Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Mr. Vega on February 13, 2015, 12:52:44 pm
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The son of a ***** finally got what he deserved. (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/02/13/peter-molyneux-interview-godus-reputation-kickstarter/)
For those who don't know about the Godus fiasco, read here (http://www.wired.com/2015/02/molyneux-godus-kickstarter/) and here (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-02-11-the-god-who-peter-molyneux-forgot) about what happens when the great self-hype machine of video games does a Kickstarter.
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heard the last name and thought Stefan Molyneux, thought this was going to be a very much different thread.
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Man, what a scam that turned out to be.
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That RPS interview won't load for me.
I looked at this though:
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/feb/13/peter-molyneux-game-designer-interview-godus
It's not something I know what to think of really. I've read the posts here when Godus has come up, but I haven't been following it or anything. I hope he ultimately manages to deliver what the people paid for.
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Peter Molyneux has always been a dreamer. As a student at England’s Southampton Solent University in the early ’80s, he hatched a scheme to make a fortune by driving up to Scotland, buying a bunch of salmon, and then returning to sell it to local restaurants at a fantastic profit. It was only on the way home, after spending his savings, that he realized he had forgotten about refrigeration, leaving him broke and his car smelling of spoiled fish.
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I'm not sure that counts as "dreamer" so much as "blithering idiot."
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Sure, he was a dreamer. Likely still is. However, it pays off to wake up once in a while. :)
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The RPS site has been on and off today. Here's an archived version of the interview. (https://archive.today/20150213173751/http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/02/13/peter-molyneux-interview-godus-reputation-kickstarter/)
And here's an in depth article about just how much a scam Godus turned into. (http://kotaku.com/why-peter-molyneuxs-godus-is-such-a-disaster-1685539932)
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The way that interview starts tells me everything I need to know about how despicable Rock Paper Shotgun is. Burn that site masquerading as a journalistic news source. Burn it to the ground.
I mean , it's not easy for anyone to get me to sympathize with Peter Molyneux but they somehow managed it. Incredible. Achievement unlocked I guess. Also, very strong words there, Vega.
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A pity the first question overshadowed the rest of the interview, because what critics almost always say whenever every time Molyneux screws up is "oh, he just dreamed too big." This is not the standard developer can't anticipate schedule creep/cost overruns stuff that happens when you make a game. This is not in the same universe as that. This is what Molyneux does. Everytime, he makes extravagant claims and promises he never intends to keep. It was amusing when it was a few rich investors he was scamming, but now that it's backers money that's been wasted (and will doubtfully ever be refunded) people are starting to realize that maybe he's more dishonest than improbably naive. It appears Walker was incensed (https://twitter.com/botherer/status/565521903214133249) by Molyneux's (https://twitter.com/botherer/status/565522870072541184) behavoir (https://twitter.com/botherer/status/566223938137882624) prior to talking to him. If any game developer ever deserved to be put through that interview, it's Peter Molyneux.
"I don't think I've ever knowingly lied."
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I saw the Guardian interview this morning and I came here to post it. I love how he's now done three "final" interviews.
The saddest thing is that Peter Molyneux shouldn't need to hype his games. The guy behind Populous, Dungeon Keeper and Syndicate should let those games talk for themselves.
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I saw the Guardian interview this morning and I came here to post it. I love how he's now done three "final" interviews.
The saddest thing is that Peter Molyneux shouldn't need to hype his games. The guy behind Populous, Dungeon Keeper and Syndicate should let those games talk for themselves.
Unfortunately, those aren't the games most people think of when they hear Molyneux's name anymore.
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The way that interview starts tells me everything I need to know about how despicable Rock Paper Shotgun is. Burn that site masquerading as a journalistic news source. Burn it to the ground.
Yes, why does this Walker guy think he has any right to not give Molyneux the same softball questions that he has been getting for years! How dare he open the interview with a line of questioning about the personal integrity of someone whose integrity is in question? Yes, let's burn RPS to the ground, because we don't need people who are confrontational in games journalism!
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There's a difference between hardball interviewing and this, which is essentially phoning up a dev and having an argument with them.
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Thing is, I've never really gotten the feeling the PM is a liar, and that is pretty much the first question they ask. He's always struck me more as the sort of person who actually believes the stuff he says but then forgets about it later when more grounded people tell him it's too hard, too expensive or just plain impossible to do. That's quite different from going out there with the intention to deceive.
So for RPS to lead with that question is kind of a bad start.
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The thing is, I've owned Godus for a long time, and it is not a good game, I'll say that at the start.
