Author Topic: Discord issue  (Read 3362 times)

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Okay, this needs to be addressed firstly. My previous post? I have f*cked up so hard there that I can't believe I was ever capable of f*cking something up so damn hard if I didn't do just that yesterday. If this is of any value to anyone after my outburst, I am extremely sorry for this and will try my best to never ever repeat such. If it isn't, you can rest assured that I'm going to have a lot of time to detest myself over it in the near future, starting about today morning.

Yes, I think it was important to mention that The E has an intense ideological grudge against Rybak. Yes, I shouldn't have said that in such an idiotic manner. Yes, while I like to think of myself as understanding of the necessity of some drastic actions, the sheer intensity of the hate started to become ludicrous to me.

But, to reiterate what I should have said back there and didn't do it correctly: the HLP Discord server has lately had a large issue with certain individuals constantly harassing and attacking a productive member of the community who had a release recently. Since I don't really care anymore, I think they should be called out by nickname: General Battuta and Phantom Hoover are the most prominent attackers (that I can remember; if I am wrong, please correct me) were attacking Mobius firstly over his very weird announcement of the ModDB awards, and then a mistake in one of his responses to Battuta's harrasment in the forum topic. For the record, I have privately asked Battuta to stop these attacks, not only because I believed they seriously hurt Mobius, but because this behaviour also had a severely negative effect on me, for personal reasons. I got the response that he "will be nicer to Mobius", and, well, nothing really changed.
Therefore it is very concerning to me that the moderation staff were incapable to react to this situation as it was happening for weeks on the forum (the thread was locked, warnings handed out and a statement was given after a considerable time, I recall) and then again for at least over a week on the Discord, with the aggressors publicly engaging in lengthy ridiculising of Mobius on about bi-daily basis, but then a week or two later they're somehow perfectly fine with tracing back someone's antisemitic behaviour in a different Discord server from two years back. This is at best an issue with priorities.
Another very concerning thing is that it felt to me like nobody else in the community would take a firm stand against this behaviour. I'm sorry if I might be misremembering things, but I really am under the impression I was the only one to actually strongly oppose.


If this wasn't enough, on the HLP Discord he also publicly endorsed real life violence against people who have committed some speculated act of "supporting fascism".

Do you have any evidence for that? It's an extreme strong accusation you're making there so you should provide evidence. Promoting political violence of any sort is an absolute no-go (and against both Discords as well as HLP ToS, what can get your account deleted by Discord); leave alone a complete disqualification for any kind of staff membership.
Okay, let's start from the thing I said after that. My severely exaggerated point about The E "trying to make that happen" was about him joining the ranks of Antifa, which he openly mentioned in the Discord. As for the endorsement of violence, my memory of that is foggy at best. What I recall is that at some point I've engaged with a discussion with him where he openly stated something going so far beyond the typical "punch nazis in the face" slogan that I was honestly left with a thought that I simply cannot take this person seriously anymore. Which is something that I have really never felt towards somebody. If my memory serves, it might have been around two months ago in the #gaming channel of the Discord, but I'm not perfectly sure of the time frame. If you feel like you need to verify, please do, but don't ask me to do it. I am not in the HLP Discord anymore, and don't plan on returning.


Punching Nazis is good and should be encouraged at all times and in all places.
I think you of all people should maybe consider sitting this one out, given your record with assuming who are the people you're conversing with.



Also, I think it's worth mentioning that I'm pretty sure I have a pretty accurate understanding of who did repeatedly report Rybak for making extremely insensitive jokes nearly two years ago, and honestly this doesn't feel very encouraging to me.



So, there's another very haunting feeling that has hit me today like a truck. The timing of this situation is just too perfect. Let me explain.

A bit beyond a week or so ago, after learning that another member of the Discord left and instantly jumping to the conclusion that the reason for this was the absurd amount of toxicity generated in there by two individuals, and when they started to assault Mobius again, as per the latest customs, I had an absolute breakdown and promptly left the server too, leaving some parting insult that I think many might have considered extremely offensive. At this point I've decided to slowly remove any involvements I had with this community, and I moved to the barren politics server that I was in charge of. On February 1st, I have asked a question whether anyone is still using the server for anything, and that I was thinking of outright deleting it. The next day I have followed it with a statement that I want to leave the server, but I wouldn't want to delete it if there was any interest in it. Which it seems to have been near zero.

From this discussion, I understand that Rybak's Discord ban took place possibly hours after my statement of intention to remove the server, which is bringing me to a quite paranoical conclusion that I just can't shake off and it's been gnawing at my sanity for most of the day.

Did someone present on the server want this to happen?
Did they expect me to remove the server along with any proof of whatever defense line Rybak might have stated, with the exception of hand-picked screenshots from there, all being definite proof of his guilt?

Has my moment of weakness been used by someone as means of ridding the community of an inconvenient member without allowing them having any proof for any line of defense they might have taken?

