Hard Light Productions Forums
Modding, Mission Design, and Coding => The Modding Workshop => Topic started by: bizzybody on December 12, 2006, 03:49:08 am
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Still far from done on the modeling. I decided today to try something different, a fighter that's completely not symmetrical. I just did a screencap in trueSpace for the pic. The darker faces are the cockpit area.
I dunno what to put on the ends of the three wings or what it'll have for engines. It want it to look off balanced but have its 'mass' balanced to either side of its central thrust axis.
I started it from a simple cube and all the modeling was done with Quad Divide, Sweep, Add New Edge, Delete Vertexes, Weld Vertexes and manually moving some vertexes. When its done I'll boolean subtract a non-intersecting cube to zap all the surplus edges on flat faces then I'l either manually triangulate or I might just poke the Triangulate button and let it randomize it a bit on this one. :)
Load the model up so you can get a look all around, lemme know what you think of it.
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Looks good :yes:
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Yay! More bizarre looking ships! :yes:
Most impressive looking assymetrical so far would be the Ravana, I think.
But still I like this fighter. Looks kinda reminiscient of the Vesuvius.
(http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/7871/gtfvesuviusdm5.th.jpg)
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Here's a couple pics showing four variants. In the front view, leftmost is the #6 one from the previous attachment- with some modifications, mostly around the back end. Second from left is #6 after getting surplus edges deleted. Third and fourth are each half of #6 mirrored and welded then weird stuff at the midline fixed up to make a pair of more conventional ships with a common lineage.
It's sort of how car companies sometimes make one full scale mockup with each side different, sometimes just small changes, sometimes extreme. In rare cases a company would make a completely functional prototype with wildly different left and right sides.
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but a big engine in the back and on the end of the single wing, and put missle pods on the ends of the double wings. that would make it look balanced enough if the engine is big enough ;7
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I like the rear (engine-area) section on the biplane version a lot better than the mono-wing variant, but I don't know how well it would convert to your asymetrical ship.
As for wing sections, I highly recommend some kind of vertical missile rack on the dual-wing side, and a large cannon-esque gun on the right.
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Pardon the weird ASCII - weapon loadout similarities aside, I found the Vesuvius to be a rather homely fighter (No offense to the designers, I just don't care for the look). I like the design concepts in this one a lot better. Looking forward to the next set of screens. ;)
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Briefing on the A-SymM series of Space Superiority Fighters.
Background.
When we introduced the asymmetrical mockup of our new fighter concepts, potential buyers showed much interest but said they wanted to see how they would perform as functional prototypes.
At the Narabedla Air and Space Show, we unveiled the symmetrical mono-wing Mark 8 and bi-wing Mark 9 to rave reviews.
Then the Mark 7 was rolled out and immediately launched. The observers were quite stunned to see the asymmetrical ship was a functional vehicle.
While the Mark 8 and Mark 9 designs were being prepared for production, inquiries kept coming in on the Mark 7, so many that we had to put it into the production readiness program.
Production.
Now, Galan Aerospace is proud to present the A-SymM7, A-SymM8 and A-SymM9!
These three craft are the first off their production lines.
Ordnance Pods.
The M7 is outfitted with a bank of four modular ordnance pods on the port bi-wing, suitable for guns, energy weapons, missiles or bombs. Optimized for high capacity missile loadout, these pods can also pack a very large punch when equipped with guns or energy weaponry. Each of the four pods may also be fitted with energy cells to support higher firing rates and/or a longer firing time before requiring recharging from the reactor.
On the starbord mono-wing, the M7 suports a tri-module ordnance pod capable of being loaded with bombs, missiles, or energy weapons. These pods are optimized for energy weapons, guns may be fitted but the smaller size limits the number of rounds available. Weapon convergeance may be set individually for each tri-pod. The bomb capacity per tri-pod is two for most types.
The modular configuration of both types of pod provides for fast turnaround when re-arming, and for quick replacement of damaged modules. Their positioning at the wingtips enhances survivability of the pilot should the ordnance be explosively destroyed by enemy fire. A fast pod jettison system is standard on all variants of the A-SymM series.
For full details on ordnance capacity of both styles of pod, contact our toll-free Hypernet node and ask to speak with a weaponry consultant.
Core weaponry.
All three craft are shown with red dummy rods on the body to indicate all of the possible core weaponry mountpoints. It is not recommended, or with most loadouts- possible, to use all of these mountpoints at the same time. Wherever possible, identical vertical and/or horizontal positions for each mountpoint have been used accross the series. This makes it easier to crosstrain pilots for each variant as well as using a common software suite on all three models.
