Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: colecampbell666 on December 21, 2007, 11:06:29 am
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As most of you know, the FS IP (Intellectual Property) is up for grabs in 2011. That means that in just a little over 3 years, anyone could own FS. Now what if that were us, the community as a collective? What I'm proposing is that we make a fund for the IP, and once InterPlay sells, we may have a fighting chance of getting the IP. Is this a good idea? Any sugestions on how to raise the money? we would need approximately 85000 dollars a year to get the 250 000$ figure that I've heard tossed around.
Suggestions?
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Hmm. We should get the HLP FS_Open to some milli/billionaire and prove him we're worth sponsoring.
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One guy came on a few months ago wanting to spend his inheritance to buy the license. Talk about dedication.
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You're assuming that they will sell in 2011. They don't have to.
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I doubt it costs that much. Something around $10-20k would be my guess, given that FS2 was a financial failure and space sims in general are seen as a dead genre by publishers these days. However, even we acquired it, what exactly would we do with it? The IP is totally useless by itself unless you just want to prevent Derek Smart from trying to get it again.
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It would allow us to give out FS1 and 2 for free without legal repercussions.
You're assuming that they will sell in 2011. They don't have to.
And a lot of people were saying something to the tune of "They have to.".
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We're doing that already and the chances of encountering problems are far too minute to be worth worrying about, much less throwing away 10 grand for. :p
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It would allow us to give out FS1 and 2 for free without legal repercussions.
Until someone with proper legal training in IP law tells me that I'm calling BS. Volition holds the copyright on FS2.
FreeSpace 2 (c) 1999 by Volition, Inc. All rights reserved.
Portions (c) 1999 Interplay Productions. All rights reserved.
So you'd have to get their permission too. From what I understand Interplay holds the publishing rights. Which is not the same thing.
And I don't believe this stuff about them having to sell the IP after a certain number of years. That doesn't make the slightest bit of sense.
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I think buying the Freespace IP would be a pointless idea anyway, with the SCP as successful as it is, we'd purely be paying that money to find out how [v] planned to end the series, and ironically enough, I suspect that is the portion that isn't in Interplay's hands.
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How could that be pointless? I mean at least we don't have to worry about anybody trying to close down Hard Light. We certainly don't want a person called Derek Smart popping up again...
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But don't you agree that the possibilty for the worst case scenario to happen is quite little? Maybe too little to worry about it much.
I mean, its easy to find more burning issues to worry about, if one's into that sort of things ;)
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One thing--we can't sell the FS2 Open kit for anything more than the cost of the raw materials (aka the cost of the discs and postage). As for buying the IP... I'd say give it time. From what I understand of the law, the IP for Freespace and Freespace 2 is owned by Interplay. They own the series--that's it. What is more-interesting is that the engine is owned by :v:, meaning we'd have to make sure the license to distribute the game, engine, and all portions of the art. Remember that :v: made the engine open-source now... meaning that we aren't allowed to sell our modifications to the engine without violating that license. If we somehow pulled enough money into the Freespace IP, we'd have the chance to do several things... one is distribute Freespace, Freespace: Silent Threat, and Freespace 2 for any price we set, including free. Another thing we could do is approach :v: (or, in effect, THQ) and ask them about contracting for the end of the trilogy. I'm not sure I want :v: to do the entire thing... I think it would be much better if the contract spelled out that we want the writers to work with us on producing the sequel. Voice acting is secondary--upon completion and bug-testing, we hire voice talent to basically do the entire dialogue. If we let them write the story and get the voice-acting complete, we will have a product that we can sell (saying that :v: contracts out the engine and lets us modify it as necessary). That too is ours--meaning we can sell it. The only problem is that, even if we use our own graphics and modification teams, we would not have the funds to hire out our own people--even part-time (unless we do commission), the business license to release a sequel and put it on shelves at our local WalMart, KMart, Frys, BestBuy, NewEgg, &c.
We have the talent to do everything ourselves--the problem is we don't have a story, we don't have paid voice talent, and we don't have a presence. We'd need a business license to contract with THQ/:v: and distribute the game. Regardless--making CDs and packaging them with a jewel case and manual isn't hard or expensive.
I would personally not want a Derek Smart or similar to try to buy the Freespace IP. It's just not right. I would prefer to contract with Interplay to know who they're selling the Freespace IP and when--so we can try to interfere and possibly bid higher.