Merely thinking of it makes me feel dirty. Not to mention the sleep lost over it and a massive headache.

Also FYI, the server is right now in the hands of qazwsxal.



It's just a game discord.
It is, again, only a video game discord for a tiny community.
You need to remember that most of the HLP related action has moved onto the Discord server. This directly means removing the person in question from the majority of the community intercourse... this is not "just a game discord".
Have you ever considered why would a hypothetical demasked nazi want so hard to return to "just a game discord" of the community that demasked him and visibly holds him in contempt?

Also, while I understand that it isn't aimed towards me, please do tell. Then why is my decision of leaving this community one of the most painful things I've ever done?

Maybe because this "just a game discord" and just a game community were things and people I have enjoyed spending time with and strongly involved myself personally with? Maybe because it was literally my only other major source of social interactions outside of work or other necessary activities? Maybe because it was a place where I made a bunch of friends that I wanted to enjoy spending time with?


Now, what's next on the list... Ah.
Maybe it would be better for your mental health if you just didn't get involved in this.
You.

After you have joined the Discord after one of your famous self-bans, I took a long while to see just who exactly you are. By observing you and asking around a bit about you I have arrived at a honestly depressing conclusion.

You're a siren.

This is a strange term, but I've never ever seen anyone fitting it just so well. You lure innocent poor souls into your circle of self-adoration with your puppet morality and promise of comfort and understanding... But when they warm up to you and get closer, they only get the choice between being manipulated into this... thing you create around yourself, or being rejected, attacked and ridiculed by you and your choir at every step. I have never had the image of someone to look up to crumble into pieces so insanely fast. Seeing your behaviour over the time has been a crushing experience in trying to keep loving the art while absolutely despising its author, given how a massive BP fanboy I used to be. I have no idea whether I made it or not, given that I haven't launched Freespace in about a month and don't feel like doing this anytime soon. So, I guess, never meet your childhood heroes?

Funnily enough, I had just handled the proccess of fully removing a person similarily abusive in similar fashion to you from my personal life no more than about two weeks ago. Time to go again, I guess.


So you dare put up the act of being concerned about me? After being one of the three people from here constituting the majority cause of my current issues with myself? After being explicitly told by me that every instance of seeing you assault innocent people destroys me from the inside in a way I never knew was possible, and just continuing doing just that? You have the audacity to publicly put up such a patronising act after all of this?

If you have any sort of common courtesy left in you, and if you really have any slightest care about my well being: don't ever speak to me again.




I am thinking this post is a bit of an act of fate. There I was yesterday, deciding to look into the new unread messages one last time before I let go, thinking of how fun it was to nerd out with the people here. And I just happened to stumble upon this and the Mjn drama topic.

At this point I think I'll just be around to see these reach their conclusions, and then just fade away. There is a part of me that desperately wants for something, anything to convince me otherwise, but I am not getting my hopes up at this point.
How do you kill a hydra?

You starve it to death.

 

Offline General Battuta

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You need the psychological help that everybody on Discord told you to get. You are a paranoid, volatile mess. Come back when you are better.

Because of this, you are also the primary source of problems on discord. Essentially the entire community is set up around calming you down every time you have an episode. You talk about nothing except discord drama and your own life problems, which, while terrible, are not going to be solved on discord. You need to work on yourself. I'm not going to delete this, because I did say it and I don't want to hide that, but it was said in anger and I apologize. You have needed a lot of soothing and have said some genuinely terrible things (denying COVID casualties in America bothered me in particular), but you are not The Big Problem.

e: That was too far. You've been gone the last few weeks and things have been calmer. But whenever you do appear it is, essentially, to shout that everything is awful and that this reminds you of a personal trauma. If you have awful personal trauma that is harming your relationships with other people, please seek therapy. I mean that. It can be incredibly valuable.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 06:48:24 pm by General Battuta »

 

Offline General Battuta

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Meanwhile the logs of Rybak's incident are being reviewed. It is, again, up to the discord mods to decide what they do.

 

Offline JSRNerdo

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You need the psychological help that everybody on Discord told you to get. You are a paranoid, volatile mess. Come back when you are better.

Because of this, you are also the primary source of problems on discord. Essentially the entire community is set up around calming you down every time you have an episode. You talk about nothing except discord drama and your own life problems, which, while terrible, are not going to be solved on discord. You need to work on yourself.

lol

mirror, much
AKA [`_`]
Inferno: It's the I in Inferno / It's the beam spam delight / Risin' up to a shock jump arrivaaaaaal
Between The Ashes: Look just a really cool and neat thing, OK?
Dimesional Eclipse: High speed anime girlies blowing **** up gets me excited
The Last Stand: A very episodic capship command mini-campaign
Breakthrough: A pretty standard but not really capship command mission

 

Offline General Battuta

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How so? Look past your kneejerk reaction, maybe reread this thread. Do you still feel that way?