Engines.
All A-SymM fighters come equipped with five engines for superior speed and enhanced survivability in combat operation. The M7 and M9 versions have two and four (respectively) engines with the ability to augment thrust in a planetary atmosphere. The M8 has the fastest afterburner speed with the M7 performing between the M8 and M9. Cruise speed is identical for all three versions.
Cockpit.
With the decision to produce all three A-SymM versions, the cockpit was rationalized across the three. With the common design, a pilot can fly any version and each will respond exactly the same to control inputs. Our VariOptimum software suite handles all of the variables amongst the A-SymM versions, allowing a for a single pilot training programme no matter which of the craft his or her squadron is equipped with. Any loadout is automatically configured and presented to the pilot via our custom interface attachment modules, which Galan Aerospace can design for any weapon or ordnance it's possible to fit into any core bay or pod, now and in the future.
Thank you for considering a purchase of the A-SymM Space Superiority Fighter Series.
Galan Aerospace looks forward to doing business with you.
(The ZIP file has the three ships as seen in the latest pics.)
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Overall look cool...
One opinion, make those "guns" recessed as holes and not sticking out. It would look more detailed that way plus you could play with the textures. Simple rods make them look low quality. ;)
Make MORE!
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Like the "press release" says, those rods are just dummies to show where the mount points are for the weapons. :)
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Two more versions. The four Tri-pods on the bi-wing have been lengthened to accomodate more ordnance while the mono-wingless ;) version sports a pair of the bi-wing's large quad pods and a standard length tri-pod in place of its dorsal fin. Naturally this compact design is the fastest* ship yet from Galan Aerospace as well as having the largest armament potential.
*Assuming the customer doesn't try to load it down with the absolute maximum ordnance package!
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Ok it's got wings. Which means you're aiming for some kind of atmospheric capability here. Because wings in space are pretty pointless. Unless you're going to stick thrusters on the end of them, and I'm not seeing any thrusters. Although I would imagine the results of putting retro thrusters on that kind of asymetrical wing design as amusingly disasterous as trying to fly it in an atmosphere. Putting all that aside. You have some pretty ships there!
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Thrusters? That's what textures are for! ;) What's nice about these is they're not all one piece models, so if you want to change the pods, add your own guns on the body etc. Have fun.
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I don't understand why we need asymmetrical fighters. Us 'umies like things to be even, and even means more weapons (two is always better than one, four is always better than three, etc.)
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Why? Because they're cool! http://fiddlersgreen.net/AC/aircraft/AD-1-ScissorsWing/AD-1.php http://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/history/pastprojects/AD1/index.html http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Gallery/Photo/AD-1/
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Ok it's got wings. Which means you're aiming for some kind of atmospheric capability here. Because wings in space are pretty pointless. Unless you're going to stick thrusters on the end of them, and I'm not seeing any thrusters. Although I would imagine the results of putting retro thrusters on that kind of asymetrical wing design as amusingly disasterous as trying to fly it in an atmosphere. Putting all that aside. You have some pretty ships there!
Not necessarily - they change the turning characteristics if the craft by displacing its center of mass - if you place thrusters on them they are also a handy way to increase the effectiveness of your thrusters. (Longer arm, greater angular force).
However you're right: making them aerodynamic is poinless.
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Not necessarily - they change the turning characteristics if the craft by displacing its center of mass - if you place thrusters on them they are also a handy way to increase the effectiveness of your thrusters. (Longer arm, greater angular force).
Excellent idea... take a look at my rapier and pirhana, they both have side-thrusters
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Not necessarily - they change the turning characteristics if the craft by displacing its center of mass - if you place thrusters on them they are also a handy way to increase the effectiveness of your thrusters. (Longer arm, greater angular force).
Not really. The computers on your fighter craft should be able to compensate the direction of the maneuvering thrusters enough to where it doesn't matter if you have wings or not. The only reason fighter craft today have wings is to give enough surface tension to keep lift to keep the craft in the air. In space, you don't need to keep your craft in the air.
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Not necessarily - they change the turning characteristics if the craft by displacing its center of mass - if you place thrusters on them they are also a handy way to increase the effectiveness of your thrusters. (Longer arm, greater angular force).
Not really. The computers on your fighter craft should be able to compensate the direction of the maneuvering thrusters enough to where it doesn't matter if you have wings or not. The only reason fighter craft today have wings is to give enough surface tension to keep lift to keep the craft in the air. In space, you don't need to keep your craft in the air.
But shouldn't thrusters placed farther away from the center of mass have greater effect (at least according to the law of the lever. I suppose one attach the thrusters to beams, but a wing structure would give more strength and storage agea.