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Thought of before, won't happen, don't bother.
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How could that be pointless? I mean at least we don't have to worry about anybody trying to close down Hard Light. We certainly don't want a person called Derek Smart popping up again...
It wouldn't happen anyway, those were pretty empty threats, the worst he could have done was started getting stroppy about the IP, but even then, he would have been on somewhat shaky legal ground, and above all that, he can have no influence on the existence of HLP whatsoever, believe me, if he could have been vindictive about it, he would have.
What, for example, do we plan to do if we reach 2011 and it turns out that they aren't going to sell the Rights? Do we refund everyones' money? Buy a patent for a space-game of our own?
The possibilities of destroying HLP are far higher from the infighting that would be caused by that kind of situation than anything someone outside the forums could do...
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Much as I love FS, I'd much rather have us craft our own universe rather than worrying about someone else's IP. Fewer potential complications that way.
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*snip*
Why make a commercial product. The point of the SCP is to make a free game that anyone can own.
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Here's my ingenious plan:
First HLP member to hit the Power Ball or Mega Millions just buys it outright and donates it to HLP. :D
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Or we can form the Association of Shivan Scouts (A.S.S.) and sell Orion shaped cookies to raise money. (Shivan costumes are mandatory and you must have compound eyes and 5 legs from means of surgery or birth) I doubt SCP will be busted any time soon. Unless Space Sims or Derek Smart makes a comeback, everything will probably be static.
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Or we can form the Association of Shivan Scouts (A.S.S.) and sell Orion shaped cookies to raise money. (Shivan costumes are mandatory and you must have compound eyes and 5 legs from means of surgery or birth)
:lol:
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Trust me, if I won powerball I'd definitely try to buy the rights. But, my biggest worry isn't us getting the rights, or them not selling it at all. It's if they do sell it, and someone else gets it. THAT is probably the biggest threat to the SCP.
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Well Interplay is currently trading at .09 a share so you could buy the whole company for $935,100
Unfortunately THQ would cost a bit more at about 2 billion.
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Yeah, I'm totally buying some lottery tickets. I don't even have to win a big one to afford that.
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A sale of the Freespace IP wouldn't be a threat to the SCP. The code itself never belonged to Interplay, and Volition (whom it does belong to) has released it to the world at large. Keep in mind, the SCP is a game engine, not the game itself :) I suppose if whoever acquired the rights were really persistent about it, they might force a removal of the "Freespace" part of "The Freespace Source Code Project", but that's about all it could amount to. And besides, everyone already calls it the SCP and not the FS_SCP anyway ;)
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Yeah, saying the SCP was a bad choice, I meant we'd probably lose the 'ability' to just so freely distribute copies of the game, via means like installers and HotU without fear of repurcussion. Of course they could never un-release the engine, that'd be silly, but they could easily make our operation a bit less carefree.
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So that means that IP owns every model, background, graphic, weapon, et-cetera?
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(V) and/or Interplay own basically everything in the original vp files, etc. The only thing they released officially was the source to the executables themselves. Anything else, you still technically have to own a copy of FS2 to use.
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A sale of the Freespace IP wouldn't be a threat to the SCP.
It wouldn't be a threat at all.
Why should they want shut down the project, or force the removal of content?
We're doing them a favor here too.
The value of a franchise is defined by the interest in it. So if we keep the interest in FS2 and space-sims up here, we acutally increase the value of the FS2 franchise and license... and maybe of all space-sim franchises... a little bit. ;)
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It depends. A new game means a new community. If somewhere were to buy the FS IP and take the series on a different tack, and the game was successful enough to earn a following, then there may well be two versions of "FreeSpace", the new crappy dumbed-down console game that would likely be released, and the oldschool SCP people. Fighters Anthology is an example of a game community that tore itself apart in a war between two different community factions. The community survived regardless and is still doing well with VNFAWing. But considering how much games have changed since 1999, an FS3 may not feel like "our FreeSpace".
The one thing that I don't like is the Derek taboo. Regardless of his performance as a game designer (which is not necessarily that bad- he has his share of fans), but the fact is that Smart always releases the IP of any game that he's finished profiting from. In other words, if we were to "suffer" a 3000AD FS3, we'd have consolation in the fact that the entire FS series IP would soon be released to the public, in the same way that Battlecruiser can be downloaded for free.