This interview, however, seems way too combative from the start. Molyneux is far from the first developer to come up with a game design and then hit the brick wall of ability, though he's experienced enough to know better, this is a particular risk with Kickstarted games where people get to see the design stuff that never normally makes the light of day. But there are far larger companies that don't just overstate their ambition but really do lie about content and yet seem to get away with it, why suddenly decide to hit the 'home truths' button with a small developer near retirement?
One thing I have noticed on Kickstart is that the donators see themselves like a finance company providing money for developing a game, and therefore adopt a proprietary role with regards to the game, some companies, however, view them more as 'pre-purchases' and will provide very little feedback to the backers during the development (one of the biggest complaint about Godus).
Take games like War for the Overworld, weekly updates, regular patches, constant feedback from the developers, and it's turning into a fine game with a mostly supportive community because they feel like they are standing in front of an open door, and I think that is the way Kickstarts need to be approached.
Edit : Changed 'open source' to 'Kickstarted' in the second paragraph, used the wrong phrase.
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Reading through the actual interview, that interviewer is being a complete ass.
Sure, this whole godus thing has turned into a bloody fiasco, almost a downright scam. But the way this guy conducted the interview just seemed more like he wanted to rip molyneux a new asshole.
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Yeah, especially when it gets into the ridiculous aside about "oh Peter I remember the good times, when you made good games and we were happy". He seems to think it's his job to get into a personal spat with Molyneux, rather than act like a ****ing professional.
guess what, it's actually about journalistic standards in game media
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Thing is, I've never really gotten the feeling the PM is a liar, and that is pretty much the first question they ask. He's always struck me more as the sort of person who actually believes the stuff he says but then forgets about it later when more grounded people tell him it's too hard, too expensive or just plain impossible to do. That's quite different from going out there with the intention to deceive.
So for RPS to lead with that question is kind of a bad start.
He has done this so many times I am forced to conclude that either he is a cloud cookoolander with ADHD to such an extent that he makes Osaka from Azumanga Daioh look grounded, or he is a pathological liar who puts on that act as part of the con.
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I think you can make a good case that he really is a pathological liar; i.e. he is compelled to lie even when it's clearly self-destructive. I don't think he's really a sociopathic con-man, because he'd be more competent if he was. He just can't stop himself from promising things he knows he can't deliver, and he can't accept responsibility for doing so.
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I think you can make a good case that he really is a pathological liar; i.e. he is compelled to lie even when it's clearly self-destructive. I don't think he's really a sociopathic con-man, because he'd be more competent if he was. He just can't stop himself from promising things he knows he can't deliver, and he can't accept responsibility for doing so.
Let's go with that. That "aw shucks, I just can't help myself" shtick may have been real at some point, but now it's become a mask to protect himself.
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Disappointed with RPS. You can be "hard hitting" without being antagonistic, and this interview went way over that line.
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Jim Sterling, AKA The Jimquisition, just weighed in on this subject as well, and he does bring up a few points that I've not seen brought up previously...
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yt expects the video id, not the full url
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yt expects the video id, not the full url
Oops. Either way seemed to work for me, but meh, fixed. :)
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Meh. That guy always bothered me. He always talks like he knows the magic secret to video games, and give the impression that he is infallible. And yet, proof is in the pudding. I don't even understand why anyone is still even talking about the man. As Sterling put it in that video... We've known Peter's schtick for years. Move on... This show's another repeat performance.
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The way that interview starts tells me everything I need to know about how despicable Rock Paper Shotgun is. Burn that site masquerading as a journalistic news source. Burn it to the ground.
Yes, why does this Walker guy think he has any right to not give Molyneux the same softball questions that he has been getting for years! How dare he open the interview with a line of questioning about the personal integrity of someone whose integrity is in question? Yes, let's burn RPS to the ground, because we don't need people who are confrontational in games journalism!
A bit late to this but here's my two cents: you don't have only the two options of either be a complete unprofessional asshole or a softballer questioner. You can actually be quite professional, quite civil and quite on point, asking all the tough questions that your readers will find important to be answered. Instead, we get a "journalist" asking Molyneux if he's a pathological liar at the very outset. What can anyone answer to this? What is even this? "Saying truth to power"?
