Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Colonol Dekker on September 29, 2009, 02:53:50 pm
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First a summary-
Recently I managed to form a relationship at work an older woman (35, I'm 27) who is widely regarded as one of the 'top 5' no mean feat if you consider that the building houses no less than four and a half thousand people. I put this down to familiarity, initial attraction, similar interests, overt confidence and a touch of youth. - I'm a very chatty person and quite smooth under the right conditions. I was getting everything, emotional and physical satisfaction. No complaints from her, no complaints from me. The term 'clicked' was made for us. No less than two weeks after I did what I always do and ended it based on a variety of reasons none of which make sense in hindright. As a quick pre-note I'm the proud owner of an A grade in A-Level psychology so any quips on that note are redundant, the only reason I didn't attend university is because I was overly eager to join up which yielded six years of proud service in the British Army. Intelligence is not an issue.
Now the crux of the post.
I'm perfectly capable of settling, for those not in the know I'm a divorced dad of two. Split at the humble age of 22. The woman was a tad unfaithful. Understandable, I was away for quite a while. That's unrelated and I'm simply stating that I can commit. Five years is an age and I'm old enough and have put this behind me long ago.
I guess I just enjoy freedom of choice. I'm not thirty yet and enjoy going out with my mates and ' testing the water' as it were. There will be plenty of time for that when I'm thirty. For the record I got married young. We're talking boy soldier days here. So I think I may be trying to re-experience some lost youth.
There isn't much point to this. I was just wondering away on the train where the heck my life's going and thought it'd make for some interesting discussion.
I'm not EVER going into my injuries. So don't ask.
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So do you feel like it's a problem or don’t you? Do you think you're sabotaging relationships that you would really prefer to continue, or are you reasonably happy with short-term arrangements for the moment?
Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with keeping things light if that's where your life is right now. You may want to make sure your partners are on board with this, so as to minimize disappointment all around, but if commitment isn't your thing at the moment then go with what works. 27 is pretty young, all things considered (though, granted, still older than me :p), and it seems like you have time to sort out what you're looking for. The only problem I can see is that it may be a little more difficult to find people in the age group you seem to favor who are similarly inclined to keep things casual, but you don't seem to have much trouble there.
So basically, if this feels like a problem to you then maybe you should take a good look at whatever impulse is making you withdraw from these relationships. But if you're happy and satisfied with the relationships you have, however brief, then just go with it and try to find partners who are looking for the same thing.
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I've got a neutral opinon on it Rain, i have no idea how old you are but.....................
That is EXACTLY what i needed to hear, :nod: excellent. At best i'm happy, at worst i thought i was being a bit stuck in the past with regards to "Sod stability" but i can happily continue now i've had some validation from a member of the "opposing team" (no offense)..
You consistently impress me with the insight into RL situations and responses. GB had better appreciate. Smoothies/Milkshakes etc.
:yes:
Discussion still open to all, although i'm pretty content (as mentioned) feel free to continue.
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Dude, we actually were just going to get milkshakes.
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:lol:
No worries, lol.
Topic stands.
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Hmm, could be a variant of Asperger's Syndrome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociological_and_cultural_aspects_of_autism#Asperger_syndrome_and_interpersonal_relationships), or not as you don't seem to have problems forming intimate relationships, merely retaining them.
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Frakking.... not everyone who's a little off-kilter has Asperger's.
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Frakking.... not everyone who's a little off-kilter has Asperger's.
People (amateurs) make self-associations when they jump to conclusions in making diagnoses.
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Hmm, could be a variant of Asperger's Syndrome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociological_and_cultural_aspects_of_autism#Asperger_syndrome_and_interpersonal_relationships), or not as you don't seem to have problems forming intimate relationships, merely retaining them.
No.
It's definitely not Asperger's.
Not remotely.
A single glance at the DSM-IV criteria would establish that.
(I) Qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:
(A) marked impairments in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body posture, and gestures to regulate social interaction
(B) failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level
(C) a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interest or achievements with other people, (e.g.. by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest to other people)
(D) lack of social or emotional reciprocity
(II) Restricted repetitive & stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests and activities, as manifested by at least one of the following:
(A) encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus
(B) apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals
(C) stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g. hand or finger flapping or twisting, or complex whole-body movements)
(D) persistent preoccupation with parts of objects
(III) The disturbance causes clinically significant impairments in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.
(IV) There is no clinically significant general delay in language (E.G. single words used by age 2 years, communicative phrases used by age 3 years)
(V) There is no clinically significant delay in cognitive development or in the development of age-appropriate self help skills, adaptive behavior (other than in social interaction) and curiosity about the environment in childhood.
Dekker is about as far from this as he can get given that he's all over the relationships at peer level (ahead of the curve if anything.)
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i think i have that.
i tend to **** up relationships pretty quickly. they all just realize im bat**** insane and move along. i should just stick with hookers.
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Well, since I don't have, have never had and probably never will have an intimate relationship, perhaps I'm projecting my own supposition about myself. I was trying to find the wiki article that I read about a disorder where people, mostly white males, have an inability to form complex personal relationships with anyone. Said people don't have friends, mates or children and it's often coupled with clinical depression since we are all socialized/genetically programmed to need companionship, but I couldn't find it.
Everyone needs a hand to hold and a shoulder to cry on, as they say.
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or a hole to **** :D
like i said, hookers.
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The syndromes to Asperger's syndrome can manifest themselves in practically any mental health problem, and so unless you have practically ALL of the symptoms listed, it is highly unlikely that you have it.
People will not stop trying to diagnose me with that stupid syndrome and I know I don't have it.
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Probably not Asperger's.
... Might be Dekkerger's. :p
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Technically that's alchaholism :p
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[NRA Voice]
Boose doesn't kill relationships, people do!
You can take this Hefeweizen out of my cold dead hand.
[/NRA Voice]
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I'm actually shocked. I've never heard of that beer!
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Hefeweizen is just the type; specifically refers to wheat beer in its traditional, unfiltered form. I personally like Helles Hefe Weiss brewed by Tucher.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheat_beer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheat_beer)
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What does the NRA have to do with alcohol?
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I think StarSlayer copied their "Guns don't kill, people do" advert.
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Blimey, this one got complicated in a hurry.
From an Englishman's point of view (I say this because traditionally we don't really have much time for all that mind-bending business), the Colonel here sounds completely normal. A guy in his twenties in no hurry to settle down? Nothing weird or mental about that at all. I've got another buddy just turned 40 who still loves chasing (and catching) young tail. It's just how he is.
Yep, when I was your age (not that long ago at all!) I was still busy chasing after various small foreign women. Now one of them's had me by the nuts for two and a half years...
So no, there's nowt wrong with you Dekker. Folks settle down later these days anyway. Beats getting another divorce! :)
Bit more concerned about Liberator though. Surely things ain't that bad?
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Here's one i genuinely coined a while back much to the amusement of my brothers girlfriend.
"Women are like tins of salmon, as long as you can put in the effort to wear down the outer layer, or have a good opener you're guaranteed to get at the pink fishy goodness."
Make of it what you will.
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Pink fishy goodness... fishy goodness... fishy...
Well, I won't be in the mood for any shagging tonight now.
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Bit more concerned about Liberator though. Surely things ain't that bad?
Oh, they can be. I'm hovering at 23, and I've never so much as kissed a girl, let alone had a sniff of a relationship. You kind of get used to it eventually, though. :p
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Dekker I think you're normal. I hope thats not an insult :)
I'm the same age as you and I'm all over the place right now. I've not formed an actual relationship in a while...well until very recently. But until that I was all over the place, doing my own thing, being myself, wanting to be with someone but not really finding myself interested in any one person. I wouldn't even get as far as you... not more than a single date sometimes. I'd torture myself over it all too.
Now...peoples perspectives on this differ...some say 27 is still young. Some say 27 is getting there and you'd better figure it out soon. I think you may be fighting yourself as I think I am. There are so many different impulses all colliding together around this age and it freaks you out so not long into a relationship you want to run the other way and quickly. I know thats sort of how I'm at although right now I'm doing everything I can to stop myself from running.
Its a bit rough in places right now. I hope that sometime into my 30s I figure it out and settle down. For now I guess there's a bit of a thrill in being totally in the unknown.
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Bit more concerned about Liberator though. Surely things ain't that bad?
Oh, they can be. I'm hovering at 23, and I've never so much as kissed a girl, let alone had a sniff of a relationship. You kind of get used to it eventually, though. :p
You get used to it...you can even convince yourself that its fine and ok and you're just doing your own thing. Which is cool. But at some point you're going to realize that you'd like to do something with someone else and they just don't exist. Right now all of my friends are getting married. I don't even care about the marriage thing yet...but I'd sure as hell loved to have taken someone special with me to all of these weddings. Picking up at wedding is a myth as far as I can tell...everyone is already taken at these events.
So... while it sounds a bit like the blind leading the blind. I've discovered that if you want to be in a relationship you need to do the following things:
1) Focus on yourself and yourself only for a while. Everyone has character flaws. Focus on one of yours and do something about it. If that means involving yourself in an activity that you find immensely uncomfortable but you've always secretly wanted to do it...then go for it. Join a team, a club, something. Not for picking up or even for meeting people. This is about you.
2) Doing step one helps build your own self confidence. This takes time...be in it for the long haul. This isn't something you're doing as a necessary evil. Eventually you've got to like what you're doing an embrace it. So step 2 is really just accepting what you've done in step 1. This also makes you interesting because you do things and you have interests, opinions, and so on and so forth.
3) IF you meet someone and you like them then don't do what I've done so many times before. Do something about it. Wait a week if you want...but after you realize it stop pinning away in the background. Just confront the situation and tell the girl you like her. It can go two ways both of which are good for you: 1) She likes you back and loves how you've come out and said it. 2) She doesn't/is involved/whatever and you can move on. Be prepared to move on no matter what. If it works out then great!
Step 3 is so damn easy to say and so bloody hard to do. Trust me I know ... one thing you cannot do to yourself is keep setting milestones about kissing girls and that sort of thing. It hurts you more than anything. Society is setup to measure these as signs of success but psychologically they do more harm than good for a great many people.
I hope this advice was not too unsolicited but right now I'm in the middle of being all messed up myself about virtually my entire life and giving out some advice makes me feel better so if anything I'm doing step 1 right now (and 2 ... and 3) and focusing on me and if it helps someone else out then good! :D
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Here's the thing that people have touched on, but no one has actually said.
A woman's base instinct is to find a strong male to protect her children. A man's base instinct is to plant his seed.
Women feel the biological clock ticking, and men feel pressure from the knowledge of it. When we start to think about committing to a woman, it all looks grand on the surface, June Cleaver baking and vacuming in a dress , and all of that. Then we see ourselves going to work, and coming home to a dull life. We've all been through this before and know that those little quirks that were once so cute can grow into HUGE annoyances. We get a bit scred of that emotionally, because we don't want things to change for the worst. If they are becoming annoying, so are we, and there is always at least a small insecurity, saying anything else would be a lie.
So instead of dealing with the no longer cute now annoying bound to fight and ruin it all, we have a fall back. PLant seeds. Hell I'm just following my base instinct. I'm a guy, it's what guys do.
I guess the thing is, if we stop growing together, we grow apart. That's where the fights start, that's what we are really afraid of, waking up one morning and saying, who the hell is this and where is the girl I married? The worst part is knowing the answer, she grew in a different direction.
For me the answer was simple and yet hard to swallow, grow together. Always grow together. It's one of the reasons that I left the FS communities nearly 4 years ago. So that I could grow with her. Now i'm back, and things are better for me both here, and at home.