 
You need the psychological help that everybody on Discord told you to get. You are a paranoid, volatile mess. Come back when you are better.

Because of this, you are also the primary source of problems on discord. Essentially the entire community is set up around calming you down every time you have an episode. You talk about nothing except discord drama and your own life problems, which, while terrible, are not going to be solved on discord. You need to work on yourself.

e: That was too far. You've been gone the last few weeks and things have been calmer. But whenever you do appear it is, essentially, to shout that everything is awful and that this reminds you of a personal trauma. If you have awful personal trauma that is harming your relationships with other people, please seek therapy. I mean that. It can be incredibly valuable.

I've been decently active, even in lurking, prior to the time that Mito left the server. I truthfully doubt that he needs psychological help - certainly in my many personal interactions with him I have never seen him be paranoid or volatile. Even during his time running the political Discord such was still not the case. He was not the primary source of any issues that have happened on the Discord - certainly not as of late - and I have not seen much from him in the way of Discord drama over the multiple years I've been a part of the community.

 

Offline Aesaar

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Mito, I don't mean this in the dismissive, mocking way it's typically used on the Internet.  I'm being as sincere as I can possibly be:

Please get help.  Please please please get help.  Step away from HLP for a while and focus on you and getting better.  If you ever feel inclined to come back, you'll always have that option, but right now, I really don't think it's healthy for you to be here.

 

Offline General Battuta

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I am reluctant to go pull chatlogs of personal conversations from Discord and paste them here forever. It seems intrusive. But you'll have to trust me that a lot of us, not some narrow slice, were begging him to go see a therapist as soon as possible due the sheer misery he is enduring in his offline life. I'll refer you to Ertanax, Bees, and Cerazor as the first three names I see in the logs as character witnesses.

My impression that Mito is a source of problems may be heavily inflected by watching him tear down my personal friend and repeated ****ty stuff survivor The E over what was, essentially, a grudge over fancy IRC moderation. He has been dogged and persistent in blaming things on The E even when the German man is not involved. This led directly to E stepping down. Mito also had to be soothed in the middle of any conversation that remotely resembled a disagreement, whether big or small. From my perspective it seemed very much like he was hypervigilant and incredibly anxious.

Because of his own fears about exclusion, Mito seems unable to understand that not all interpersonal conflict is motivated by animus, and not all exclusion is malicious. Given a person who has done something wrong, and five people shouting at them that they have done something wrong, it seems to me that Mito will always—for very strong emotional reasons—side with the person who has done wrong, no matter what the wrong might be. This can be admirable, but in situations where someone has done something wrong and the community consensus points to some punishment (for example, Goober losing admin status), it leads to Mito melting down again and again over the 'bullying': ironically with no concern for those who were actually harmed in the first place. That's a moral myopia I find pretty frustrating.

It is clear that this is making Mito miserable and it certainly made The E miserable. People shouldn't stay in situations making them miserable.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 06:49:21 pm by General Battuta »

 

Offline General Battuta

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MP-Ryan and Ironbeer also good character witnesses.

 

Offline General Battuta

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Anyway, **** this, being accused of abuse for trying to speak reason in a thread about some guy's Holocaust denial 'jokes' is a span too far for me. Mito, go to therapy. Rybak guy, I hope you get the appropriate punishment/relief for whatever you actually did. Face guy, I wish you would express your problems in a way other than being snide at weird times.

I'm going to go paste screenshots for Axem and Spoon so we can have a big collective groan. Mods, this has degenerated into bickering and I think it deserves a lock.

 
You really don't know when to fall silent for a moment, do you?

So now that I'm pretty certain that you actually don't give the slightest f*ck beyond being smug in an internet discussion, throwing around lies and half-truths wrapped in silver lining for everyone to salivate over your eloquence...

You need the psychological help that everybody on Discord told you to get.
People shouldn't stay in situations making them miserable.

Doing just that. Can't do much of returning to normality with this amount of toxicity accompanying me.
How do you kill a hydra?

You starve it to death.

 

Offline MP-Ryan

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This thread gets a pause while I write a response, and then maybe we'll collectively consider unlocking it after.  Maybe.  Stand by.

EDIT:  To address several reports about political violence, punching Nazis (actual Nazis), etc, I wrote out the following yesterday and ran it by the other moderators.  To put everyone on notice:

My grandfather earned medals for punching Nazis and worse, and I would consider it something of an honour to follow in his footsteps.  Calling for punching actual Nazis is not political violence because that implies it is a topic on which reasonable people can disagree - and it isn't.  It's a public service.  THAT SAID, HLP is a community dedicated to a space sim, not eradicating a genocidal scourge from recent human history, and there are plenty of spaces on the Internet you can talk about that instead.  So, in the interest of keeping politics and contention quarantined from the main community spaces, we're discouraging further discussion of that particular part of this topic and any further posts on the matter will be relegated to the PolDisc subboard.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 07:19:33 pm by MP-Ryan »
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