Is that it? Saying "Truth to power"? Is Molyneux "in power" now? Or is he now a sufficiently weak target that can be abused in this manner for he's obviously in his "way out" in the least charming possible way by mismanaging horribly his latest decade of games development? I can guess the answer to that last one. I will never see a RPS journalist ever asking someone like, IDK, Anita Sarkeesian why she's a "pathological liar" for having constantly failed to produce what she has promised to deliver at all. The reason is simple. Some people you are allowed to bully in interviews, others you are not. In this we recognize who is truly in power.
Not that I would ever hope for that to come. It's a despicable attitude and lack of civility, and as I would never like to see someone like Anita being treated that way by any reporter, I also didn't like having seen Molyneux being treated like this. I said it and I say it again: it's incredible how someone manages to make me defend Peter. In-****ing-credible. And yet, this guy managed to do so. Un-****ing-believable. Almost an impossible mission in itself.
It's not even a true question at all, I don't think Molyneux is a liar. He's obviously pathologically optimistically deluded, which is a very dangerous trait to have when you are managing other people's lives, money, etc., but a liar? Even if he is, even if we grant Vega his "outrage" at this old man, what is the value of this question? If anything, it just exposes how terrible you are at thinking about hard questions when you have spent hours thinking on the very first one you would ask of him and the thing that pops into your head is "I'm gonna insult the guy real hard, that's just how I roll".
About Peter Molyneux? Meh. I've played Godus. Uninstalled it already, it was meh. I still remember I loved Black and White. I loved Syndicate. ****ing loved it. What is this journo ever been famous for? Outside of calling a well known developer a "pathological liar"?
Right.
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Okay, so thinking back on it, yes, Walker was unprofessional in this interview. He was obviously enraged and had an axe to grind.
But at the same time, I cannot bring myself to be sympathetic with Molyneux. He does his best to paint himself as the aggrieved party, as the dreamer who dared to dream and learned to fail, but I for one cannot buy it. Not with his history, not with the way the whole Curiousity/Godus fiasco shaped up.
I also cannot agree with your point about RPS "masquerading as a journalistic news source". RPS has a style, a unique editorial voice, and pieces like Walker's fit right into it. Why burn it to the ground, when this is one small misstep in its history? I for one will continue to read it, because Walker, Rossignol, Smith, Meer, O'Connor and Warr produce some of the best news in PC gaming for me.
Then there's your question about "what this journalist has ever been famous for". It doesn't matter. It really doesn't. It's the "Why don't you make your own games" argument again, and we all know how bad and fallacious it is.
(Also, preemptive notice because it's become unfortunately necessary: The second anyone jumps on Luis' dig at Anita Sarkeesian, this thread is dead. Yes, I too would like to argue about it. But we've been down this road, and nothing good ever comes of it. Please keep that in mind.)
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I was being hyperbolic in my "burn it to the ground", don't take me that seriously. Regarding Molyneux, this interview comes after an opinion piece on his faults. I didn't comment on it, I haven't read it yet but I do know it is quite critical of him. That's 100% fair, and it can even be journalism if it actually informed the viewership on the tribulations of his latest career and the whole shenanigans regarding godus and so on. (If the article is the one that focuses on the kid who won an award from a previous game, I did read it). If you want to criticize all the wrong things that person X did while promising the moon, you are 100% entitled to do so, and if you are a journalist, it's even your duty.
But an interview is not the place to grind axes. It's a place for asking questions. And if a journalist has the utter lack of civility and humility to understand this, if he has sufficient arrogance to call him names on the spot, then yes, I'm entitled to ask about him, who the **** are you to speak in this tone?
Regarding my example, I just brought it up because I know you and Vega like that particular person, that was the only motivation for me bringing it up. I repeat, as much axes I would have to grind about anyone, say, Kissinger, say Cheney, say Bin Laden, this is not how a journalist works. As an aside, Notch immediately tweeted after the fact, "Note to self: don't agree to interviews with RPS." So, hurray?!?
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(Also, preemptive notice because it's become unfortunately necessary: The second anyone jumps on Luis' dig at Anita Sarkeesian, this thread is dead. Yes, I too would like to argue about it. But we've been down this road, and nothing good ever comes of it. Please keep that in mind.)
Hopefully Luis' question can be answered in a very innocent manner: The reason why Anita Sarkeesian will not be interviewed by RPS is because RPS is a website about games criticism, not games criticism criticism. Anita Sarkeesian falls outside their scope.
As such, the two articles about Sarkeesian on RPS (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/tag/anita-sarkeesian/) have been about the harassment aimed against her rather then her work. Contrast this with how much coverage Peter Molyneux gets (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/tag/Peter-molyneux/), which is not only an order of a magnitude greater, but also about him and his work.