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A woman's base instinct is to find a strong male to protect her children. A man's base instinct is to plant his seed.
This is a hoary cliche of dubious worth. Not no worth, mind. But dubious worth.
In actuality men and women pursue sex (this is for sex, mind, not relationships) for exactly the same reasons, at least according to confidential self-reported poll data, n = large.
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IceFire, the advice is appreciated and it would probably work for most people.
Except for that one in a million, like myself, who's defining flaw is that I fail. No matter what I do, I fail. About the only thing I haven't failed at in life is sleeping and even that is in question.
So, I chose the safe choice, I give up.
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:(
There's gotta be someone, somewhere out there.
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I dunno, I used to think so, but not any more. Not that I'm a desirable catch anyway, I have no job, no money, and second class education and no prospects.
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Liberator: probably your only real flaw is the fact you have little confidence. Start doing things for yourself, selfish things. Not too many mind, but it helps.
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What would you suggest exactly, I'm not particularly good at anything. The things I think I'm good at I get shown how abject a failure I am at them.
My greatest triumph was placing 3rd place in a statewide competition when I was a junior in high school. The latest in a long line of failures was when circumstances forced me to extend my commute to and from the job I had at the time from 35 min to 110. This continued for over a year until my performance dropped to a level where my boss called me in to fire me and I admitted I'd been on the verge of quitting so we called it a wash. This is the same job that I never got a raise or even a "good job" at, after working there for 3 yrs. So what does that say about me when I can't even muster a "good work" from an employer at a job I loved.
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IceFire, the advice is appreciated and it would probably work for most people.
Except for that one in a million, like myself, who's defining flaw is that I fail. No matter what I do, I fail. About the only thing I haven't failed at in life is sleeping and even that is in question.
So, I chose the safe choice, I give up.
Safe is never satisfying....and this is coming from me who I personally self identify as being risk adverse.
I don't know you very well and I don't know your situation in life or anything like that but I do go by a fairly simple rule that you can make your life what you more or less want it to be if you're willing to fight for it. I'm not personally the kind of person who had an easy ride of it...some things yes and I'm thankful for those...other things not. So I have trained myself to fight for whatever it is that I want. And often I screw it up royally...and dammit does it hurt... but failure isn't really an option.
So... like I said in my post above. You need to focus on you for a while and develop something of yourself. Set some realistic goals, write them down on a piece of paper, stick it up on your wall wherever you work/study/game/etc and make that something you start thinking about a lot. Eventually the thinking will turn to doing and you'll be on your way.
Don't be afraid to seek out some help either. Could be temp agency or career counselling... family member, friend, whatever... Sometimes its just networking and getting yourself out there.
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What would you suggest exactly, I'm not particularly good at anything. The things I think I'm good at I get shown how abject a failure I am at them.
My greatest triumph was placing 3rd place in a statewide competition when I was a junior in high school. The latest in a long line of failures was when circumstances forced me to extend my commute to and from the job I had at the time from 35 min to 110. This continued for over a year until my performance dropped to a level where my boss called me in to fire me and I admitted I'd been on the verge of quitting so we called it a wash. This is the same job that I never got a raise or even a "good job" at, after working there for 3 yrs. So what does that say about me when I can't even muster a "good work" from an employer at a job I loved.
I'll reply to this one too :)
Thats a speedbump... but keep going. The next time you have a scenario like the one you talked about above...ask your boss, find out what you were doing wrong, make some notes. Maybe even before you get to the point of quitting/being fired. I've been in trouble before too...I didn't ask and I kept going and things were getting worse and worse. I was lucky enough to have a co-worker who pulled me aside and gave me a proper ass kicking in the metaphorical sense and thats what I needed.
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You realize it's like asking the sun to stop being hot or a black hole to stop sucking everything in around it. I can't even make myself happy.
All the career counseling in the world can't help when you don't know what you want to do yourself. It took me 7 years to gain an AS in Computer Science Technology with a 2.somethingorother GPA. SEVEN YEARS! How in God's name am I supposed to finish a BS in anything when it took me that long to achieve something that simple in such a mediocre way. As has been seen on this forum over and over again, I am a dullard of the first order.
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You're not that bad, man.
You do sound really depressed, though. Have you checked out medical help? It's nothing to be ashamed of, and if you're depressed, it's a very real, very treatable disease.
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Geez, Bat, you make me sound like a some kinda cry baby or something...
*looks at previous posts*
...oh wait...
Seriously, another of my faults is I don't get emotionally invested in anything very easily. High school? Not even a blip. College even less so. I have the emotional range of one-eyed badger.
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Being depressed isn't being a crybaby. It's a problem that can be fixed, like many chronic diseases. And the instinct to play down your unhappiness is what prevents people from getting help.
This is an age of technology. People don't have to suffer this kind of crap. Get advice on how to meet people (very important!) and medication if you need it - just don't let yourself get pills pushed on you willy-nilly.
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As weird as this will sound, bear with me I tend to use this method in time organisation sometimes when i'm hungover. .imagine you're a SIM and decide which of your stats (tidy, social, hunger etc) needs a little attention. Try and get a balance, no point being completely satisfied / a consumate expert in one area, while neglecting others.
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As long as you have a roof on your head and stuff to eat, you can make yourself not give a crap about most of the other things you don't have. Being able to ignore the sensation of starving to death would be unreasonable to expect, but most other things...not really. They just don't matter. As long as you think they do, you'll have a problem. You don't need to have anything.
I bet most people's depression stems from their own expectations for their life (such as in terms of social interactions, status and significance), which they've absorbed from the rest of society. Use your head and think about things in a critical manner and sooner or later you'll realize most of those expectations are pointless and you lose the reasons to be unhappy for not meeting them.
Yes, I bet there's depression of purely medical origins, hence "most" and not "all". Still, being zen enough probably still works as a vaccine for that, too.
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Thanks for the advice, IceFire. :) To be perfectly honest, I think my own first step has to be seeking out some sort of counseling or psychiatric help, since I've become more and more convinced over the past few years that some things just aren't completely right upstairs. Part of that is the situation I find myself in at the moment: not only have I never had any sort of romantic relationship (or even a major crush, as far as I know), I also have maybe one actual friend at the most, and I don't have a job to boot. Hell, I don't speak to anyone on a daily basis other than my immediate family members in my own house. I do have a group of good online friends that I talk to on a semi-nightly basis, but of course that really isn't entirely the same thing. I'm kind of at a going-nowhere place in my life right now, I think I've been there for some time, and I don't think I have the motivation or wherewithal to get myself out of it. You are right in saying that I do sometimes (often?) wish I could actually be doing things with another person I'm close to, but at the same time, I'm okay on a day-to-day basis with not having said person; I've always been very introverted by nature, and I'm generally most comfortable when by myself. Of course, that doesn't preclude the fact that I really need to talk to a professional about any number of things; in fact, some of that might be the symptoms of what needs talking about.
And seriously, Liberator, coming from someone who recognizes that he probably needs help, you definitely need to talk to someone yourself. Like Battuta said, what you're describing goes way beyond being a "cry-baby." The brain can get as sick as any other part of the body, and just as you'd go to a doctor to cure your physical wounds, you need to talk to someone experienced in such matters to deal with the sort of problems that can't be healed with stitches.
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I......wasn't going to post here originally, as I really am the sort of person that tries to keep himself to himself, even on forums. To my own detriment, I sometimes think. But having read the posts by Mongoose, Liberator and IceFire, I feel a bit....not sure, "moved" I suppose to just say that I feel like I'm in the same boat, in several respects.
Not sure I really want to go into details about my situation, but IceFire - that does seem to be some sound advice that could apply to me.
Anyone up for a group hug?
...No pressure. :nervous:
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As weird as this will sound, bear with me I tend to use this method in time organisation sometimes when i'm hungover. .imagine you're a SIM and decide which of your stats (tidy, social, hunger etc) needs a little attention. Try and get a balance, no point being completely satisfied / a consumate expert in one area, while neglecting others.
This....makes so much sense. It's too obvious.
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Seriously, another of my faults is I don't get emotionally invested in anything very easily. High school? Not even a blip. College even less so. I have the emotional range of one-eyed badger.
That's actually That can actually be a symptom of depression. I'll leave it to the psychologists and pharmacologists to go into why because I am definitely not an authority on this subject. But I have observed emotional disconnection to be a very real aspect of depression both in myself and others. It isn't all breaking down and weeping all the time. That's just the Hollywood version of depression. Makes better melodrama.
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I......wasn't going to post here originally, as I really am the sort of person that tries to keep himself to himself, even on forums. To my own detriment, I sometimes think. But having read the posts by Mongoose, Liberator and IceFire, I feel a bit....not sure, "moved" I suppose to just say that I feel like I'm in the same boat, in several respects.
Not sure I really want to go into details about my situation, but IceFire - that does seem to be some sound advice that could apply to me.
Anyone up for a group hug?
...No pressure. :nervous:
GROUP HUG!
once we get another couple people.
personally, i don't invest myself emotionally in much lately, but i an happy about it and with myself.i used to be sad, then i stopped being sad and starting being awsome. true story.
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Liberator: apathy, lack of interest... actually that does sound like depression. Happens to lots of folks during their lives, including Winston Churchill. It's usually quite fixable; mine was. And judging by your grammar, you aren't a dumbass!
Mongoose: sounds like you're a bit of a late starter. Maybe that's all there is to it. I was still goofing around wearing NHS specs and studying while the jocks were off scoring. Looking at them now, they're all way fatter and balder than me, and they ultimately ended up doing way worse with the ladies. Might be time to start getting your crap together soon though - don't wanna leave it too late and miss the boat. I got friends heading that way right now.
ShadowWolf does have a point there. Being a pussy (for want of a better word) is not going to help with the girls. Put it this way, as an extreme example: to be serial womaniser and cheat like buggery you have to be a bastard. But is the guy a bastard because he sleeps around, or does he get to sleep around because he is a bastard? Either way, he's a bastard getting laid. I know a lot of folks don't like hearing this kind of take on the situation and may even find it offensive (hope not), but it is honestly what I've seen and experienced. What a world, huh?
Of course, you don't have to be a total git, and it's best if you aren't if you don't want a nagging conscience as you get older. But last time I went really soft it made for one heck of a barren patch. Go figure. Dekker's a naughty (but thankfully normal) boy; he knows what I'm talking about.
This is turning into one interesting discussion. It's certainly allowing people to get stuff out they wouldn't normally talk about. Hopefully it's proving useful too.
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Thanks for the advice, IceFire. :) To be perfectly honest, I think my own first step has to be seeking out some sort of counseling or psychiatric help, since I've become more and more convinced over the past few years that some things just aren't completely right upstairs. Part of that is the situation I find myself in at the moment: not only have I never had any sort of romantic relationship (or even a major crush, as far as I know), I also have maybe one actual friend at the most, and I don't have a job to boot. Hell, I don't speak to anyone on a daily basis other than my immediate family members in my own house. I do have a group of good online friends that I talk to on a semi-nightly basis, but of course that really isn't entirely the same thing. I'm kind of at a going-nowhere place in my life right now, I think I've been there for some time, and I don't think I have the motivation or wherewithal to get myself out of it. You are right in saying that I do sometimes (often?) wish I could actually be doing things with another person I'm close to, but at the same time, I'm okay on a day-to-day basis with not having said person; I've always been very introverted by nature, and I'm generally most comfortable when by myself. Of course, that doesn't preclude the fact that I really need to talk to a professional about any number of things; in fact, some of that might be the symptoms of what needs talking about.