As for the original poster's question, considering how well we all have been doing under SCP, there must be better ways to spend $20k.
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If I got a large sum of money--I'd actually consider the Freespace IP a reasonable investment. If it was $20,000 I would be quite willing to crash those e-Bay sales with some new legit copies of the game. If you own the distribution rights and create the CDs, you can make even a small profit off of CD+Case-Manual sales. That goes for anyone--as long as you have the license to the game, it's yours to do with what you please.
I'm sure that 99% of the people around here (including myself) would be willing to pay $20 for a legal copy of Freespace 2. Just a thought... the FreeSpace IP includes two games and an expansion pack. While most of us aren't really capitalist in that way, it's still a way to draw in new ideas. If we did a rewrite to ensure WinXP/Vista compatibility (and set to only run on a single core--regardless of setting), we would gain many more sales as well.
I hope nobody else buys the FreeSpace IP--our threat isn't Volition and isn't Interplay, it's anyone else who wants to buy the IP.
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FSO doesn't have dual-core support yet. The whole point of open source is to be free, Bob. A better way to spend the money used to produce CDs would be to have an ad campaign. Advertise the game as completely free. (of course the addon packs would be 200000000$)
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I know it doesn't hvae dual-core support yet. That would require a rewrite of the engine. And the point I'm making is to have the game back on shelves or even available online for <$50---preferably <$25. And Open Source is only the engine--the game is still fundamentally closed off to "illegal" sharing. In this case--it's the paying off of $20K by selling the game for $10-$20. In the end--its about keeping the license secure. If someone in the community owns the IP, theres less of a chance that Cease & Desist letters are sent around. And the Ad Campaign? Remember you have to PAY to have your ad featured on a site, on a TV show, on a radio show, in newspapers, in brick & mortar stores, in fliers, in magazines, and in every other form of media. If someone sold copies at a low price, they pay off the investment (after all--it probably costs <$1 to make three CDs and a jewel case), and then have a little bit of reward. This won't be a multi-million dollar game--it's time is over. We put $0 into production, $0 into advertisement, and only are paying for illegal distribution. Making a few dollars to pay off the license is the best idea for anyone. It would really be bad if that person who buys the IP for whatever sum of money to go bankrupt because of whatever problem that they encounter. While $20,000 is a fraction of a house (anywhere from 1/4 to 1/xxxx), it can still make a large difference in a person's right.
Basically, Cole, I'm saying that the Freespace IP is more expensive then what a normal person can afford safely. To sell legal copies legally would be the best way to make your money back. While it's not free--to commission some of the SCP writers to make it 100% WinXP and WinVista compatible. A little bit of extra money for the work is reasonable--considering that we have to separate between the free open-source SCP expansions and the more-expensive original series. To patch the game to support new OS's would expand our base and a link to download the SCP, again legally. If I was able to purchase the license--I would go for it. I'd do what I said... I'd make copies of the game and sell them online to pay it off and have a fundamental rewrite (support multi-threading, support WinXP and WinVista without question, support OpenGL instead of DirectX, possibly support Linux as well).
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It would be better for not one person to own it, but for it to be put into a trust for the community.
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Your idea has a crucial flaw Bob, it's illegal to make a profit from the SCP.
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Not if we fully purchase the rights to the code as well. Then the original contract wouldn't matter.
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holy crap.
not to sound like a bitter old fart, but it won't happen, so don't bother thinking what-ifs. even if it did somehow happen, the community would more likely end up torn apart over it.
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Not that I know much about IP law, but I think all the concern over the SCP being shut down if somebody buys the IP and wants to is somewhat pointless.
It's my understanding (and this could be wrong) that, since the SC was released to the public, that's done with. It was legally released and someone who buys the IP cannot take that back. If they tried to sue the court would consider the issue moot and they wouldn't even get past the threshold issue of stating a claim.
They couldn't claim the source code was being illegally or unlawfully infringed upon, because it isn't. It's perfectly legal. They might be able to stop a NEW project from starting, but I don't think they could shut down the SCP.
But tell you all what, I ever become rich, I'll go ahead and buy the IP and let you guys do whatever you want with it. Afterall, I seriously doubt its value at this point crosses the $150,000 mark, and unless there's some sea-change in the way computer games are going I don't see it getting that much more expensive
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We're not talking about the code, but the rest of the game.
