Author Topic: Saga-Modding  (Read 17158 times)

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OK, then Aginor I'm afraid I can't help.
May the Force be with you

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
  • 210
The collisions aren't really the problem, I think I already have a solution for that. My problem is that in most cases the ships don't try to fly into the hangar at all or do it in some strange way, far off the waypoint path.
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
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Ok, in the last try I got two ships to land at least, the key was to disable dynamic goals, making the AI even more stupid.
I think the problem is that they keep missing their waypoints and thus turn around to touch it.

My next approach will be to delete the waypoint route and give them single points to fly to. I will check if they are near them and then change the waypoint manually. Maybe that will work.
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline Dragon

  • Citation needed
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  • The sky is the limit.
IIRC, this is fixed in normal SCP builds, but Saga might not have this. I can't wait for the source code release.

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
  • 210
I "solved" the problem like this:
There are four waypoints in the hangar bay, called "parking". As soon as one of the ships reaches the waypoint that I put directly in front of the fighter bay door it "snaps" on its parking place using the set-position SEXP. I also use face-object to align the ship neatly.
I know that doesn't look perfect, but I made sure that the player is busy looking somewhere else anyway, so it works until I find something better. I think I will finish this mission tomorrow and then I have half of my mini campaign complete. :)
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
  • 210
Hi again!
I have some questions:

- It is possible to determine which kind of missile is on a secondary bank? I know I can set it, but it seems I can't read it.
- Is it possible to somehow read the energy status?
- is it possible to detect when the player gives orders (form on my wing for example) via the comm menu? I know I can monitor keys via events, but is that also possible when the player clicks?
- Is it possible to detect other keystrokes except those I can pick in FRED? I would like to have a shortcut for a function but I can't choose it from the menu in FRED.

Thanks in advance!
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline karajorma

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    • Karajorma's Freespace FAQ
- It is possible to determine which kind of missile is on a secondary bank? I know I can set it, but it seems I can't read it.

Use the has-secondary-weapon SEXP. If you need to know which weapon it has

when-argument
-any-of
--List of Weapons
-has-secondary-weapon
--Ship Name
--Weapon Bank
--<argument>
-Modify-Variable
--SecondaryBank[<None>]
--<argument>

Quote
- Is it possible to somehow read the energy status?

weapon-recharge-pct

Quote
- is it possible to detect when the player gives orders (form on my wing for example) via the comm menu? I know I can monitor keys via events, but is that also possible when the player clicks?

Query-orders (don't use the order SEXP, it's ****!)

Quote
- Is it possible to detect other keystrokes except those I can pick in FRED? I would like to have a shortcut for a function but I can't choose it from the menu in FRED.


Nope. You'd need to use scripting for that.
Karajorma's Freespace FAQ. It's almost like asking me yourself.

[ Diaspora ] - [ Seeds Of Rebellion ] - [ Mind Games ]

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
  • 210
Thanks for you reply, karajorma!

I think I was a bit unclear about the energy thing.
I found the weapons energy but I did mean the energy distribution.

The topic is the cloaking of the player flyable Strakha fighter which I have implemented using four events, three variables and a ghost. It works mostly although I had to do some funny things to make sure weapons and shields and stuff doesn't reset when cloaking or decloaking. I solved that problems by either storing stuff in variables (for example the number of missiles) or by copying stuff to a ghost and copying them back after the model change.

I just have some little problems left now:
- energy distribution resets while cloaking and decloaking
- the player can only use "Fang" missiles because all four Strakha models have it as default
- looping afterburner sound when using the afterburner while cloaking. Dunno why yet.

Wingmen are a totally different topic. For those I plan to use the old events Saga uses and change them a bit. The goal is that the wingmen cloak when they are ordered to form on the player. At the moment they default to uncloaked. Also AI Strakhas have an unlimited amount of missiles, so when the AI is good (wingmen have to be rather good) they fire a lot of missiles, so I have to fix that like I did for the player.
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
  • 210
Is the "has-secondary-weapon" SEXP new?
I can't find it either in the wiki or in Saga's FRED.