And seriously, Liberator, coming from someone who recognizes that he probably needs help, you definitely need to talk to someone yourself. Like Battuta said, what you're describing goes way beyond being a "cry-baby." The brain can get as sick as any other part of the body, and just as you'd go to a doctor to cure your physical wounds, you need to talk to someone experienced in such matters to deal with the sort of problems that can't be healed with stitches.
I'm glad what I said might be useful ... I'm in a bit of a spot myself right now but its a weird thing where giving some advice out sometimes helps put yourself into perspective. Often its easier to give advice than to follow it...even yourself. So I'm trying to follow my own advice as much as I am trying to help anyone else out that I can.
The going nowhere thing a great number of people I know are dealing with right now. They tend to be males in their mid-20s but not always. I know quite a few of my female friends as well with the same feelings. The economy is down, people don't have jobs, or have jobs they don't like, they are stuck in a situation they can't seemingly get out of. I'm in there somewhere too and as I'm writing this I'm absolutely furious about some things that happened today but this is a huge improvement over me 2 years ago which wasn't really registering on anything and being at best passive-aggressive in situations.
I think its great that you recognize that maybe you need to seek out some professional advice. MOST people do not have things completely together and being the sort of person I am tend to notice that most people have a mental health issue of one kind or another even if they themselves think they are perfectly fine. Sometimes you need help. Sometimes its purely a psychological issue that you need to work out and sometimes its one of those more tricky chemical/structural issues that requires medication of one kind or another. I actually take a couple of vitamins (based on my doctors recommendation) on a daily basis now to help me out...especially during the winter months. Its made a huge difference.
So ... if you think you need it then go for it. Nothing at all to be ashamed of.
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Just remember it's also very easy to blame brain chemistry for bad psychological habits and a simple self-sustaining lack of confidence. I say that from experience. Don't use a diagnosis as a crutch.
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Exercise, diet, and social interaction are certainly all good ways to attack depression.
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Exactly. The easiest cure for depression is an absence of boredom.
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Yes...but a long depressive episode may not respond to such treatment alone. It's a tricky decision.
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Actually McCall, I honestly beleive that I know the reason that women come out of the woodwork when we are spoken for. Bear with me.
It has been my experience, and the experience of a lot of my cohorts, that when in a relationship, the offers and general hitting on is very strong. The same can be said of things during and after my divorce, when I wanted nothing to do with women at all, in my opinion, what was the sense, they'll either die or screw you over. ( I got over it)
Anyway, the point is, when we are with someone, or otherwise disinclined to look for a relationship, we are comfortable with who we are. We are more ourselves, and because we honestly don't care if we are impressive or not, we carry ourselves with more confidence. We are simply who we are with no nervous pretension, with no care. It is attractive and nearly magnetic to the oposite sex.
I am NOT learned in psychology, nor do I pretend to be, but this is what I honestly beleive to be true, the best way to be attractive, is be comfortable with yourself, without trying. Think about it like this:
A good matial artist should be able to go from position or stance and strike his oponent. Jim Lau, Zen in the Martial Arts, pg 97. The chapter is called "Effortless Effort", and the gist is, only when we stop thinking do we allow what we are to come forth.
I hope this makes sense.
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Thanks for the advice, IceFire. :) To be perfectly honest, I think my own first step has to be seeking out some sort of counseling or psychiatric help, since I've become more and more convinced over the past few years that some things just aren't completely right upstairs. Part of that is the situation I find myself in at the moment: not only have I never had any sort of romantic relationship (or even a major crush, as far as I know), I also have maybe one actual friend at the most, and I don't have a job to boot. Hell, I don't speak to anyone on a daily basis other than my immediate family members in my own house. I do have a group of good online friends that I talk to on a semi-nightly basis, but of course that really isn't entirely the same thing. I'm kind of at a going-nowhere place in my life right now, I think I've been there for some time, and I don't think I have the motivation or wherewithal to get myself out of it. You are right in saying that I do sometimes (often?) wish I could actually be doing things with another person I'm close to, but at the same time, I'm okay on a day-to-day basis with not having said person; I've always been very introverted by nature, and I'm generally most comfortable when by myself. Of course, that doesn't preclude the fact that I really need to talk to a professional about any number of things; in fact, some of that might be the symptoms of what needs talking about.
To be quite honest, I don't think that is something you need help for. Now I don't know your exact circumstances, but I was just like that. Never had a girlfriend, had a handful of people I called friends but knew they were nothing more than acquaintances, liked being mostly by myself, and like you, I wanted somebody to spend time with., but then again didn't care very much if I didn't.
Now things are so much different, I hate being away from the girl I love dearly, and I'm getting married in December. Whats my secret? I don't have one. I started working where I work now when I completed High School. On the application it asked, "What would I like to become better at?" and I put "Talking and getting to know people better." While it took a long while I am better at speaking to groups, ect. But the thing is, I had practice doing it at my job. The say you have to face your fears to get good at something, and they are right.
My advice is to take Ice's first point by far, above the rest. Since the economy is down, it's hard to find a job, but I'd think that it isn't hard at all to find a place that needs a volunteer here and there and you never know what you will learn that may give you a boost self esteem wise. When I started work at my job I didn't know a whole lot, but now I'm a jack of trades workman who still has tons to learn BTW, but who loves it.
So I'd say that is by far the first thing you should do. Go down to the local animal shelter and volunteer there, or maybe a local farm or the like. Then stick with it, even it it seams to be leading nowhere. Let me tell you, I never expected to find the girl of my dreams where I worked at, but you never know what life's little surprises my bring and they are not all for the worst.
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I think we need some motivation...
Too long had we dwelt within the crypts of ourselves,
Subject to the inhibitions of our own insight.
Too long had we feasted on the unsatisfying ash of our own bridges burned,
Consuming the poison despite sensing the need for change.
Waiting, rotting away as we let our own nature steal our own futures from ourselves...
And why is this the case?
...
But no, this is not, this shall not ever, be our fate or fortune...
And thus I say, no, never again, NEVER AGAIN!
And spit from my mouth this hateful ash and sulfur, lo,
Even despite the bitter bile hanging between my teeth...
...Once more to stand, once again to rise...
Ah, NEVER AGAIN, NEVER AGAIN!
So long have we slept decrepit in this hanus state...
NEVER AGAIN, NEVER AGAIN!
For the past is dead and irreversible; pity it not!
So long had we spent dwelling in the caves of our minds,
Lingering on the past or scheming of the future,
But never once lifting a hand to become!
NEVER AGAIN, NEVER AGAIN!
And what, change this ruinous state so as to revel in the feeling?
PAH!
The feeling changes as a whim, absent and cruel as the mouth of Hell!
To this would we serve?
I WILL BE DAMNED BEFORE THEN!
And so, what shall we do? What shall I do? I shall tell you!
I will go onward, unto the end, unto the death...
...Until I can go no further!
The past is an empty husk from which we have already gleaned all that is useful...
...The future is a flux who's shift is captured only by the minds of fools and madmen...
...And just as quickly lost by them, leaving nothing but decay in the present...
But I, but we, shall go on from this present day unto the future,
To conquer it,
To gain that which MUST BE WON!
And if we are in need, we shall take it!
And if we are in want, we shall forge what we require from even the very cradle of abandon that is our lot,
...And I, and we... shall never cease...
And lo, though the Hell riseth up to cast us down,
We charge onward with no doubt or shadow of shame.
And even at the feet, the heel of our oppressor,
We are not swayed.
And I, and we, go forth,
Even unto the Pit itself,
With a tenacity which dictates that I, that we, will not stop...
...Until we have hacked and hewn off the head of the Wyrm himself!
And thus we launch ourselves from this unlivable present forward;
For the past is unreturnable,
And awaiting the dawn of another cheap tomorrow is the pinnacle of stagnation...
We advance towards tomorrow, for there is no other place to go.
And we will press onward until, yes, until there is nowhere left to go...
...Until we have gained what we must gain. Until we have won that which must be achieved!
And yes, verily, we commence,
UNTO THE END, UNTO THE DEATH!
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Actually McCall, I honestly beleive that I know the reason that women come out of the woodwork when we are spoken for. Bear with me.
It has been my experience, and the experience of a lot of my cohorts, that when in a relationship, the offers and general hitting on is very strong. The same can be said of things during and after my divorce, when I wanted nothing to do with women at all, in my opinion, what was the sense, they'll either die or screw you over. ( I got over it)
Anyway, the point is, when we are with someone, or otherwise disinclined to look for a relationship, we are comfortable with who we are. We are more ourselves, and because we honestly don't care if we are impressive or not, we carry ourselves with more confidence. We are simply who we are with no nervous pretension, with no care. It is attractive and nearly magnetic to the oposite sex.
I am NOT learned in psychology, nor do I pretend to be, but this is what I honestly beleive to be true, the best way to be attractive, is be comfortable with yourself, without trying. Think about it like this:
A good matial artist should be able to go from position or stance and strike his oponent. Jim Lau, Zen in the Martial Arts, pg 97. The chapter is called "Effortless Effort", and the gist is, only when we stop thinking do we allow what we are to come forth.
I hope this makes sense.
I have to agree. From what I've seen observing other guys and myself as well is that just about all guys are either two things when actively looking for a relationship.
1. Desperate
2.Unconfident and/or shy in all they do, so they change themselves totally to try to impress the one they are after, and usually fail miserably.
and sometimes it leads to:
3. Playing hard to get thinking they can win the others heard by acting like they don't care if she doesn't like him, or ignoring her when she is just trying to be a friend.
If you are actively hunting a relationship, odds are, you won't find it. Women have some kind of desperation detector built in and they can tell what your after.
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If you are actively hunting a relationship, odds are, you won't find it. Women have some kind of desperation detector built in and they can tell what your after.
It's not like you'd behave any differently if some desperately pathetic woman was hitting on you, to be fair.
Actively hunting without subtlety nor patience might a better turn of phrase.
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Yes and no General. It's a well known fact that the two hemispheres of a woman's brain are better connected than the two hemispheres of a man's brain. While this allows a woman to be much more adept at multitasking, it makes the man much more focussed on the task at hand, and unfortunately as is all too often the case, we just wanna get laid. Thus the term coyote maker. lol
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It's not like you'd behave any differently if some desperately pathetic woman was hitting on you, to be fair.
Actively hunting without subtlety nor patience might a better turn of phrase.
I'm not sure that's true. I spent too long looking for a girl to save and got a few disasters for my trouble.. In the end, now, I more or less force myself to react with anger to that sort thing.
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Yes and no General. It's a well known fact that the two hemispheres of a woman's brain are better connected than the two hemispheres of a man's brain. While this allows a woman to be much more adept at multitasking, it makes the man much more focussed on the task at hand, and unfortunately as is all too often the case, we just wanna get laid. Thus the term coyote maker. lol
This is completely false, a myth perpetuated by repetition. Womens' brains are no better interconnected than mens'; in fact, on the functional level, the genders barely differ. Nor are women particularly better at multitasking; in fact, men often do better in multitasking situations because they tend to focus on one task at a time.
Had that myth shot out from under me in first year neuroscience.
Men are more likely than women to be receptive to spontaneous advances. However, this is probably a cultural rather than biological effect, and any assertions to the contrary are unsubstantiated.
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Quoted from the article I read on this.
Also, biological anthropologist and Rutgers University professor Helen Fisher, Ph.D., notes: "The two brain hemispheres are less well connected in men than in women. This gives men the ability to focus on one thing at a time and be very goal oriented, whereas the female brain is built to assimilate many feelings at once, and to connect sex and love much more rapidly."