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Your idea has a crucial flaw Bob, it's illegal to make a profit from the SCP.
I never said make a profit from SCP. I said make a profit from the actual Freespace 2 distribution, including paying a commission to members of this community (SCP coders) to update the engine. If they want SCP--include a link to download it (again--free. If it must be paid for--bandwidth can be paid by any revenue generated).holy crap.
not to sound like a bitter old fart, but it won't happen, so don't bother thinking what-ifs. even if it did somehow happen, the community would more likely end up torn apart over it.
While that may be true--I think its better to get two or more expanding communities. If I had $20,000 to buy the IP--I would. Even if we do nothing with it but pay off the investment and use the rest of the revenue for paying operating costs, it would still be more than worth it to have legal immunity. Some day this IP will be bought by someone--be it one of us, a non-HLPBB Freespace fan, another company, or a non-Freespace fan. It WILL be bought eventually or Interplay will just hold it in its vault until it dies (at which time it's auctioned off).
Ns161--I agree with you on some things. But remember that we are still illegally distributing copyrighted material in the form of the full downloads of the game. It's all technically illegal. While anyone who buys the Freespace IP can't do anything about our engine use--they can issue Cease & Desist letters for using their copyrighted content. That includes storyline, original voice acting, original campaign missions, and everything not included in the original SC release by Volition/THQ. Remember the engine belongs to :v:, but the game belongs to Interplay.
If we want a secure future in modding and distributing this great game--the best thing we can do is rely on someone to buy the Freespace IP when it goes on sale. It guarantees that we can't be sued, in the very least.
Again--I don't think someone should buy the license and bathe in whatever revenue they can. The ownership of the license shouldn't be in a community (as this community changes--like all others). Whatever revenue there is should be to pay for the actual cost of the license, support the expansion of the game's distribution, and support the community's costs in bandwidth for the forums and bandwidth for the distribution of campaigns and other game-related material.
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Then that would be making a profit.
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Your idea has a crucial flaw Bob, it's illegal to make a profit from the SCP.
I never said make a profit from SCP. I said make a profit from the actual Freespace 2 distribution, including paying a commission to members of this community (SCP coders) to update the engine. If they want SCP--include a link to download it (again--free. If it must be paid for--bandwidth can be paid by any revenue generated).
Thus making a profit from it.
a. It's a pipe dream
b. It's illegal
c. Owning the IP doesn't give you the rights to the game engine.
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Oh my god...are we seriously doing this again?
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Your idea has a crucial flaw Bob, it's illegal to make a profit from the SCP.
I never said make a profit from SCP. I said make a profit from the actual Freespace 2 distribution, including paying a commission to members of this community (SCP coders) to update the engine. If they want SCP--include a link to download it (again--free. If it must be paid for--bandwidth can be paid by any revenue generated).
Thus making a profit from it.
a. It's a pipe dream
b. It's illegal
c. Owning the IP doesn't give you the rights to the game engine.
Geeze--read the difference between the original Freespace IP and the new SCP additions. Anyways--owning the IP, at the very least, lets us distribute the game. Pipe dream or not--the day is still coming and someones going to do something eventually. As for owning the engine--it's already open source but licensed to be distributed for profit (AKA revenue).
One last time:
1) Buy the Freespace IP for $xx,xxx
2) Sell copies of Freespace, Silent Threat, and Freespace 2 to make back at least a large portion of the $xx,xxx spent
3) If viable legally, pay known programmers (preferably from the SCP project, but the newly updated code not "open source") to update the engine to support popular Operating Systems
4) If viable financially, access Volition's willingness to release or purchase anything else Freespace related (such as an expansion pack, all original materials, or possibly another game, be it Freespace 3 or otherwise)
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Your idea has a crucial flaw Bob, it's illegal to make a profit from the SCP.
I never said make a profit from SCP. I said make a profit from the actual Freespace 2 distribution, including paying a commission to members of this community (SCP coders) to update the engine. If they want SCP--include a link to download it (again--free. If it must be paid for--bandwidth can be paid by any revenue generated).
Thus making a profit from it.
a. It's a pipe dream
b. It's illegal
c. Owning the IP doesn't give you the rights to the game engine.
