that the only one who can define her role and who can actually make things better for herself and the people she cares about is .... herself. Hers is a story of a person who thought she was self-sufficient, only to realize that she built her foundations on unstable ground; she now has to build new, stronger foundations for herself.
Poe's arc is about him learning that the capability to do great heroics and the capability to lead are two very different things. His is a story of a young, brave, capable officer learning what command responsibility actually is.
Kylo's arc mirrors Rey's: He, too, has to figure out who he is after his foundations have been knocked out from under him.

I'll admit to only seeing the film once so I probably missed a lot of the character moments that defined their arcs. You're probably right that it's not fair to say that none of them changed (I tend towards hyperbole, forgive me), for me it just seemed like the characters were somewhat stagnant asides from Finn and Rey to a lesser extent. It seemed like Kylo had the beginnings of an arc that simply led him back to where he began in the first place, which I found frustrating.

While that aspect may very well be correct, the rest of it doesn't quite line up with reality. In TLJ, this seemingly incompetent First Order apparently destroyed The New Republic and The Resistance. By comparison, Nazi Germany was pretty much defeated by 1942, arguably doomed to fail once they decided to continue a war of aggression after The Fall of France. In short, I need to be convinced that The New Republic was France in WW2 for me to accept this short of analogy, but the new trilogy hasn't quite done that. And so it just comes off as being whacky.

I don't really mind that the New Republic has virtually no impact on the story, like the Imperial Senate from the first SW. Tbh, I prefer that they try something new and steer away from WW2 analogues, since it's been done to death and back.

[Mongoose]

Just saw this interesting article based on a video essay which may or may not have been posted in here before.  The article actually gets into Kylo's arc, which the video doesn't cover.

[Snarks]

Just saw this interesting article based on a video essay which may or may not have been posted in here before.  The article actually gets into Kylo's arc, which the video doesn't cover.

Something about focusing on gendertyped characters and roles (even when it's for the point of being subverted) rubs me the wrong way. When historical accuracy isn't a factor and the work itself doesn't make gender a significant factor within its own canon, I just ignore the sex of the characters entirely. And for the most part, gender doesn't seem to be a major factor in the Star Wars universe (although the original trilogy had this implication due to their casting choice). It feels to me to be more liberating and empowering to humans of any gender if these traditional gender roles just get ignored. The article's focus on male archetypes being influenced by woman reminds me of the archetype of the wise matron (the grandma role that many actresses often find themselves cast into after they've aged), which as far as I can tell, was played straight. And while Kylo Ren might subvert the trope of men just needing a woman's passion, it does not subvert the archetype of the wise matron, whose advice and wisdom need not be taken for the role to be fulfilled.

What I think bugs me is that there are usually fewer distinct roles for women to play over men. I recall reading an article written by an actress (I can't recall the title or name at this point) who cited that actresses have to get their career moving in their twenties and thirties before they reach that age where the only notable casting options that remain for them would be the old grandma role. By comparison, male actors have been able to play many more roles because there's virtually always room for men of any age to be on the screen. I want to see more female characters in the spotlight, not just as a pretty face or a wise matron, but with all the nuanced flaws of characters that make us endeared to them. And in the space of science fiction, the constraints for gender roles is much less limiting, especially in a work such as Star Wars.

[The E]

I remember Mika earlier being really very insistent that the falling number of Bluray sales for TLJ compared to TFA is some sort of commentary on TLJ's quality as an entertainment product.

Turns out, it's the highest selling Bluray of 2018, half a million units ahead of Black Panther.

[Luis Dias]

Well 3 million is still way below 5.5 of TFA, so they still have their innocuous point.

Regarding McIntosh's essay on how Star Wars subverts our expectations regarding men's and women's roles, it's a good video essay that got people like Thunderf00t in a pickle or something (because, ironies of ironies, McIntosh is actually a successful vlogger now), and while I sympathise with the notion about how we should just "ignore the hell of out genres, specially in scifi", we have to deal with actual reality, with the pre-existing themes and tropes, and that video does that, I think, quite well, in regards to which how some well worn out scifi genderized tropes were subverted in TLJ, and that this is what drove that reactionary part of youtube incredibly mad.

I think he has a point, and I think Plinkett also has a point, especially in that 30 second video of their metaphor for how Rian "subverts" Star Wars.