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She's wrong, and discredits herself for saying so. This isn't even an academically controversial topic. I'll happily supply you with citations to an actual peer-reviewed source in a moment.
That 'sex=love' thing is particular bull****; women have sex for sexual pleasure at precisely the same rate men do, and rate emotional connection at the same priority as men.
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I honestly think its like some of the various websites out there say. Women, like men, are looking for a challenge in their relationships. So if you're already taken then you are that much more of a challenge...instantly you're already more desirable because someone else thinks so too. Women are just as competitive as men and they have their own social pecking order like men do. The key thing is to try to have the same appearance of being comfortable and engaging without appearing desperate or needy while single.
Thats why you have to get out there and do something and focus on you. It sound selfish and it is a bit but it'll help you and whoever you're trying to attract later on. Then you have to learn how to temper that selfishness.
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Well spoken Ice, during my divorce one of the best pieces of advice that I got was from a marriage counsellor. He told me to surround myself with women, but not to get romantically involved with any. This would make me feel somehow better about myself, and allow me to ward off my own selfish tendencies. It would also allow for a comfort level with members of the oposite sex that you can't have when worried about a potential romantic relationship.
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From 'The Structure of the Human Brain', Allen, Damasio, and Bruss, American Scientist, May/June 2004, pp. 242.
When the sexually dimorphic corpus callosum was first suggested in the early 1980s, many scientists speculated that the "larger" band in women meant they had a greater degree of communication between the two hemispheres. This idea seemed to support the cliche that in women the "emotional, analytical" left side was more in touch with the other. Of course, we now know that women do not have larger corpus callosa than men. This fact doesn't preclude greater functional connectivity between the two hemispheres (as the cliche would have it), but there is no anatomical evidence for the claim.
They go on to describe how sexually dimorphic areas in the brain evolved well before the human 'cognitive revolution'.
Ironically the corpus callosum is actually larger in men, and once you control for height as a covariate, the difference between the two sexes shrinks by about two thirds. The main difference between the male and female brain lies in the ratio of gray matter to white matter. Men have a higher proportion of white matter; however, it consists primarily of additional blood vessels and non-neuronal components, which leads to little functional difference.
Current scientific consensus points to possible sexual dimorphism in language and spatial/visual tasks, but they are subtle and highly distributed throughout the brain.
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Then I stand corrected as the misinformed masses. Thank you forsetting me straight on that issue.
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Sorry if I went off on you. Didn't mean to be quite so snippy about it.
I really do think it's important for our society to realize that men and women handle sex in very similar ways, though.
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As a general rule, remember that intelligence is not an X-linked trait...
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What the hell is that supposed to mean?
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I didn't realize you were going off on me, I thought we were just having a debate about something and backing it up with sources. Your sources simply proved to be better and more reliable. I'd rather admit to being mistaken than to propogate a disservice in the form of misinforming.
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Then you're a good egg, and a mature one at that. Props.
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Apreciate the vote. Actually I think that this thread is worthwhile, and rather than see it turned into yet another flame war, I probably would have backed away, even if you hadn't proven yourself more knowledgeable. I like to debate, soetimes I win, sometimes I lose (case in point), sometimes we both just walk away a little more enlightened on the other person's views. The difference is that this debate was not one of philosophy, or truth, but one of fact.
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What the hell is that supposed to mean?
It's been a very long time, but I believe I recall that the neurological development in humans is primarily driven by the 22 other chromosomes, not X- and Y- really. This is besides the fact that hormones produced due to the X- and Y-chromosomes most certainly do impact thought patterns and the like. In short, the intelligence of a given individual bears no real relation to gender. Since we were on a tangent for a bit on the subject of neurology...
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From 'The Structure of the Human Brain', Allen, Damasio, and Bruss, American Scientist, May/June 2004, pp. 242.
When the sexually dimorphic corpus callosum was first suggested in the early 1980s, many scientists speculated that the "larger" band in women meant they had a greater degree of communication between the two hemispheres. This idea seemed to support the cliche that in women the "emotional, analytical" left side was more in touch with the other. Of course, we now know that women do not have larger corpus callosa than men. This fact doesn't preclude greater functional connectivity between the two hemispheres (as the cliche would have it), but there is no anatomical evidence for the claim.
They go on to describe how sexually dimorphic areas in the brain evolved well before the human 'cognitive revolution'.
Ironically the corpus callosum is actually larger in men, and once you control for height as a covariate, the difference between the two sexes shrinks by about two thirds. The main difference between the male and female brain lies in the ratio of gray matter to white matter. Men have a higher proportion of white matter; however, it consists primarily of additional blood vessels and non-neuronal components, which leads to little functional difference.
Current scientific consensus points to possible sexual dimorphism in language and spatial/visual tasks, but they are subtle and highly distributed throughout the brain.
is height directly or inversly porportional here?
asking as a tall-ish guy \(only 6'3") whom can't seem to find it after a couple of searches, and that 'height as covarible' peaked my interest.
I must say this is one of the best threads I've seen in a long time, a long time.
Well spoken Ice, during my divorce one of the best pieces of advice that I got was from a marriage counsellor. He told me to surround myself with women, but not to get romantically involved with any. This would make me feel somehow better about myself, and allow me to ward off my own selfish tendencies. It would also allow for a comfort level with members of the oposite sex that you can't have when worried about a potential romantic relationship.
I have done what you have described, but it kind of sucks when you eventually, even innocently, become attracted to one or more of the persons you've befriended, because you really don't want to ruin the estabilished friendshipss. and that starts to gnaw away at the confort level you have with them.
sometimes, like, I've actually stayed friends with someone whom shot me down with 'As a friend' thing, in june, which sort of is cool, as i do feel comfortable hanging out with her, which is odd, as apart from sex, (duh-ish for a 18-year old male) that's all I'd want in a relationship; comfort. Think something's up with that?
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To be quite honest, I don't think that is something you need help for. Now I don't know your exact circumstances, but I was just like that. Never had a girlfriend, had a handful of people I called friends but knew they were nothing more than acquaintances, liked being mostly by myself, and like you, I wanted somebody to spend time with., but then again didn't care very much if I didn't.
Now things are so much different, I hate being away from the girl I love dearly, and I'm getting married in December. Whats my secret? I don't have one. I started working where I work now when I completed High School. On the application it asked, "What would I like to become better at?" and I put "Talking and getting to know people better." While it took a long while I am better at speaking to groups, ect. But the thing is, I had practice doing it at my job. The say you have to face your fears to get good at something, and they are right.
My advice is to take Ice's first point by far, above the rest. Since the economy is down, it's hard to find a job, but I'd think that it isn't hard at all to find a place that needs a volunteer here and there and you never know what you will learn that may give you a boost self esteem wise. When I started work at my job I didn't know a whole lot, but now I'm a jack of trades workman who still has tons to learn BTW, but who loves it.
So I'd say that is by far the first thing you should do. Go down to the local animal shelter and volunteer there, or maybe a local farm or the like. Then stick with it, even it it seams to be leading nowhere. Let me tell you, I never expected to find the girl of my dreams where I worked at, but you never know what life's little surprises my bring and they are not all for the worst.
I appreciate the input, but I honestly feel like my own circumstances go somewhat beyond that. Based on the way I respond to certain situations, I've become at least somewhat convinced that I'm exhibiting at least some degree of social anxiety. I recently read a wonderful article, possibly linked somewhere on HLP, titled "Caring for your Introvert," which kind of described the author's struggles to convey his mindset to an extrovert-centered world. And while I found myself readily identifying with just about everything he said in the article, I also recognized that my own behavior goes well beyond it. I don't just feel mentally exhausted after engaging in social situations for a period of time...I feel flat-out anxious during them, and I try to avoid them if I can. You mentioned having a handful of acquaintances, but I don't even have that much at this point: outside of my immediate family and anyone else who happens to wander into our house, I don't interact with anyone socially on a daily basis. On the job-related side of things, on one occasion when I attended a job fair down at school, I experienced somewhat of a panic attack and booked it before even speaking to anyone. When I read through advice books about how to network with other people professionally or be a good interviewee or things of that nature, I literally cannot see myself participating in that sort of world in the least...it's the exact and utter opposite of the way I'm wired. This is the sort of thing I'm facing, which is why I think that talking to someone is the only way I can get anywhere.
So no, volunteering is definitely out of the question right now, as it's as removed from my comfort zone as anything is possible of being. Plus, at this point, if I have to start working, I'd sure as hell better be getting paid for doing so. :p
(Oh, and this is the sort of thread we need far more of in GD.)
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Mongoose, what sort of environments (in a social sense) do you usually subject yourself to on a weekly basis?
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Primarily, sitting on my ass at the computer in my room. :p But from a social standpoint, I don't do much beyond going to church every week, and even there I'm not looking to talk to anyone before or afterwards. I've gotten to the point where I'm able to go up to a cashier at a store/eatery and interact with them, which made me feel extremely anxious when I was younger, but I still break out in a cold sweat when I have to talk on the phone to someone I don't know (and even sometimes to those I do). When I was at college, I did participate in things like mentor meetings and a few clubs where I felt rather comfortable, but even then, there was always some part of me feeling like I had to wall myself off and worrying about how I was coming across to everyone else. By my senior year, my club activity dropped off a bit, so I spent a lot of time alone in my room; if there was a period of time where the suspect traces of depression were at their maximum, that was definitely it, due to a number of factors.
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What the hell is that supposed to mean?
It's been a very long time, but I believe I recall that the neurological development in humans is primarily driven by the 22 other chromosomes, not X- and Y- really. This is besides the fact that hormones produced due to the X- and Y-chromosomes most certainly do impact thought patterns and the like. In short, the intelligence of a given individual bears no real relation to gender. Since we were on a tangent for a bit on the subject of neurology...
You are mostly correct. Cognitive development isn't sex-linked. Hormonal impact on brain development occurs during fetal development primarily, with low doses directly impacting sex-linked behaviours in adulthood. Androgens and estrogens regulate a number of body functions, but the most readily evident are in sexual characteristics. It's interesting to note, anecdotally anyway, that people undergoing sex reassignment from female to male note the biggest change they experience is in their sex drive.
That said, sex hormones don't really have any measurable impact on cognitive processes in the brain. While men and women may think differently, it appears to have much more to do with minor structural differences (possibly as a result of hormone dosages during development) than any direct impact by the hormones themselves.
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Wow. . . . . I'm amazed at the tangent this went down. Interesting read.
Social interaction and cognitive developement, I remember dealing with this for my psychology A-level.
But I can't remember anything worthwhile. Suffice to say that much like anything else real or virtual, your stats won't improve unless you get out there and grind. Never too late, even if you start by using public transport to go and sign up at the local library (i'd imagine this would give you some fair exposure to the public and limited interaction in a reasonably safe environment too)
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I despise games that involve grinding. :p
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I'm afraid there's nothing in life which isn't yielded from hard graft on somebodies part.
Reality is, the only things which can exist by doing sod all are plants and vegetables, and even then something with more aptitude WILL come along eventally and eat them for not developing at least a basic defense.
Don't be a vegetable or a pansy, get out and grind.
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I despise games that involve grinding. :p
Then, I hate to break it to you, but you're ****ed. :P
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I despise games that involve grinding. :p
Then, I hate to break it to you, but you're ****ed. :P
Or not, as the case may be. :p
But seriously, this isn't a matter of not trying hard enough, or not feeling like committing enough time and effort, or anything like that...it's far deeper. I've always loathed the phrase, "Can't means won't." Can't doesn't mean won't...it means can't, as in not physically able to. For me, right now, either I get a head doctor to take a look-see upstairs and see what's rattling around my brain, or the whole world magically conforms itself to my vision overnight, or I stay cooped up in my room for the indefinite future until my parents put me out on the street or something. Everything else is extraneous.