Geeze--read the difference between the original Freespace IP and the new SCP additions. Anyways--owning the IP, at the very least, lets us distribute the game. Pipe dream or not--the day is still coming and someones going to do something eventually. As for owning the engine--it's already open source but licensed to be distributed for profit (AKA revenue).
One last time:
1) Buy the Freespace IP for $xx,xxx
2) Sell copies of Freespace, Silent Threat, and Freespace 2 to make back at least a large portion of the $xx,xxx spent
3) If viable legally, pay known programmers (preferably from the SCP project, but the newly updated code not "open source") to update the engine to support popular Operating Systems
4) If viable financially, access Volition's willingness to release or purchase anything else Freespace related (such as an expansion pack, all original materials, or possibly another game, be it Freespace 3 or otherwise)
It's not liscenced to be distributed for profit, it's open source ONLY UNDER the provision that it NOT be used for profit.
1) You can't, it's not just $xx,xxx, try $xxx,xxx,xxx. Plus, Interplay probably won't part with it, and if they do, they'll probably put all sorts of stipulations on it, like you have to develop a game within X amount of time (like Fallout).
2) You can't, no one wants to buy a 7-8 year old game. You're a fanboy, we're all fanboys, of course we're going to want to buy it, but I don't know if you've been living under a rock for the past 10 years or so, so let me spell it out for you; no one wants to buy space games these days. EVE online, arguably the most successful one out there, isn't even a space game, it's an MMO, and that only has about 130,000 people playing.
3) Good luck with that.
4) Hah, yea right. Most of the original [V] staff is gone, and the ones that are still around are controlled by THQ.
You really have a massive lack of understanding of the industry as a hole, and just how old FS2 is, not to mention how old that this style of gaming is. Case in point; the interface. We can navigate it easily, we think it's really easy to use. One of the biggest problems with the BTRL release was people not getting how to use an interface that was designed for a more tech-savvy generation of gamers who weren't used to console interfaces.
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The lisence wouldn't be that expensive as you said:
2) You can't, no one wants to buy a 7-8 year old game. You're a fanboy, we're all fanboys, of course we're going to want to buy it, but I don't know if you've been living under a rock for the past 10 years or so, so let me spell it out for you; no one wants to buy space games these days.
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Yeah, the IP is fairly cheap, but he's right about everything else there.
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I'd bet buying a license to develop a game in the FS universe is cheap. That's what they did with Fallout 3. (You'd be scuppered if :v: have first refusal though).
I doubt buying the entire IP (i.e getting Interplay to relinquish any rights to the game for ever) is cheap at all.
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Your idea has a crucial flaw Bob, it's illegal to make a profit from the SCP.
I never said make a profit from SCP. I said make a profit from the actual Freespace 2 distribution, including paying a commission to members of this community (SCP coders) to update the engine. If they want SCP--include a link to download it (again--free. If it must be paid for--bandwidth can be paid by any revenue generated).
Thus making a profit from it.
a. It's a pipe dream
b. It's illegal
c. Owning the IP doesn't give you the rights to the game engine.
Geeze--read the difference between the original Freespace IP and the new SCP additions. Anyways--owning the IP, at the very least, lets us distribute the game. Pipe dream or not--the day is still coming and someones going to do something eventually. As for owning the engine--it's already open source but licensed to be distributed for profit (AKA revenue).
One last time:
1) Buy the Freespace IP for $xx,xxx
2) Sell copies of Freespace, Silent Threat, and Freespace 2 to make back at least a large portion of the $xx,xxx spent
3) If viable legally, pay known programmers (preferably from the SCP project, but the newly updated code not "open source") to update the engine to support popular Operating Systems
4) If viable financially, access Volition's willingness to release or purchase anything else Freespace related (such as an expansion pack, all original materials, or possibly another game, be it Freespace 3 or otherwise)
It's not liscenced to be distributed for profit, it's open source ONLY UNDER the provision that it NOT be used for profit.
1) You can't, it's not just $xx,xxx, try $xxx,xxx,xxx. Plus, Interplay probably won't part with it, and if they do, they'll probably put all sorts of stipulations on it, like you have to develop a game within X amount of time (like Fallout).
2) You can't, no one wants to buy a 7-8 year old game. You're a fanboy, we're all fanboys, of course we're going to want to buy it, but I don't know if you've been living under a rock for the past 10 years or so, so let me spell it out for you; no one wants to buy space games these days. EVE online, arguably the most successful one out there, isn't even a space game, it's an MMO, and that only has about 130,000 people playing.