It drives the point home that the movie is a kind of a brute diamond still in need of a sharp tool to refine it. It chooses well to subvert, it chooses the targets correctly, it makes most decisions right, but it does not work sufficiently well to make a good portion of your audience to go with you along with it. If you just wnat to satisfy your audience, you have to be merely competent, but to try and subvert all the themes and tropes and whatnots, you would have to be way more than that just to get the more curmudgeonic audience to go along with you.

I liken it to a magic trick. Ok, you have poured wine into the table laughing. Now show me how that was actually not just a table, and the wine got into the glass anyways, somehow. If that's too much to ask, then don't try to make magic tricks. If you can't go all the way, don't even try.

To that end, it may not have helped that you start the movie with a stupid phone prank joke that just goes for too long.

[StarSlayer]

There are some great ideas in this film, taking Force Users to task for holding the galaxy hostage in a millennia long seesaw between Light and Dark, the Luke/Rey/Kylo dynamic, the stress of a prolonged engagement eroding military command, an industrial complex in the background playing both sides.  I just felt there was additional refinement needed to polish some of these ideas and filtering out the stupid crap shoehorned into the film.
 
Even just skipping Space B 17s and having the regular Rebel snub fighter mix would have made for a much better initial sequence, they bag the Dreadnought but the attack decimates their snubbies.  Now when Kylo comes calling the Resistance can't fend him off because they don't have enough fighters left for a decent CAP.  That provides a tangible "Poe you frakked up and here were the direct consequences" moment. Instead somebody wanted "Memphis Belle in space" and for added drama they can only drop their bombs via a TV remote, so the belly gunner needs to run up and down the ladder!  Poe takes a risk and trades a dozen tactically inflexible bombers for a multi kilometer long Fleet Killer Dreadnought which they would have had to deal with anyway during the Space Chase.  If you asked RAF Bomber Command in WW2 if they'd sacrifice a dozen Lancasters to bag the Tirpitz they would not have blinked an eye.  Compounded when Holdo takes the piss out of him for being a stupid risky flyboy, then she enacts a risky plan and it gets almost everyone killed.

I dunno, I just feel like this needed a couple rounds of proof reading and it would have mitigated most of the frustration I felt watching it and elevated it to being a great film for me.

[Grizzly]

Yeah those two posts do summarize how I feel about the film.

I did like the big dumb bombers though, I like that the rebels in an age of long range precision strikes with torpedoes only have carpet bombers remaining.

[Det. Bullock]

Yeah those two posts do summarize how I feel about the film.

I did like the big dumb bombers though, I like that the rebels in an age of long range precision strikes with torpedoes only have carpet bombers remaining.

And it's not even that new a thing to have attacks by ridiculously vulnerable craft, in TIE Fighter (which I have been replaying in the last fest weeks) both empire and rebels sometimes use troop transports for heavy warhead attacks, and they are basically sitting ducks that make the Y-Wings look like A-wings in comparison.

[Luis Dias]

There's also the "Luke almost kills Ben and he fights back moment", which was subpar-ly written for me.

The way to tell the story from Luke's point of view is still unsympathetic towards him, and drives the point home that he is still very much a freaked-out moron that behaves like a 20 year old scared little **** every time the DARK SIDE turns up. It needed more. I'll give you an example of what I have in mind, despite the fact that I'm not a writer, and I'd be a terrible one.

Imagine he tells Rey his side of the story.

LUKE: It wasn't like that at all. One night, I suddenly woke up feeling a tremendous power in the camp. A dark power.

Then you see what he's telling. A student (youngling?) comes up to him with both his hands on his throat, while he is still getting out of bed. He was being choked up by an invisible force. Luke frees him, and sits him on a rock or something, comforts him hearwarmingly in a second and quickly gets his light saber and walks out of his hut, hand out in search for the source of this great dark power, scared and enraged for his students.

REY: Snoke!
LUKE: (nods)

First, he goes to a hut where he knows most of his students lie. They're alright. Then he goes for the dark side. He gets to another hut, light saber turned on in hand, opens the door and only finds someone lying down, covered in a mantle. The hut is filled with Dark Force "magic" (how you'd convey this on the screen is up to good writers and screenwriters, not me). He tensely goes to it, only to see Ben's face. With horror and surprise, he is taken aback, and then Ben wakes up and defends himself with all his might.

Now, this rendition is not perfect. But I'd argue would be better. Again, like previous posts have said, TLJ would much improve for this sort of small rewritings that would still maintain the intentions and structure and themes and whatnots, but make the audience go with you.