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I know that feeling all too well. Feeling it right now actually.
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But seriously, this isn't a matter of not trying hard enough, or not feeling like committing enough time and effort, or anything like that...it's far deeper. I've always loathed the phrase, "Can't means won't." Can't doesn't mean won't...it means can't, as in not physically able to. For me, right now, either I get a head doctor to take a look-see upstairs and see what's rattling around my brain, or the whole world magically conforms itself to my vision overnight, or I stay cooped up in my room for the indefinite future until my parents put me out on the street or something. Everything else is extraneous.
I can sympathize with a lot of the things you described in your earlier posts, though I haven’t experienced anything quite so severe, and I agree that it doesn’t sound like something that you can just fight through on your own. I do hope you’ll go and get some help, because you’ve always struck me as a bright, decent, capable person and it would be a shame to let this hold you back.
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I can honestly say the main reason for my ability to converse, and therefore successfully interact with a broad range of women is compromise, not physically i.e lowering my standards but on a conversational level. Generalise and don't get specific on subjects unless you know said subjects. Feign interest if you have none and try to get a little background info if you know them through a friend so you can pop into wikipedia and brush up. It's not stalking, it's university of life exam preseration. Be courtious and guage reactions, if a line of conversation isn't going anywhere don't be afraid to change it. Practice your fake smile in a mirror too, good old sims reference.
Argh. . . So much knowledge to share, so little time.
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Good advice Dekker!
I spent a good couple of years in university learning how to make conversation easier with people. Especially those I just met. Turns out its useful everywhere...even at family events. I still have times where I can't think of a single question to ask someone but usually I can think of something. These are the sorts of questions where you sound genuine and interesting and then you let them talk... And don't be afraid to do some reading outside of your area. As Dekker says .... university of life exam preparation. Brilliant! :)
Recently I was impressing a couple of medical students with my medical knowledge and it came from nothing more than reading the science and medicine sections at BBC, CNN and the like.
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I despise games that involve grinding. :p
Then, I hate to break it to you, but you're ****ed. :P
Or not, as the case may be. :p
But seriously, this isn't a matter of not trying hard enough, or not feeling like committing enough time and effort, or anything like that...it's far deeper. I've always loathed the phrase, "Can't means won't." Can't doesn't mean won't...it means can't, as in not physically able to. For me, right now, either I get a head doctor to take a look-see upstairs and see what's rattling around my brain, or the whole world magically conforms itself to my vision overnight, or I stay cooped up in my room for the indefinite future until my parents put me out on the street or something. Everything else is extraneous.
Well can you start with someone you trust?
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Good advice Dekker!
I spent a good couple of years in university learning how to make conversation easier with people. Especially those I just met. Turns out its useful everywhere...even at family events. I still have times where I can't think of a single question to ask someone but usually I can think of something. These are the sorts of questions where you sound genuine and interesting and then you let them talk... And don't be afraid to do some reading outside of your area. As Dekker says .... university of life exam preparation. Brilliant! :)
Recently I was impressing a couple of medical students with my medical knowledge and it came from nothing more than reading the science and medicine sections at BBC, CNN and the like.
I used to be around the end of august somewhat socially awkward :eek2:, then i moved from the small town to univerity in the 'big' city, and i just made the effort to be friendly to everyone possible, and just simply talk to them. went from no social skills to beingsocially very comfortable, and i feel so much better for myself as a result :cool:. I have no doubt theese skills are VERY useful, and am very glad to have them, i personally developed them rather quickly, in the span of only a week!
However i suspect the grinding hate is mainly based in games, as grinding IRL often rather nice.. ;7
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Well can you start with someone you trust?
Start what? Sorry, I don't follow.
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It is better to **** the devil you know.
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My experiences with strangers, even when dealing with shop assistants and such, often used to get me very anxious to the point that I used to try and avoid such situations. So I think I understand where Mongoose is coming from, it's a deep rooted thing. I occasionally do have the odd pang of anxiety now, but it's much less common, since becoming forced into having to face my fears (for example, since learning to drive I've had to pay for fuel for my parent's car; work has forced me to use a telephone and arrange things with people I don't know, etc). There's many a time that I have wished there could be someone with me, a friend who understands me and my inhibitions well to hold my hand along the way through such experiences, but wishing doesn't work, not for me anyway.
When I'm around people I know, I just feel like I can't be comfortable in their company. I get the feeling that I'm boring them, or annoying them even, and that, even though they're being polite and haven't said anything negative to me, that they'd rather hang out with someone more socially adept and interesting. So I end up letting such relationships lapse. I just get the idea that I'm being a burden to people by simply interacting with them. And that's the last thing I'd want to do to anyone.
Also, I do despair sometimes, because I know acquaintances (people that I used to be friends with but have now grown apart from) that are doing all the fun things people do at my age. Like going travelling abroad, something I've never done. There's a nagging voice telling me that if I don't do something about this, when I get into my 30's or 40's I am really going to regret not coming out of my comfort zone.
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My experiences with strangers, even when dealing with shop assistants and such, often used to get me very anxious to the point that I used to try and avoid such situations. So I think I understand where Mongoose is coming from, it's a deep rooted thing. I occasionally do have the odd pang of anxiety now, but it's much less common, since becoming forced into having to face my fears (for example, since learning to drive I've had to pay for fuel for my parent's car; work has forced me to use a telephone and arrange things with people I don't know, etc). There's many a time that I have wished there could be someone with me, a friend who understands me and my inhibitions well to hold my hand along the way through such experiences, but wishing doesn't work, not for me anyway.
When I'm around people I know, I just feel like I can't be comfortable in their company. I get the feeling that I'm boring them, or annoying them even, and that, even though they're being polite and haven't said anything negative to me, that they'd rather hang out with someone more socially adept and interesting. So I end up letting such relationships lapse. I just get the idea that I'm being a burden to people by simply interacting with them. And that's the last thing I'd want to do to anyone.
Also, I do despair sometimes, because I know acquaintances (people that I used to be friends with but have now grown apart from) that are doing all the fun things people do at my age. Like going travelling abroad, something I've never done. There's a nagging voice telling me that if I don't do something about this, when I get into my 30's or 40's I am really going to regret not coming out of my comfort zone.
dude, yjay souunds a little bit like me at that age, when you draduate high school and move out to collage or whatever, jus be CERTAIN to use it as a fresh startm as yiu WILL meet new people whom also don't really kow many others, and so logn as you keep alert and get out there, and likely supress then nerd/geek within you, you'll do alright.
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Primarily, sitting on my ass at the computer in my room. :p But from a social standpoint, I don't do much beyond going to church every week, and even there I'm not looking to talk to anyone before or afterwards. I've gotten to the point where I'm able to go up to a cashier at a store/eatery and interact with them, which made me feel extremely anxious when I was younger, but I still break out in a cold sweat when I have to talk on the phone to someone I don't know (and even sometimes to those I do). When I was at college, I did participate in things like mentor meetings and a few clubs where I felt rather comfortable, but even then, there was always some part of me feeling like I had to wall myself off and worrying about how I was coming across to everyone else. By my senior year, my club activity dropped off a bit, so I spent a lot of time alone in my room; if there was a period of time where the suspect traces of depression were at their maximum, that was definitely it, due to a number of factors.
Mongoose, why don't you try and talk to your pastor? You may not even need to address a problem... Just having someone you know who will uphold your confidentiality in a conversation is a great person to talk to.
When I returned from my last semester at school, my mental state was best described as "severely damaged." I didn't want to talk to my parents about the problems... and if I had to, it was miserable. The problem with very close relations to yourself is often that they spend more time in judgement of you rather than actually trying to empathize and aid you in the issue. However, they did get me to go and talk to a friend and someone whom I trusted; that person happened to be my pastor. And even if we didn't talk about problems, it was good to have a friend to engage in conversation.
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This thread's pretty much gone off in two directions, so please excuse my use of a bigass quote.
Actually McCall, I honestly beleive that I know the reason that women come out of the woodwork when we are spoken for. Bear with me.
It has been my experience, and the experience of a lot of my cohorts, that when in a relationship, the offers and general hitting on is very strong. The same can be said of things during and after my divorce, when I wanted nothing to do with women at all, in my opinion, what was the sense, they'll either die or screw you over. ( I got over it)
Anyway, the point is, when we are with someone, or otherwise disinclined to look for a relationship, we are comfortable with who we are. We are more ourselves, and because we honestly don't care if we are impressive or not, we carry ourselves with more confidence. We are simply who we are with no nervous pretension, with no care. It is attractive and nearly magnetic to the oposite sex.
I am NOT learned in psychology, nor do I pretend to be, but this is what I honestly beleive to be true, the best way to be attractive, is be comfortable with yourself, without trying. Think about it like this:
A good matial artist should be able to go from position or stance and strike his oponent. Jim Lau, Zen in the Martial Arts, pg 97. The chapter is called "Effortless Effort", and the gist is, only when we stop thinking do we allow what we are to come forth.
I hope this makes sense.
I have to agree. From what I've seen observing other guys and myself as well is that just about all guys are either two things when actively looking for a relationship.
1. Desperate
2.Unconfident and/or shy in all they do, so they change themselves totally to try to impress the one they are after, and usually fail miserably.
and sometimes it leads to:
3. Playing hard to get thinking they can win the others heard by acting like they don't care if she doesn't like him, or ignoring her when she is just trying to be a friend.
If you are actively hunting a relationship, odds are, you won't find it. Women have some kind of desperation detector built in and they can tell what your after.
1 - Fricking killer. Desperation not good. Even if you break your duck in that state, the walk home next morning makes you wish you hadn't - desperate guys do things (or should I say also say girls) they regret.
2 - Yep, that'll blow it too. Comes back to ShadowWolf's point about being yourself and all. Got to qualify that though: just being yourself doesn't work if yourself is desperate and weedy.
3 - Ah, playing silly buggers as we call it over here. That one's fine right up to the point you get carried away, start thinking you're Colin Farrell, and play it so cool she gives up and gets boned by someone else.
Unless you're a player, most single guys spend most of their single-dom screwing all this stuff up.
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I'm not a Player, and I don't really fall into either of the stereotypes mentioned. In fact i'm pretty adamant that a lot of my friends, past and present don't either.
A lot of regular internet users may, and should I get persecuted for speaking truth, so be it. But i'm not getting tarred with an inaccurate brush. ;)
Confidence and overconfidence are two different things, deliberate considered actions and foolhardy brazen decisions. Thats a more likely fork for all blokes to be sectioned off into.
Quick point, once people stop worrying about what they think they need (successful lay, commited relationship, man points, kudos etc) and just relax into life without undue concern. That's when your confidence, performance in general and hence outward image will improve. To be positively blunt as a housebrick, and I live by this saying. . . You die if you worry, and you die he you don't. So why worry.
May sound harsh, but there's no point walking on eggshells if you never get anywhere. ;)
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Confidence is, to a degree, interchangeable with apathy.
So okay. Go out and **** up horribly three or four times. Get to know what it's like, used to it, until it doesn't scare you any more. There comes a point where you just don't care if you manage to fail again, but you still want to try.
And at that moment your crippling anxiety issues or whateverthe**** drop away. It's perverse, but as long as you're trying not to screw up, your chances of screwing up greatly increase. Stop trying. Then you actually make progress.
It worked for me.
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Confidence is, to a degree, interchangeable with apathy.