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They would, but not much. We really don't know much about the maneuvering thrusters so it's all speculation from here... oh, and basic physics
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Ok it's got wings. Which means you're aiming for some kind of atmospheric capability here. Because wings in space are pretty pointless. Unless you're going to stick thrusters on the end of them, and I'm not seeing any thrusters. Although I would imagine the results of putting retro thrusters on that kind of asymetrical wing design as amusingly disasterous as trying to fly it in an atmosphere. Putting all that aside. You have some pretty ships there!
The GTF Perseus and the GTF Valkyre (spelt that wrong - sorry) have something like a wing on them. :nod: :confused:
I think those ships are good. The asymetrical one reminds me of a SF Dragon or a SF Scorpion. :yes: :yes:
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Babylon 5 has one obvious example of a ship that puts clusters of retro thrusters on the end of wing like pylons to increase it's turning speed. I can't remember what it's called though.
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In Babylon 5 all the mian eirth fighters (the Starfury series if fighters), and the main Minbari fighter (the Nial), have their engines on the ends of pylons. As for the effect of this, according to the basic physics involved, (levers), doubling the distance that the thrusters are from the centre of rotation, doubles the rate of rotational accelaration for the same thrust level, allowing much smaller thrusters. However, there is a counter to this in that moving the thrusters out on the end of pylons then causes the mass of the craft to move further out, reduceing the rotational accelaration, which may make a carft with light narrow pylon with only the thrusters on the end of them and the rest of the engines in the centre of the craft actually superior to a starfury type craft with the entire engines on the end of the pylons. (thinking about it a starfury uses i's main engine power for manouvreing, and so this wouldn't be an option there).
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@MarkN
(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3232/welcome2hlpbbny2.gif) (http://imageshack.us)
Welcome to the HLP Station. Exits are located to the right, left, up, down, and 4th-dimensionally. However all of them are blocked, except the 4-d one, and no one's yet figured how to reach it. Somebody says there is anoter one in the 5th dimension: if you find it, let us know! In the event of a landing of any kind, you can and will be used as a flotation device. We are currently suffering from technical problems from time to time, which may cause the lights go out at any instance, and sometimes even the basic life support fails for some time. At these times, stay calm and composed; for these cases the station system automatically drops a computer from the roof above you with FSO installed and ready. They have independent power sources. Please keep all appendages within the installation at all times. Do not feed the resident Shivan Carl as he will become voracious and chew your leg off. You can find him in the ventilation duct. Throw him your lunch and hope he is not hungry and leaves you alone. Flamethrowers can be found under your seat but due to financial constraints have been re-filled with holy water. Phased Plasma rifles (40 watt range of course) can be found in storage lockers. To prevent act of n00b, however, these can only be opened by Moderators, Volition or a hyperintelligent shade of BluE. Please remember that any attempt to use the ASCII characters 0046h, 0053h, and 0033h in sequential order will result in you being trampled by the whole FreeSpace community. Your trampled remains will be fed to Carl so that the rest of us don't have to carry around so much food for lunch. If you shall go in the Vasudan section of the station and find a boxes labelled “Headz”, please don’t open them, unless you are a Vasudan. Trust me on this one.... In the event of catastrophic hull failure please board the nearest lifeboat which is pre-programmed for autonomous flight to our sister station the Game-Warden outpost. Thank you and enjoy your stay at Hard Light station as long as you will!
Back on topic:
how about creating ships with unconventional simmetries, for example radial with 3/5/7 axes? (like a star, if what i wrote is uncomprehensible in english...)
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Here's an engine upgrade package, free of charge to all Galan Aerospace customers who bought any of the A-SymM series of fighter craft. :)
The ones I had on these models were quite... crappy. This model will load with the under-wing pairs and single central nozzle in position for the bi-wing and asymmetrical versions. Just delete/copy/move as required for other versions. These started as 12 sided cylinders and went better from there. (Y'know, gas flow efficiency happens to be much better when the pipe is a closer approximation of a cylinder than an octagon...)
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Admiral Edivad:
I once saw a LEGO model of a fighter with 5-fold symmetry. It looked just enough odd to make you look again.
Maybe the next in the ASymM series, perhaps the bomber with 5 equally space wings and one of them being horizontal to one side.
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what are they to be used for? a heavy assault? a interceptor? I need an interceptor for my campaign
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Hmmm, people download my stuff, but does anyone do textures and pof them etc for FS2?
