[Kazan]

DirectX won't be our prefered renderer - we'll prefabbly use OpenGL because then GLUT package could theorectically allow us to write _one_ GUI and have it work on linux and windows

[Kazan]

good ideas inqui

[LtNarol]

dude, that would be awesome if you could do this, unfortunately, i can't help much.  I can only offer a few suggestions:

-use pofs for models
-use pcx for textures
-create a program similar to fred2 to create the missions for the new engine (or just support the fs2 and fc2 formats)
-make the engine modable through use of ini files, this way people can add to the engine's capabilities.  In fact, i suggest you rely as much on inis as possible and make the engine itself just a program capable of reading and executing whatever the inis tell it to do.
-use a format like vp that allows files to be neatly packaged and still read by the engine without unpacking (if you can do this with the zip format, that would be even better).

I have no idea how many of these are feasible, but these are suggestions for changes i would want to make could i write such a thing.

[Kazan]

Narol: the intention is to have it be -perfectly- compatable with the previous game engine, or as close to it as possible

ie - install, drop new executeable [perhaps a few additional files in] and you'll have it running

[Warlock]

Originally posted by Kazan


yes there are - but only when it comes to MVE - and since we don't charge for it Volition won't care that we use their file formats - vps and pofs

Yea....get that in writting and legally noterized.

Or even IF they've said "oh yea sure have fun" a year from now it's a lawsuit and you get the shaft.

Copyrights can be interesting things you know. And you can't claim a rebuilt game engine as a MOD really.

Besides....Volition can't legally allow dick...it's NOT their game...it belongs to Interplay ...hence the entire no FS3 , no source, no story details.

IF it was up to V...we wouldn't NEED to rebuild anything...they said they WANTED to give us the source code.

[Kamikaze]

So perhaps you should make the game "understand" vps and whatnot and "use" entirely different data types
That would prevent lawsuits, no?

[Warlock]

Originally posted by Kamikaze
So perhaps you should make the game "understand" vps and whatnot and "use" entirely different data types
That would prevent lawsuits, no?  

Hmm no

Herc 2 ...copyrighted

Vp...Copyrighted

the ENTIRE game is copyrighted.

Now you could make a new engine that has completely unrelated ships, weapons, effects, storyline, etc etc and be safe....but then what would be the point eh?

Honestly I think this is WAY too big of a project for anyone here....when we see a game campaign and or mod that can't get completed ...how could we think an entire rebuilding of the game itself would ever be finished?

(Not directed at ANY specific campaign or mod...but we all have seen several just fade out)

[Corsair]

Originally posted by Warlock
Honestly I think this is WAY too big of a project for anyone here....when we see a game campaign and or mod that can't get completed ...how could we think an entire rebuilding of the game itself would ever be finished?

(Not directed at ANY specific campaign or mod...but we all have seen several just fade out)

Agreed. Many that haven't even faded out have lost their track and have slowed to a standstill. They aren't moving anywhere fast. This project is definitely too big for anybody seeing as how we can't finish most of out campaigns. Maybe if we could all physically get together to work on it it would be okay, but we can't so I doubt this would work.

[Kazan]

pessimism gets us nowhere

Volition doesn't care if we use their file formats, as long as credit is given

intergay is almost non-existant, and why would they bother - the game was released in 1999, it's 2002 - as far as they're concerned the game is dead

This game has become Abondonware

[Kamikaze]

Originally posted by Kazan
pessimism gets us nowhere

Volition doesn't care if we use their file formats, as long as credit is given

intergay is almost non-existant, and why would they bother - the game was released in 1999, it's 2002 - as far as they're concerned the game is dead

This game has become Abondonware

*cough* Titus *cough*

Abandonware? Freespace and 2 are still commercial!

[LtNarol]

well, it wouldnt hurt to make the engine more modable in terms of capabilities if you can stick in addons and make the engine capable of doing something it couldnt do before.  What if the day after the engine is released you find a better way to do say explosions, where you can actually sequence them.  Instead of completely redoing the engine, wouldnt it be nice if you can just stick in a dll or ini?

[Kazan]

Narol: like i said, wait until latter for that kind of thing - the project needs a programming staff, a webspace, and a coordinator first

[LtNarol]

Originally posted by Kazan
Narol: like i said, wait until latter for that kind of thing - the project needs a programming staff, a webspace, and a coordinator first

I vote you for coordinator, and im pretty sure HLP will host you.  As for staff...

[Shrike]

Any objections if I move this to gen FS?

[Warlock]

Well tell ya what. yall do what ya want ok ?

I merely suggested not GUESSING about legal issues. No disrespect intended but very VERY few ppl here know the exact details of copyrights.

If you feel since the game is 4 years old the copyright is null and void...hehe...sure thing...have fun...don't get caught.

And as far as Interplay being bout to crash and burn....you think that would make them decide not to take legal action?  hehe ok

check around ppl. Lucas did the same to several online Star wars costume groups for making Stormtrooper armor.

Sadly thou it merely takes a phone call to a lawer and a quick question to fnd out for sure yet I'll lay odds NOONE actually does it.

[WMCoolmon]

As far as a web staff, I can help out. It's probably a good idea to have someone else as coordinator, because they'll be the person keeping the project going-coders WILL[/i][/u] be needed for the engine work.

[Martinus]

It's perfectly plausable to create a better file type than POF and as a lot of you know POF has been a major pain in the arse as far as editing/converting etc. The very need to first build the model (or at least convert it) in COB format, a filetype that requires the use of a poor, expensive and outdated modelling program is what's stopped this community from releasing models at a greater rate.

If you need proof look at the Starlancer modelling community, they convert straight from MAX, a widely supported format. Anyone from your average modder with Blender to someone fully kitted out with 3DSmax or Lightwave can create and texture a model for Starlancer. As a result they have a massive library of models that you can quickly and easily import into the game.

Go with what the greater number of people can use. It's not just common sense, it's essential if this project is to be popular.

[WMCoolmon]

I'd object, on the basis that the GenFS forum has less posts, and this isn't just Freespace.
EDIT: And I mean less posts usually means less visitors
But that's just me

[mikhael]

Originally posted by Warlock

the ENTIRE game is copyrighted.

Now you could make a new engine that has completely unrelated ships, weapons, effects, storyline, etc etc and be safe....but then what would be the point eh?

It should be pointed out, in case it hasn't been already, that there's no grounds for a lawsuit if the engine stands alone.

IE, lets just say Kazan drinks a lot of coffee this weekend and busts out KazanSpace, revolutionary new 3d space sim engine that is completely moddable and understands the data file formats for some random game, say, Independence War 2 (not a stretch: every format in the game save for the PSOs is a public standard, and PS doesn't mind us reverse engineering it if we want. So says the programming team, speaking on behalf of Infogrammes). Now, we can't redistribute ANY Iwar2 data. We can, however distribute the engine as long as we say its not supported by Infogrammes, Particle Systems or Bob and you use it at your own risk. Those of us who OWN Iwar2 can use our resource.zip file to play. Everyone else has to collect modded campaigns or whatever.

Its not copyright violation if you don't distribute copyrighted materials. If you write a program (say... oh, PCS) that groks Interplay/Volition's file formats, that's okay. You'll be using your own engine to access files you already have the right to access (from your bought copy of Freespace2).  Its legit.

As for things never getting finished, I resemble that remark. I still owe Venom an Arcadia and several other people models.

[Warlock]

Originally posted by mikhael


 
As for things never getting finished, I resemble that remark. I still owe Venom an Arcadia and several other people models.

*raises hand*