So okay. Go out and **** up horribly three or four times. Get to know what it's like, used to it, until it doesn't scare you any more. There comes a point where you just don't care if you manage to fail again, but you still want to try.
And at that moment your crippling anxiety issues or whateverthe**** drop away. Then you actually make progress.
It worked for me.
After nine or ten times, you lose it all over again.
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You were still trying not to screw up. :P
It is better to act decisively than it is to wait two seconds devising the perfect response.
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You should hang out on IRC with us, NGTM-1R!
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That would require me screwing around with MIRC again. Not likely.
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No, past the point where you don't care. If you continue for nine or ten more times, you start caring again. And it still doesn't work.
Before post edit: I see, you were talking about anxiety issues. I misunderstood the subject.
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That would require me screwing around with MIRC again. Not likely.
Just click the Mibbit link! Announcements forum, 'HLP IRC thread', Fury says something along the lines of 'click this link.'
All I ever use, no install required, completely in-browser.
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No, past the point where you don't care. If you continue for nine or ten more times, you start caring again. And it still doesn't work.
Before post edit: I see, you were talking about anxiety issues. I misunderstood the subject.
Not necessarily. Any attempt to actively and conciously avoid self-sabotage will result in self-sabotage. People (not just females) are surprisingly good at detecting hesistation. This is why it is better to act decisively now than to hesitate over the perfect response. Yes, you'll probably screw up that way too, but it was an honest screwup rather than giving a self-serving impression, and therefore more survivable.
And it's actually less common to screw up this way than it is when you take time to consider, perhaps because this is not really a rational process.
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Why would a moments pause be derogatory? :wtf: I can only see that failing if there's a lot of umming and ahhing. By then if you are over baking the situation it doesn't even matter.
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Why would a moments pause be derogatory? :wtf: I can only see that failing if there's a lot of umming and ahhing. By then if you are over baking the situation it doesn't even matter.
Indeed a moments pause can mean that you're really giving a lot of thought and care to what you're about to say. Sometimes considered a good thing! Situational for sure.
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Why would a moments pause be derogatory? :wtf: I can only see that failing if there's a lot of umming and ahhing. By then if you are over baking the situation it doesn't even matter.
I do not explain it, merely note my experience with the subject, and the responses I've gotten about questions. People don't like it when you have to stop to think. :P
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Likewise but opposite. :p
Circumstantial as mentioned. Horses for courses. Most of this applies to general interaction, not just opposite gender. If people are consistently negative, a re-evaluation to approach is needed. Remember, it's not what you say. . . It's how you say it.
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No, past the point where you don't care. If you continue for nine or ten more times, you start caring again. And it still doesn't work.
Before post edit: I see, you were talking about anxiety issues. I misunderstood the subject.
When you hit nine or ten more times of consistent strike-outs, its probably time to step back and re-evaluate the whole approach. Something's got to be amiss!
Hey Dekker - do you not hotmail?
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It's my least used method of communication.
I'll check now. .
Edit- nothing there. :confused:
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Ah... I dropped you a belated reply (04/10/09) to the photos email you sent. Wanted to pick your brains. (Not in a "Brains... brains... BRAINS... Grsgrgrgrgrgg" kinda way though).
Any sign?
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What was the heading?
Or try a resend (and tell me the heading ;))
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Open sent items... copy... open HLP PM... paste... resend!
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PM recieved :yes:
So giuys, any luck with the social interaction or is my vast wealth of confidence building knowledge being squandered :p
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Well my own advice, and some of yours Dekker, (sometimes you have to give others advice to actually use it yourself) is working out quite well right now actually. Still crossing my fingers!
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Glad to hear, as i say.. There's no such thing as bad practice.
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I have given up trying to get a girlfriend for now, it's all platonic (though I will jump on any chance. I'm just not actively looking). And I find I am happier for it.
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So giuys, any luck with the social interaction or is my vast wealth of confidence building knowledge being squandered :p
Squandered, pretty much. :p Still staring at the four walls of my room, trying to ignore the fact that I should have dusted at least a week ago.
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A week? I haven't vacuumed in at least...a year?
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Tidy and clean are two different things. . .hmmm.
Ting to remember again is don't worry about what you think you need. Just be happy.
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I have fired the second salvo in the war to win her heart.
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Here's wishing you a critical hit! :pimp::yes:
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and an extra attack proc
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A week? I haven't vacuumed in at least...a year?
GUYS! Don't want to sound like a total mom/mum here, but a dirty room does not a love nest make. Girls can be pretty funny about that kind of thing.
Actually, being quite serious, a dirty room/home will not help at all. Neither does excessive untidiness. If you get a girl back to your place, it really screws things up if she doesn't know where the heck to sit. Had a friend make that mistake in a BIG way early this year. We'd set him up with a pretty cute girl, but she got totally turned off by the state of his pad. Just a couple hours cleaning up before she arrived and he might well have been getting head instead of the brush-off.
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I just assumed basic hygiene wen't without saying.....
Remember the sims refernece earlier, well there's a ROOM bar there too :yes:
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I just assumed basic hygiene wen't without saying.....
Remember the sims refernece earlier, well there's a ROOM bar there too :yes:
You know, really should change the topic to Dekker's Relationship Seminar.
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It's always the basics folks screw up. Always the basics. I'm sure there's guys out there with all the PUA manuals etched in their brains but they keep forgetting to brush their teeth and trim their pubes.
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TMFI :lol:
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The second salvo seems to have done good damage. I'm now planning a third assault.
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Don't get too obvious about it.
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Of course. I'm damn good at making stealth assaults.
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There's a weakpoint about 1/4 of the way down the hull, aim for the middle :)
teh <3
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The real trick seems to be what to do once into a relationship. What do you do when she's happy? (obvious?) What do you do when she's upset about something? How much do you try to be with her without being overwhelming? No easy answers obviously. Its once you get to that point in the relationship just like Dekker was talking about at the beginning.... then the lack of commitment/lone wolf concerns creep in...
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Finding a good equilibrium early on is pretty key. If you have to make too much effort early on (conversationally) chances are that'll set the tempo and you'll have to maintain it. That's why you should once the ice is broken default to your normal interests and behaviours once in a while so you can guage whether it'll last. Obviously as stated already compromise is a given, but surrender? Ononono. We're all pretty young just enjoy the variety for a bit.
Also you young'uns constant fornication alone does not a relationship make. It's just a really GOOD arrangement. :D eke it out and use the oppertunity to improve if it presents itself.
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The real trick seems to be what to do once into a relationship. What do you do when she's happy? (obvious?) What do you do when she's upset about something? How much do you try to be with her without being overwhelming? No easy answers obviously. Its once you get to that point in the relationship just like Dekker was talking about at the beginning.... then the lack of commitment/lone wolf concerns creep in...
So... do you suffer from the congential Wandering Eye Syndrome too? Cool! We should set up a club on here.
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The real trick seems to be what to do once into a relationship. What do you do when she's happy? (obvious?) What do you do when she's upset about something? How much do you try to be with her without being overwhelming? No easy answers obviously. Its once you get to that point in the relationship just like Dekker was talking about at the beginning.... then the lack of commitment/lone wolf concerns creep in...
So... do you suffer from the congential Wandering Eye Syndrome too? Cool! We should set up a club on here.
No its not that I'm looking elsewhere... its more of a "I'm here... now what do I do" sort of feeling. Makes one occasionally want to run back to cover (I'm sure that is one of those drivers for the lone wolf kind of person). I'm staying the course right now because its a really good course. Its just challenging for me right now.
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I see what you mean. We on occasion put a lot of effort into getting there only to realise that - apart from the obvious :D - we're not sure what to do on arrival.
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I see what you mean. We on occasion put a lot of effort into getting there only to realise that - apart from the obvious :D - we're not sure what to do on arrival.
Yep... but its one of those learning processes :)
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O.o
Things are so much less complicated when you only date friends.
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But much less rewarding in life skill points.
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and friends want to "just be friends" so... yeah.
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friend zone is a myth. it's really the "youre okay as a friend, but i wouldnt date you under any circumstances because you suck in some way"
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That IS the friend zone. Over familiarity breeds contempt, contempt is exciting newstuffs natural predator.
When you first meet a woman and take her out, treat her to dinner at a west venue and maybe a play or something. It's ll WHOOP WHOOP etc. If you are in the social circle too long without asserting yourself as "not another friend" you are tarred, and feathered. . . Bar lonely emo-sex or drunken mistakes.
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yeah, if you're ugly you dont stand a chance unless she doesn't know you're also boring yet.
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But much less rewarding in life skill points.
And conversely, much more rewarding over the long term. Paradox. :P
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Shagging every bird I know although fun would limit my contacts and alienate me from female interaction in the long run.
New birds are new :D
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That's just sex, that's different from dating/relationships. Duh.
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No emotional attachment with sex is a sign of poor character. Or lack of self respect :p
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That's just sex, that's different from dating/relationships. Duh.
Umm, no it's not, it's significantly more intimate.
Course I'm speaking from a completely theoretical standpoint.
The odds of me ever partaking of that particular activity are somewhere between zero and negative numbers.
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No emotional attachment, with sex is a sign of poor character. Or lack of self respect :p
I meant lack of emotional attachment means you lose, not...
NO! Emotional sex = teh lose. :rolleyes:
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That's just sex, that's different from dating/relationships. Duh.
Umm, no it's not, it's significantly more intimate.
Sex isn't necessarily intimate. That's just a fact. Some people prefer it intimate and emotional, but it's just a preference. Everybody has them.
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Even raw unbridled rutting needs to stem from an emotional drive / cause.
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In as much as any activity does.
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Oh no... there are some activities i could well do without. Work being one of them. And idle chit-chat. Thats purely formal and a means to live.
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any recreational activity*
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Sex without emotional drive is completely different though.
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what's your point?
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That until you've grown a set of man junk you should just keep the de-railing to your OH SNAP RELATIONSHIPS!
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do you ever say anything coherent?
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That until you've grown a set of man junk you should just keep the de-railing to your OH SNAP RELATIONSHIPS!
Just FYI, women are slightly more likely to seek sex for physical satisfaction and men slightly more likely to seek sex for emotional intimacy.
On the metanalytic level there's no clear difference at all between motivation for sex in either gender.
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That until you've grown a set of man junk you should just keep the de-railing to your OH SNAP RELATIONSHIPS!
Just FYI, women are slightly more likely to seek sex for physical satisfaction and men slightly more likely to seek sex for emotional intimacy.
On the metanalytic level there's no clear difference at all between motivation for sex in either gender.
that's true, with the exception of Talyor swift songs and HS-based movies/.TV, women are rarely 'friend zoned' in that, as a guy, if i like to spend time with a girl on a sentient level, then i might aswell have physical time with her.
Or maybe that's just me. I'm a little off-kilter lately. coming of age and **** like that.
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My statement was based on self-reported survey data, which is probably the best we've got.
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And probably close to worthless. Since no one ever tells the truth when it comes to sex related surveys. :p
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Hmm, maybe. But the fact that it defied the gender stereotypes is nonetheless telling.
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Just FYI, women are slightly more likely to seek sex for physical satisfaction and men slightly more likely to seek sex for emotional intimacy.
I'll buy that just from a plumbing standpoint. Men have dual-purpose, women have mission specific.
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Er, what? I'm not sure what you're saying there.
Just to clarify how thoroughly this runs against the grain: the evidence is that women **** because it's fun, whereas the men are in it for the feelings.
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Not really against the grain as much as you'd think actually. Women tend towards sex in committed relationships more than men while with men there is a tendency towards sex just for fun.
Both sides are simply describing what they feel they are lacking in their current sexual encounters.