3) Good luck with that.
4) Hah, yea right. Most of the original [V] staff is gone, and the ones that are still around are controlled by THQ.
You really have a massive lack of understanding of the industry as a hole, and just how old FS2 is, not to mention how old that this style of gaming is. Case in point; the interface. We can navigate it easily, we think it's really easy to use. One of the biggest problems with the BTRL release was people not getting how to use an interface that was designed for a more tech-savvy generation of gamers who weren't used to console interfaces.
1) If they want a new game... what can we do? Depending on the issues--it could be possible that we simply buy the IP license and can redistribute the game. If they have all those clauses on buying the IP... again, what can we do? Other than negotiate about it... not much really. I'm sure they'd be fine with absorbing, for example, a percentage of the profits.
2) There's probably enough people who would go legal to break even, despite the now-deceased market.
3) There are always programmers for C and C++... it's just that the SCP coders already know what to do. If the ability to change the engine (aka patch) is given to us, then we can do whatever we want with the engine license without breaking an agreement with :v:. Again--even if it's unchangeable, it's still better to have something to go on.
4) Enough of the writers and other senior staff are around. Individual art isn't THAT important when compared to the storyline. Again--if nothing else, it should give us a serious bartering chip to get all of the original material off of :v:'s tape backups.
Buying the entire IP would be more expensive, no doubt. Still--it's going to be much less than, for example, the Fallout IP. That game was already successful and the market is still there. The Freespace IP is different--it never sold that well in the beginning and the market is basically gone for now. It'll be significantly more than we would want to spend.
I'd be happy just to be able to buy a legal copy of Freespace 2 for less than the $50+ copies at eBay.
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4) Enough of the writers and other senior staff are around. Individual art isn't THAT important when compared to the storyline. Again--if nothing else, it should give us a serious bartering chip to get all of the original material off of 's tape backups.
They never thought about the story much beyond FS2, and a story is a relatively minor part of a game in any case. You can't make a game out of just a story.
As for the backups, they're willing to give us that already but the tapes containing most of the stuff are damaged if I remember right.
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As for the backups, they're willing to give us that already but the tapes containing most of the stuff are damaged if I remember right.
IIRC, they're damaged, but recoverable. It'd just cost a lot to do so.
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What's this about fs2 being distributed illegally? I thought it was abandonware and therefore could be distributed freely like it was. Home of the underdogs, the installer downloads, shiv's compilation fs2 download, hip63's dvd installer compilation release, torrenting, and that one website where the iso's are up for download directly. I also forgot the ftp servers where the files are for download manually (back in 2004 at least).
I'm sure people wouldn't go through such obvious maneuvers to getting a game out if it were illegal or many asses here would have been toasted already. I understand that fs2 is abandonware and many people understand that too, and have taken advantage of that fact of fs2 for years. Modifying the engine is allowable, but selling any part of fs2 (unless it be the user created graphics and models) is of course illegal.
The only obvious questionable thing here is distributing fs1 + silent threat. And that's where the port comes into bypass distributing the fs1 + silent threat directly.
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I saw this thread title and got excited. Then I realised nobody wanted to give me money after all and I was sad. Then I read the proposal and thought it was a silly idea because it woudln't serve any useful purpose. Since releasing a new Freespace sequel commercially would be financially suicidal, and my mate Dave could release a Freespace sequel non-commercially without buying the IP. Of course most people in the Freespace community would rightly frown on anything labelled as Freespace 3 but not involving any of the original producers, as discussed many times here. Seriously, the pointlessness of this thread is just astonishing.
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What's this about fs2 being distributed illegally? I thought it was abandonware and therefore could be distributed freely like it was.
Abandonware is not a legal definition. It's definitely not the same thing as abandoning a trade mark (which it's pretty obvious :v: haven't done anyway). Abandonware = Stuff that's old and forgotten about that I think I can get away with copying.
Now while you mention lots of things that have been done with the FS2 IP if we ever got a cease and desist letter from :v: or Interplay we would have to stop doing all those things. We haven't cause Interplay doesn't seem to care. If FS2 really was legal to distribute we'd have gone a lot further than we have done.
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We still could never charge for it. We haven't had a controlled enough dev environment. If it got out that one person created something for it using an illegal copy of some high-profile software, we'd probably all be hosed. Not charging money is the only way we could ever distribute it.