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I collect all SORTS of stuff... If I got your permission to bash parts or whatever, I'd look into using some of it probably ;)
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Anything I've posted on this forum, use for whatever you want. :)
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Hmmm, people download my stuff, but does anyone do textures and pof them etc for FS2?
I did pof and texture (not that good ::), I was just testing the idea :P) the Mark 7 and made a table for it :yes:. I could upload it tomorrow as a Christmas present. ;) (That is if I'm not too busy playing with my new laptop! :lol:)
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I might want to steal your tri-configuration pods and elongate them to be missiles? ;7
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Oooo? Did ya replace the dummy 'weapons' on the body with real ones? :)
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haven't got around to doing anything yet. Sometimes I will look at a ship and inspiration hits me about a piece of it. Like the Star Wars Razor fighter, the engines make cool missiles.
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Oooo? Did ya replace the dummy 'weapons' on the body with real ones? :)
Sorry, no. :blah: I used them to put the gun points in the right spots though. :) I'm not real good at modelling. :( Just to let you know, I used all the dummies-as slots. That made 11 weapons. I split that into 1 primary bank with 3 points - that can load all the nice guns - and another bank with 7 points, which can only load weaker weapons. 7 Circes do some serious damage to shields though. :nod: I haven't uploaded it yet because I am using the Laptop I mentioned in my previous post. It works like a dream by the way.
Oh yeah. Merry Christmas!
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Have you put the upgraded engine package on it? What about the pods on the wings? Those also need weaponry! :)
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Have you put the upgraded engine package on it? What about the pods on the wings? Those also need weaponry! :)
I didn't add the new engines. The pods have weapons though. (Secondaries)
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Please, pleeeeaaaaaseeee use the new engines. *Wishes real hard for the crappy original engines to just go the bleep away.* ;)
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Please, pleeeeaaaaaseeee use the new engines. *Wishes real hard for the crappy original engines to just go the bleep away.* ;)
I said that I'm not a good modeller. So I just insert the new engine package and move them to fit? BTW I put thruster glows on the old engines and they looked alright, although it would look better with some more texturing.
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Yup, just delete the old engines/nozzles, load up the new. Depending on which variant, delete one or both under-wing dual engines and copy/move the central nozzle sideways. The nozzle's axes are located the same as the original so you can just note the coordinates of the old ones and manually enter them into the Object Properties panel in trueSpace.
I wish there was a tSx for trueSpace that could copy and paste any/all the position/rotation data from the Object Properties panel. Another thing that'd really be slick is a way to select a face and make all its vertexes aligned on one axis.
That's always been a problem with tS, when you scale an object or especially when you scale or move _part_ of an object, it has 'jitter'- where points that start in identical but opposite coordinates do not move _exactly_ identically. That's why I love the Mirror Modeler function in tS 6.6. Anything I want to be perfectly symmetrical, I chop in half then mirror and weld it. That's how I did the symmetrical versions of this ship.
Another cool feature of Mirror Modeler is what it does to UV mapping. It makes the map for each side a perfect mirror image. You can even get two way mirrored UV mapping by first cutting a model in half, mirroring, then cutting and mirroring again 90 degrees to the first cut and mirror. Could probably do that a third time. Hmm, a cube cut and mirrored three ways should make a UV map of 1/4th its surface which would be two way mirrored on each face of the cube. :)
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Attached the ship. I haven't had time to add the new engine package, but I thought you might want a look.
Edit: Ack! It's missing a texture! I'll re-upload it now aswell as some pictures.
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Quite the fearsome beast with all those guns. :)
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Aaaand here's an upgrade for the guns, as modeled by the M7- along with the upgraded engines. Four models, one each left and right for mono and bi-wing mounts. Mix and match as required, just like the engines.
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I thought you said the red things were dummies?
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The original red things, simple hexagonal cylinders, were dummies. The replacements have more sides, are shaped a bit and I refined their positions. Still red though. ;) (That's what textures are for.)
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Aah. :blah:
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Nothing to keep you from making your own guns, or borrowing some from another model. Shouldn't be using all of them at once anyway, as the press release from Galan Aerospace stated in an earlier post. ;)
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Does that mean that you want some of the guns without points?
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The idea is to have some of the gun mounts without guns. Little ones like the HL-7 could be used in all of them while the ML-16 might only occupy every other one due to size.
Hmmm, I wonder if it's possible to tie the presence (or rendering) of a submodel to the type of weapon loadout?
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ML-16? You thinking of using this in FS1?
Anyway the reason for my gun setup was so that you can't pound the enemy with 11 Kaysers or Maxims.
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I made all 5 of the Fighters. All they need now is a good texture. Do you want me to PM them to you? The file is too big to post here.