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Er, what? I'm not sure what you're saying there.
For men, as I'm sure you are well aware, coitus results the release of their reproductive material. Women on the other hand experience coitus independently of the reproductive function. With a capability for repeat coital events within a short period of time, or so I've read. Regardless, from a plumbing standpoint, women are build in that area for pleasure far more than men.
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For men, as I'm sure you are well aware, coitus results the release of their reproductive material. Women on the other hand experience coitus independently of the reproductive function. With a capability for repeat coital events within a short period of time, or so I've read. Regardless, from a plumbing standpoint, women are build in that area for pleasure far more than men.
I don't think that assertion is supported at all - it's one of those fuzzy evolutionary psychology 'just so stories'. It doesn't connect to men having sex for emotional intimacy. Nor does it explain the behavior of women, simply because most women don't get to have orgasm during sex.
And men can have multiple orgasms without ejaculation too.
Not really against the grain as much as you'd think actually. Women tend towards sex in committed relationships more than men while with men there is a tendency towards sex just for fun.
Both sides are simply describing what they feel they are lacking in their current sexual encounters.
Hrm, maybe. Nonetheless it is interesting that women seek sex for sexual pleasure whereas men seek it to 'connect with their partner' or whatever, because stereotypically, the gender traits are the opposite of that.
If only we had a more reliable kind of data (like actual behavioral observation).
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I think what Liberator is trying to say is “women have the clitoris.” He might have been on to something if he’d left it at that instead of wandering off into evopsych hand-waving. Then again, I guess that’s hard if you’re afraid to say “clitoris.”
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Why would anyone be afraid of a clitoris? They're so small and harmless and fun!
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I have two so I still have one if one is in the wash.
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You can buy anything on ebay now :lol:
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I think what Liberator is trying to say is “women have the clitoris.” He might have been on to something if he’d left it at that instead of wandering off into evopsych hand-waving. Then again, I guess that’s hard if you’re afraid to say “clitoris.”
I'm not afraid to say...that word...I just don't reference things I've never had first hand empirical contact with and no, video's don't count.
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I think what Liberator is trying to say is “women have the clitoris.” He might have been on to something if he’d left it at that instead of wandering off into evopsych hand-waving. Then again, I guess that’s hard if you’re afraid to say “clitoris.”
I'm not afraid to say...that word...I just don't reference things I've never had first hand empirical contact with and no, video's don't count.
You can't talk about the moon!?
Or your prostate gland!
Or, or...Billie Mays!
(sorry cheap shot :nervous:, just pokin' fun)
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I think what Liberator is trying to say is “women have the clitoris.” He might have been on to something if he’d left it at that instead of wandering off into evopsych hand-waving. Then again, I guess that’s hard if you’re afraid to say “clitoris.”
I'm not afraid to say...that word...I just don't reference things I've never had first hand empirical contact with and no, video's don't count.
*shakes Rian's hand for making Liberator never mention God again* :p
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Kara wins.
Everything.
Forever.
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:D Well played sir.
Also, my field studies suggest that men and women enjoy non-reproductive-sex about the same ;)
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My field studies suggest that nerds hate sex and will do anything to get out of it. :<
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My field studies suggest that there's no point in bothering with the whole mess when you have the Internets and your right/left hand. :p
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My field studies suggest that nerds hate sex and will do anything to get out of it. :<
Poor Zack.
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Quality of the ride depends on the vehicle I guess.
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My field studies suggest that nerds hate sex and will do anything to get out of it. :<
iamzack is just too horny. requires more sex than i can realistically provide. doesnt understand that it gets hurty on the inside.
also, i enjoy it when she begs.
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Hurty on the inside? I can only assume you're trying to shoot your weapon after you've fired a few but before you've had a chance to reload.
Try to spend a bit more time aiming. ;) not saying you're a snapshooter or anything. Just don't shoot ever target that presents itself. Sometimes you can aim without pulling the trigger. And if she moans. . . . . . :snipe: headshot.
:nervous:
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I agree with Tura...the spirit is willing but the flesh is sore and bruised.
Also, Dekker wins :p
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Clearly I need a second.
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Hurty on the inside hmm?
Might want to get that looked at. :P
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There may be some argument back and forth about who enjoys sex more and for what reason but to be perfectly honest most studies are comparing slight differences at best. The differences are likely greater between individuals than the average for the whole gender.
My field studies suggest that nerds hate sex and will do anything to get out of it. :<
My field studies suggest quite the opposite... mind you this is university nerd rather than high school nerd. University changes everything.
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Nerds have sex? Like, proper nerdy nerds, not just clever folks? Can't imagine that happening very often. Must be... arrhythmic.
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Not in my experience we don't. :sigh:
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Well we were getting somewhere toward passing on a few hard-learned tips before someone jumped in and got all academic-y about it.
Even a good old thread about the beautiful art of getting laid can get derailed so easily...
Best way to start getting laid? Stop being a nerd. Doesn't mean you have to stop being smart. In fact being smart can help - allows you to be more sneaky!
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Best way to start getting laid? Stop being a nerd. Doesn't mean you have to stop being smart. In fact being smart can help - allows you to be more sneaky!
Very difficult to proceed down that path for some of us. I suspect I'm the most anti-social person here, I get uncomfortable standing in line at McDonalds.
That's not exactly right, I get uncomfortable in any situation that requires me to talk about anything other than the weather or technological/scientific problems or issues. I'm not shallow, I just don't have any experience to make me an interesting person. To say I'm dull would be an understatement of incredible size and power. I'm 31 years old and my favorite things are World of Warcraft, computers, Star Trek and Power Rangers. Beyond that my general knowledge is beneath basic. I don't have anything I can connect with to anyone my own age bracket that wouldn't immediately brand me a loser and dump any interest that I may have been gathering in the waste bin.
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try using everclear. that's what did it for me.
just that little bit to push you over the edge of being sociable.
and then a little bit more, to make you extra sociable
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Hate to admit it, but Tura's actually right. I'm not exactly ultra-social (though not anti-social), but a good mix of whiskey and vodka later...
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Well, I took her out for dinner. It was a nice dinner, which we followed up with wandering around the mall for the better part of 2 hours.
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also, i enjoy it when she begs.
guess who hates you...
that's right, it's meee~
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Anyone who feels they have to 'stop being a nerd' or anything else in order to get laid is, quite frankly, simply conforming to herd mentality, and, quite possibly, being stereotyped in the first place.
I've been a nerd for 37 years, I love Star Trek, I play Roller Coaster Tycoon, I drink more coffee than a small nation, and I stay up till the early hours of the morning playing computer games, or browsing the net.
I'm also married under common law, have been for a decade, and very happily so, my partner is a wonderful woman who understands me for who I am, which is just as well, because ain't nothing going to make me become someone else, not to get laid, not for popularity or friendships, because they are all fake, they are all based on someone you are pretending to be instead of someone you are.
Don't be afraid to be a nerd, just feel sorry for the people who are so weak in their own self-esteem that they have to find another group to insult. And if a girl doesn't like you for who you are, that's not your problem, I'd rather be single and myself, than with a partner and pretending to be something I'm not.
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I, for one, dig nerds. Except for the low sex drive bit.
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Never had that problem personally, if anything, I suffer from a high sex drive for my age, but I'll not go too deeply into that ;)
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Except for the low sex drive bit.
There's treatment for that :p
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I, for one, dig nerds. Except for the low sex drive bit.
I'm going to guess you want to be invited when you should be asking.
Or Tura's an asshole. :P
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I don't have a low sex drive. I have a normal sex drive. Iamzack has ****ing turbo mode sex drive and she needs to calm it down or it's going to get her into trouble.
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I don't have a low sex drive. I have a normal sex drive. Iamzack has ****ing turbo mode sex drive and she needs to calm it down or it's going to get her Turambar into trouble.
Fixed that for you.
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Well, I pity Trumbar, whoever that is then :p
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Fixed that for me :P
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Well, I pity Trumbar, whoever that is then :p
Pity Trumby? I'm the one who's gone without for two weeks straight. >.<
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Get out there and mix then :p
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Can't. I'm trying to do the fidelity thing again.
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Well, I pity Trumbar, whoever that is then :p
Pity Trumby? I'm the one who's gone without for two weeks straight. >.<
My heart weeps for you. Two weeks is such a long time compared to 17 years :doubt:
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Can't. I'm trying to do the fidelity thing again.
Be a man, use your hand. :p
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:nervous:
She's not a man...
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Be a woman! Use both!
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I don't masturbate. It's like eating celery when I'm craving pot brownies.
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Go to an underground rave and get pilled up out of your head. Chances are you'll wake up satisfied with a room full of strangers.
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:eek2:
Unsafe! Unsafe!
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Go to an underground rave and get pilled up out of your head. Chances are you'll wake up satisfied with a room full of strangers.
Speaking from personal experience there? :wtf:
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Just the once :p
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Go to an underground rave and get pilled up out of your head. Chances are you'll wake up satisfied with a room full of strangers.
This is Raleigh, North Carolina. Things like that only happen in interesting places. Raleigh isn't interesting places.
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Being a nerd has nothing to do with it. You can be a nerd and be interesting at the same time but it does require some diversity... even diversity inside the realm of nerdom can be really helpful.
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Well, I pity Trumbar, whoever that is then :p
Pity Trumby? I'm the one who's gone without for two weeks straight. >.<
My heart weeps for you. Two weeks is such a long time compared to 17 years :doubt:
Umm, got you beat, with 2 decades going on never. :P
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I only date nerds. Nerd girls are even worse with the sex drive thing than nerd guys. Nerd guys at least have the decency to be like "hmm.. I should want sex more." Nerd girls are like "Sex? Why? I have better things to do. Like homework."
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Nerd girls tend to like the kinky sex more, though.
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Trying to figure out how to respond to this thread without sounding like a condescending old person...
Sex plays an important role in a relationship, but a relationship cannot be sustained by sex alone, that's not a relationship, it's what the Americans so wonderfully call a '****-buddy', blunt, but refreshingly accurate. The problem is, and I was just as guilty a decade ago, sex tends to eclipse everything else because it is such a powerful experience.
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Raleigh isn't interesting places.
Except for the university campus, surely?
My sister and her friends didn't seem bored when I visited her a year or two back.
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Raleigh is boring, sure, but it's not that boring.
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Raleigh is boring, sure, but it's not that boring.
As someone who lived there for two years, yes, it is that boring.
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Extremely boring. We don't even have amusement parks. The nearest one is a water park an hour away. Le sigh.
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Well, I pity Trumbar, whoever that is then :p
Pity Trumby? I'm the one who's gone without for two weeks straight. >.<
My heart weeps for you. Two weeks is such a long time compared to 17 years :doubt:
Umm, got you beat, with 2 decades going on never. :P
With that kind of attitude it's going to continue. Small steps towards life goals.... small steps.
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With that kind of attitude it's going to continue. Small steps towards life goals.... small steps.
This kind of attitude is borne of that same 20 years of perceiving the opposition to have anything from apathy to active dislike to outright derision. I've given up because I don't have anything to offer a potential mate.
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Erh, it might help if you didn't perceive 50% of the people on earth as "the opposition."
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Yeah. Women aren't sexual gatekeepers; men don't throw themselves out there for approval.
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No i throw myself out there to get my rocks off.
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Yeah. Women aren't sexual gatekeepers; men don't throw themselves out there for approval.
Perhaps, perhaps not, but women don't want a thirtysomething with no job and no future as the potential father of her children. They want someone who will be able to provide for them and they're offspring as well as aid in the raising of said. They want winners, I am not now, nor have I ever been anything like a winner at anything.