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How much further for putting fs2 out there for free can this community do :lol: It's already over the top, i listed the top/all ways to get fs2 already :)
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Well for a start if it were Freeware we could get it on some magazine coverdisks with a bunch of big mods. That would probably do more to get the game out there on it's own than anything else we've done so far.
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That's an awesome idea. So far the only part of fs that we could do that with is the scp binaries and the mvp's along with an instruction with the notice "hope you got fs2 install discs".
Unless V is trying to do something, i hope that they make the game freeware eventually.
EDIT: I'm also curious as to the few yearly times that V visits this place that do they ever ***** about the many ways to get fs on a computer that the hlpbb offers? I mean they had to notice, it is public announcement around here when some new and easier way of getting fs comes about.
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Last time I remember anyone from :v: actually visiting was when Dave B said that he'd like to see Stencilled Shadows in the engine. That was years ago (FS2_Open 3.5.5 or earlier IIRC). Haven't seen anyone since.
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If anyone would be coming after you for distributing the game files, wouldn't that be Interplay rather then Volition anyways? Not that they've shown any interest in doing so of course.
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No. Volition are refreshingly chilled out and sane. Other parties probably don't know.
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If anyone would be coming after you for distributing the game files, wouldn't that be Interplay rather then Volition anyways? Not that they've shown any interest in doing so of course.
My guess would be that either of them would have legal standing to sue you.
Copyright Information
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FreeSpace 2 (c) 1999 by Volition, Inc. All rights reserved.
Portions (c) 1999 Interplay Productions. All rights reserved.
FreeSpace 2, Interplay, the Interplay Logo, and "By Gamers. For Gamers." are trademarks of Interplay Productions. Windows(r) 95 is a registered trademark of Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved. Exclusively licensed and distributed by Interplay Productions. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.
At the very least they've got you on Trademark infringement.
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Yeah, but it's the part where it says "Exclusively licensed and distributed by Interplay Productions" that would probably prompt a response, if it was going to. Volition might own the trademark, but as I recall Interplay owns the rights to actually make/sell games using that setting. And of the two entities only [V] has made any overtures of goodwill towards the mod community, Interplay just ignores it.
I've always been curious why a company in Interplay's financial straits didn't sell off the rights to the Freespace IP, (considering it was a failure at retail in a large part due to their failure to adequately market it (for fear it would undermine a Star Trek game or something? I've forgotten the details)) back when space shooters were actually still somewhat popular. At least they didn't sell it to Derek Smart, probably the only positive thing I can say about how Interplay has handled the IP.
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I fully agree that Interplay are the more likely to start something. I'm just saying that I think both of them could.
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Maybe the head honchos at Interplay are fans of FS too? Anyways, I doubt there's any chance that Interplay and Volition (If there are even any of the original developers left) are going to make a new FS game.
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Leaving the the FS2 community to its own devices and letting it keep itself alive is a good business decision for both parties. I'd imagine that the value for the Freespace rights would shoot up if anybody bothered to look, because they'd know they'd have a guaranteed audience and publicity (provided it wasn't utter ****, in which case that could work against them...)
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Seriously, the pointlessness of this thread is just astonishing.
I'm halfway through law school, and seriously -- obtaining the 'IP' (by which I'm sure everyone just means obtaining the development/distribution rights) is a lot more complicated and costly than you guys think. I wouldn't even bother myself with the idea at all.
Here you have a game engine which has been turned over as open source, free to be used so long as no profit is made from it. This community has already taken it one step further by using not just the engine, but the story elements, the VPs, etc. which were probably never intended to be released for free. The simple answer to the 'worst case scenario' situation (ie: someone like Derek Smart buys the IP rights to develop a proper FS3) is really just that in that case, the SCP continues its work doing things as they please and someone writes an entirely new story, someone else designs all new ships, and the community releases a game devoid of Vasudans, Shivans, et. al.
If the worst case scenario is that the SCP team would have to create a new universe where Farks at war with Bluedogs or some other crazy storyline, that's not so bad -- the real prize here is the (at this point) heavily modified engine. Everything else is just window dressing, no reason to panic.
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This is funny.
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This is funny.
agree :lol:
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AFAIK Interplay doesn't like FS2 that much since they couldn't even get off their asses enough to get the right system requirements on their website.