I fear it might have been introduced after Saga's branching.
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline karajorma

  • King Louie - Jungle VIP
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    • Karajorma's Freespace FAQ
That is possible. I wasn't looking at WCS FRED.
Karajorma's Freespace FAQ. It's almost like asking me yourself.

[ Diaspora ] - [ Seeds Of Rebellion ] - [ Mind Games ]

 

Offline Aginor

  • Spelljammer
  • 210
No problem, this is only a very minor issue since the Strakha does carry Fang FF missiles most of the time anyway.

Your other hints were most useful. I wonder what I'd do without you and General Battuta, you guys rock!   :)

That leaves me with the excessive use of missiles by the AI. I think I might introduce a special Strakha wingman AI....
...or I'll just do the same as for the player, using a variable to store the number of missiles for each fighter.

At the moment cloaking for the player works with 5 events, a ghost and 3 variables.
For AI Strakhas that aren't wingmen I need 6 events and 4 variables.
For AI Strakhas that are wingmen I need 10 events (the 6 from above + some more for the controls) and 2-6 variables.
Member of the Scooby Doo model Fanclub "verticies and splines are the medium and he is the artist."

 

Offline Dragon

  • Citation needed
  • 212
  • The sky is the limit.
And in the main branch, you can do this using about half as many events and (probably) no variables at all...
I really can't wait for the Saga source code release.

 
Errrr, why?  There isn't that much that FSO could use from WCS (correct me if I'm wrong!), and if you wanted an updated version of WCS with all the lovely features FSO has MatthTheGeek has started work on Wing Commander Open, a port of WCS to FSO.
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 
The New Cloaking Shader code.
May the Force be with you

 
Cloaking shaders are a recent FSO development thanks to Valathil, not a WCS development.  WCS still uses change-ship-class for their cloaking.  At this point I haven't heard anything from the WCS team about them adding FSO features to WCS now that they've released, and I'm not sure there's all that much of their code that the SCP would find useful.  At this point all the source code release by the WCS team would do is satisfy the terms of the original release by Volition.
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 
Dragon means that in the main FSO code base it could be done faster than in WCS.
May the Force be with you

 
Yeah, but I don't think many features from the main FSO code trunk will make it to WCS.  The whole point of them branching was that they wanted their own codebase separate from the awesome SCP features.
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 

Offline Dragon

  • Citation needed
  • 212
  • The sky is the limit.
I meant that once WCS releases it's source code, it's most important features will hopefully be ported to SCP. That would allow WCS to be adopted for the SCP builds, which would fix a lot of annoying things, including some really bad design decisions taken by the team and lack of cutting-edge SCP features. Also, it'd allow use of some neat WCS features in SCP mods.

 
What most important features?  You're the one saying WCS has them, so what does WCS have that current SCP cannot do?  If there are any extremely important features, will they break compatibility with the retail game and violate one of the cardinal rules of the SCP?

Also, the WCS team does not want to use the main branch of FSO at all, otherwise they wouldn't have forked.  For some reason unfathomable to me, they want to use a separate codebase with separate features that does not use the latest optimizations, features, and SEXPs of the SCP.

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=63607.msg1353055#msg1353055

According to that WCS forked back in February of 2010.  Unless they have been extremely studiously keeping up with SCP features they've missed out on a ton and may have wildly conflicting code, especially since they may have broken Rule #1 of the SCP and altered retail behavior.
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 

Offline MatthTheGeek

  • Captain Obvious
  • 212
  • Frenchie McFrenchface
If there are any extremely important features, will they break compatibility with the retail game and violate one of the cardinal rules of the SCP?
There's always a way to implement features without breaking SCP rule #1. This is why we have tables and command-line flags to turn stuff on and off.

It is not, however, always easy or practical to do so.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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