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If we're just talking about sex, then you can be the biggest loser on the planet and it won't really matter.
If we're talking about longterm stuff, if you're interested in it, then change whatever it is about yourself that generally repels people. I don't mean stuff like interest in computers, I mean stuff like thinking of women as somehow separate from people or being inappropriately overfriendly and creepy.
If you're not interested in it, then there's no problem. Why whine about not having what you don't want, etc.
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Perhaps, perhaps not
No. There is no 'perhaps' here.
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Desperation is the least attractive feature in a man, and women can sense it a mile away.
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Liberator, iamzack has some solid advice right there (to be honest I'm a bit surprised but kudos!). You can help yourself, you can change your lot in life, it isn't easy but you have to want it. Talking about it and complaining about it won't get you anywhere although it is a first step in recognizing some of the components of your life that you don't like. That needs to become positive...
Step by step man... work on the job and your life right now. Then you can think about bringing in someone else. Seriously... your life perspective can change and change significantly. Its a wonder what small things can do to you for the positive. Especially if you've been stuck somewhere.
I was stuck somewhere for 4 years... felt like I was running on a treadmill. Things slowly changed... some of them I changed and some of them had to fall in to place on their own. They didn't begin to fall into place until I got the process started... I'm still working on getting to where I want to be. Maybe I always will be... but I'm starting to learn some wisdom in enjoying the process now that its rolling again and suddenly the 4 years of me being stuck don't seem so wasted because they helped me get to where I'm starting to go.
Its all about outlook... you have to take ownership of it.
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"Victory is an attitude; this, do not forget." ;)
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"Victory is an attitude; this, do not forget." ;)
Probably said by someone after they won.
I don't think I've made this clear. In my 3.1 decades of life on this pathetic, self-important mudball, I haven't ever won at anything I've tried. That gets to you and eventually you don't try anymore and then you don't want to try any more because you realize there's no point to it, and likely never was. Like House says, People don't change.
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Of course there's no real point. You're not gonna get some super special secret message about what you're supposed to do with your life. You're just supposed to find some way to occupy your time until you die. Keep yourself entertained. Hang out and chill. Et cetera.
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Stop reading Hemmingway, for a start.
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Of course there's no real point. You're not gonna get some super special secret message about what you're supposed to do with your life. You're just supposed to find some way to occupy your time until you die. Keep yourself entertained. Hang out and chill. Et cetera.
Not helping at all....
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Fine, be uptight about it. :P
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Of course there's no real point. You're not gonna get some super special secret message about what you're supposed to do with your life. You're just supposed to find some way to occupy your time until you die. Keep yourself entertained. Hang out and chill. Et cetera.
Not helping at all....
She's the teenage girl wasting her time on a board she apparently has no interest in contentwise.
There's nothing wrong with not conforming to the stereotypical male. So long as your content and not beating yourself up about it.
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Fine, be uptight about it. :P
Apparently you haven't been paying attention, that's all I am.
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Liberator, you are engaging in a phenomenon called learned helplessness.
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Liberator, you are engaging in a phenomenon called learned helplessness.
Batt, I think that's the shortest post I've ever seen you make.
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Learned helplessness is a conditioned response. It only kicks in after repeated failed attempts to reach a goal. I don't think it counts if no attempt has been made there's no conditioned response to back it up either... . . .
This is more intraverse social reclusion.
But it's normal. Some people are just shy round the opposite gender or outside of their comfort zone. Fear is healthy in measured doses. It's never too late to test the waters of change though.
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Better to fail epically than to accomplish nothing.
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Failing epically accomplishes nothing, more often than not. Or more likely, accomplishes something in the negative direction.
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How would I get conditioned if I never felt like I had the right to do it in the first place.
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You don't need the right to do something, duh. Just do it.
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Heh, talk about needing to shape up.
Nothing is irreversible and nothing is beyond reparation.
Plenty of 'us' have been to the bad place where only monsters lurk and we get gobbled up inside by the darkness, perhaps not on a longer term, but I'd wager most people go through it at least one time or another in their lives.
You learn that only you can change it and it wont change itself if you just mope around and resign yourself to it.
So to turn IAZ's advice on it's head, You aren't "special", not uniquely unlovable.
You aren't ordained or destined to be someone or (not) do something.
You have no rails guiding your life.
You're not trapped in a cycle that will never lead anywhere.
The moment you step up to task in any way shape or form you start to put together the world you want to live in.
Life really IS what you make of it, and you can come through anything with a little self belief.
Relax and be yourself some time, you'll find that people are very talkative if you talk to them too, and listen.
You don't even have to say that much during social interaction to be accepted, just listen and make them feel like you're being attentive(helps if you are), but it means taking a step outta the door, and doing something.
Getting a job can be part of that too.
See about what you CAN do, and start from there, leave the little bubble you've blown around yourself and expand your horizons.
Nothing will ever happen if you don't swing the bat.
You'll eventually find out (if you apply yourself) that men and women are really very similar, on almost all levels, and once you apply that to your conversations in mentality you will never have trouble dealing with women again.
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Perhaps, perhaps not, but women don't want a thirtysomething with no job and no future as the potential father of her children. They want someone who will be able to provide for them and they're offspring as well as aid in the raising of said. They want winners, I am not now, nor have I ever been anything like a winner at anything.
Please remember that women aren’t robots. We’re not aliens. We’re not mindless breeding machines. We are, shockingly enough, people.
Think about it this way: say you’ve just met someone. You enjoy talking to her, she’s interested in some of the same things you are, and she’s reasonably attractive. Now imagine she feels the same way about you, and she asks you out. Are you going to make sure she’s fertile before you accept? Are you going to ask her where she works and how much she makes? Or are you going to go on the damn date and worry about that stuff after you’ve decided whether you even like her?
Most people don’t demand a résumé and references before entering a relationship. Maybe practical matters start to enter the equation when deciding whether to make a long-term commitment, but they’re going to be balanced against things like compatibility and mutual attraction and are not necessarily a deal-breaker in all circumstances. Maybe you can’t change your professional situation and so forth. But you can focus on being a good conversationalist, on being kind and responsive to other people’s needs, on being confident and positive and pleasant to spend time with. Those are things that are under your direct control, and they may carry you further than you think.
And some of us are perfectly capable of providing for ourselves, thanks.
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Failing epically accomplishes nothing, more often than not. Or more likely, accomplishes something in the negative direction.
But it does it with style, if that is its fate. Better to dare mighty things, to touch the fire even should it burn, than to shrink from it and forever wonder that perhaps you could have seized it...or forever believe you could not, when you might have.
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Perhaps, perhaps not, but women don't want a thirtysomething with no job and no future as the potential father of her children. They want someone who will be able to provide for them and they're offspring as well as aid in the raising of said. They want winners, I am not now, nor have I ever been anything like a winner at anything.
Please remember that women aren’t robots. We’re not aliens. We’re not mindless breeding machines. We are, shockingly enough, people.
Think about it this way: say you’ve just met someone. You enjoy talking to her, she’s interested in some of the same things you are, and she’s reasonably attractive. Now imagine she feels the same way about you, and she asks you out. Are you going to make sure she’s fertile before you accept? Are you going to ask her where she works and how much she makes? Or are you going to go on the damn date and worry about that stuff after you’ve decided whether you even like her?
Most people don’t demand a résumé and references before entering a relationship. Maybe practical matters start to enter the equation when deciding whether to make a long-term commitment, but they’re going to be balanced against things like compatibility and mutual attraction and are not necessarily a deal-breaker in all circumstances. Maybe you can’t change your professional situation and so forth. But you can focus on being a good conversationalist, on being kind and responsive to other people’s needs, on being confident and positive and pleasant to spend time with. Those are things that are under your direct control, and they may carry you further than you think.
And some of us are perfectly capable of providing for ourselves, thanks.
Perfectly aware that women aren't robots or breeding machines or whatever. I just also know that no matter who it is, she can do better with any one of the 2.2 billion other males on the planet.
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The only reason that's true is because you believe it's true.
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Out of interest Liberator, do you ever have events in your life where you feel completely the opposite to how you do now? I'm not talking about being sexually confident, but where you feel elated, full of energy and like you need nothing and no-one but yourself?
Because you are starting to sound to me, and please don't take this as any kind of dig or insult, as though you may be suffering from being bi-polar or depressive.
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Not really, no. I mean I get happy on the rare occasion where I manage to do something and not royally **** it up. Just today I said how nice it was when our harvester worked all day and we didn't have to shut down to fix something.
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I know that, for me, I can say or do something really bloody stupid, and then not realise for about 2 days that it was, and then spend years having the memory leap out and mug me.
I can be walking down the street and suddenly, for absolutely no reason, remember events from my past, things I've said or done in ignorance, and simply want to curl up into a ball and die. I still beat myself up over things I did 20 years ago, even though I know I would never do then now. I can write music and literally burst into tears whilst listening to the playback because of the emotions it invokes, that's given me trouble in the past, and tends to make me more or less abandon any kind of social life.
If Aldo or Wild Fragaria were here, they met me once, the only time I've ever met someone from either here or SG, and they met me when I was on the high point of the cycle, they'd be able to tell you that I'm not entirely in control at those points, fortunately for everyone, I try not to be around people on a low, but I'm sure if people searched through my posts, they'd be able to find at least a few that would hint at my emotional state at that point.
I'm just saying that this may go beyond simple self-esteem issues, and it may be relatively simple to do something about it if you are willing to talk to the right people about it.
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I have the emotional range of a rock. I don't get excited about stuff in places I'm supposed to, I didn't even cry at my grandfather(s) funeral years ago. At that time I remember wondering what kind of monster I was that I wasn't more grief ridden. My mom is going through some bad stuff medically right now and she might not make it through and while I'm worried for and about her, I'm not even the least bit sad about it, and that bothers me.
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Characteristic of depression. You really should seek treatment, man. It can't hurt (probably!)
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I think you internalize your feelings, it's not that you feel nothing, it's that you've spent your life trying not to show how you feel to other people, even self-hatred is an emotion, but I think you struggle to express it to those around you when you aren't using a secure, anonymous outlet like this board.
I'm sorry to hear about your mother, and I hope all will be well, but try not to over-analyse yourself, that can be dangerous, if you are worried for and about your mother, then you are perfectly normal, sadness is a difficult thing to define, and the mind has strange ways of dealing with stressful situations, but beating yourself up over not feeling everything you expected to feel will only make matters worse. When my Dad had a heart attack, I was scared and worried, but I couldn't, in all honesty, define my feelings as 'sad' in any way, maybe because you can only fit so many emotions into a situation that looms that large in your life.
I can't tell you why you have problems expressing how you feel to those around you, that is for you to discover, but don't confuse that for 'not feeling', and don't think that admitting that you are struggling to come to terms with something is somehow a fault.
My partner was 27 when she met me, and I was her first companion, so you are a long way from alone in that respect, it's not a race, it's not a target, it's something that comes to you when it, and you, are ready, and never before, but not being ready isn't a failing, it's simply a sign that you still have things to learn and accept about yourself, sometimes it's better to stop trying to be who you think you should be, and start being who you are.
There's nothing outside of your own mind that can confirm to you that you are happy, there's no magic 'thing' to find that creates happiness, it's all inside you, and if you give up on yourself, then you are giving up on your only chance to find it.
I'm not a psychologist, but I do think you could benefit from telling someone who is qualified how you feel, if you can't talk to those around you, then maybe someone qualified, and totally removed from the situation could help, it doesn't mean there's anything 'wrong' with you, it just means that some people communicate their feelings better to complete strangers than those who they have to see every day.