Author Topic: Why I hate the UN  (Read 2368 times)

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Offline redmenace

  • 211
global economics has done far more to the end of merging countries together than UN ever has. All I can see is a poorly managed organization, causing more harm than good.
Example in the Congo
http://www.manilatimes.net/national/2004/nov/24/yehey/world/20041124wor1.html
This is mirrored in other nations the UN has been to.
Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else.
              -Frederic Bastiat

 

Offline Janos

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"The United Nations is central to global efforts to solve problems that challenge humanity." - un.org.
That being said, UN is not just a discussion forum of several countries, it's an umbrella attempt to try and solve international problems where single countries or even continents are insufficient.

Redmenace, what parts of UN would you like to scrap or renew? General convention? SC? Economic and Social Council? ICJ? WHO, WMO? UNICEF? WFP? UNEP? How about IAEA and WTO - though not exactly part of UN, they have quite a lot to do with it.
lol wtf

 

Offline Janos

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Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
You actually want to give an organization that give positons of some authority to despots and genocidal maniacs nukes?


Yeah, we totally should kick them out, because then we can control their nukes and other insane way better! If they have no position in our organization, they will like totally listen to us!
 no wait
lol wtf

 
Quote
Originally posted by vyper
What if the voting public wasn't told the full consequences though?


Indeed - I'm sure no EU citizen was told it'd be contributing money to a corrupt bureaucracy where 95% of its financial audits were declared fraudulent by independent auditors this year. It's quite probably the most corrupt institution in the world.

 

Offline Crazy_Ivan80

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Quote
by vyper  What if the voting public wasn't told the full consequences though?


not the fault of the EU
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Offline Janos

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Quote
Originally posted by SadisticSid


Indeed - I'm sure no EU citizen was told it'd be contributing money to a corrupt bureaucracy where 95% of its financial audits were declared fraudulent by independent auditors this year. It's quite probably the most corrupt institution in the world.


Source plz.
lol wtf

 
 

Offline vyper

  • 210
  • The Sexy Scotsman
Quote
Originally posted by Crazy_Ivan80


not the fault of the EU


So allowing it's member states to lie to it's citizens in a vote that gives the EU more power is in absolutely no way the responsibility of the EU?

If the Yanks did something like that on a state wide basis you'd slaughter them.
"But you live, you learn.  Unless you die.  Then you're ****ed." - aldo14

 

Offline Janos

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Thanks for the links! What is that yourparty site? It seems a bit biased.

However, yeah. The fraud evidence seems massive. However, there is not evidence that 95% of the entire audits is fraudulent, that was one person's claim and needs to be prooved right or wrong.
Now there's at least 10 000 suspected cases of fraud, totalling £700 million.

Too bad I have never paid any real attention to economics. I'm much more of politics, international stuff, history and enviroment/ecology/biology dude. :/
lol wtf

 
Quote
Originally posted by Janos
Thanks for the links! What is that yourparty site? It seems a bit biased.

However, yeah. The fraud evidence seems massive. However, there is not evidence that 95% of the entire audits is fraudulent, that was one person's claim and needs to be prooved right or wrong.
Now there's at least 10 000 suspected cases of fraud, totalling £700 million.

Too bad I have never paid any real attention to economics. I'm much more of politics, international stuff, history and enviroment/ecology/biology dude. :/


It isn't one person's evidence. Andreasen, the whistleblower in question, pointed this out two years ago. It's the EU's own auditors that have come up with the evidence. I found another article on the Telegraph site but can't link to it since you need to log in to the site to view certain articles. But here it is if you need proof:

Quote
Auditors reject 'unsafe' EU budget
By Ambrose Evans-Pritchard in Brussels
(Filed: 17/11/2004)

The European Union's financial watchdog refused to sign off the Brussels budget yesterday for the tenth year in a row, finding that 93.4 per cent of spending was either unsafe or riddled with errors.

The figures released by the European Court of Auditors were even worse than last year, when 91 per cent was deemed unsafe, chiefly due to abuses in the new member states in Eastern Europe.

"Once again, the court has no reasonable assurance that the supervisory systems and controls of significant areas of the budget are effectively implemented," it said.

It rebuked Brussels in its annual report for failing to "satisfy the legitimate expectations of the citizens of the union".

Spot checks found fraud or error – leading to demands for repayment – in 25 per cent of farm aid in Italy, 23 per cent in Greece, 21 per cent in Spain and 14 per cent in France, but most abuses remain undiscovered.

The error rate for farm aid in Britain was six per cent, falling to one per cent in Holland, Denmark, and Finland.

A senior EU auditor said the £70 billion Brussels budget was "high risk" because most of it was doled out to member states, making it hard to track.

But he said commission insiders set a dreadful tone by behaving like "rats in a bag seeking to evade responsibility".

Gordon Brown, the Chancellor, seized on the report to boost his call for an EU spending cap of one per cent of GDP.

 

Offline Janos

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OK, thanks for correction.
lol wtf

 

Offline AlphaOne

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Well I dont know what to make of this but one thing is clear an that the UN is at this time useless It cant enforce its arguments against enine enimore and it sucks when we speak of peace keeping that is why the US is so involved with its own personal troops in most hot zones around the globe some lgit and some not so legit but that is beside th point. The point is that the UN is useless (mi own opinion). And giving the UN nuclear weapons is not the solution on the contrary, but what I agree is the fact that th UN needs a powerfull milatary and to be more independent not serving varios powerfull goverments across the globe.
They should take an example from the EU wich is now tring to be form its own police and own milatary force to protect its interests.
As far as I am concerned go EU go EU:yes:
Die shivan die!!
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Offline Janos

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Quote
Originally posted by AlphaOne
Well I dont know what to make of this but one thing is clear an that the UN is at this time useless It cant enforce its arguments against enine enimore and it sucks when we speak of peace keeping that is why the US is so involved with its own personal troops in most hot zones around the globe some lgit and some not so legit but that is beside th point.
[/b]

I have a headache. Care to check your spelling?

First, head to www.un.org and do some basic research on the institution. Then proceed.

UN is a discussion forum. It is meant to solve the problems of the world by using interaction, participant states' resources, peaceful approach an so on. It is also bound by what is called Security Council. Most of the people in the world have heard of it.  

Now, nowhere in UN's mission it is stated that UN should have own army, weapons, whatever. Besides, under who's control would they be? SC - a combo of different nations with different interests? General Convention - hell no! Head Secretary? Some new weirdo council? Who would they be responsible to - themselves?

UN's peacekeeping duties have included places like Suez, Cyprus, Yugoslavian cluster****, East Timor, Lebanon, Angola, Haiti, Cambodia, Afghanistan and so on. Some of the missions have been successful, some of them less so. The key point, however, is that on the last hand everything relies on the member states. UN could announce a peacekeeping/enforcing action in Iraq, but whether it would pass the SC or anyone would actually send anything except their goodwillingness and condolences is completely another matter. Now comes the part of your post which I do not understand at all.  To prevent misunderstanding, I'll keep my filthy sweaty hands that have ventured to places where the sun does not shine off it.




Quote

 The point is that the UN is useless (mi own opinion). And giving the UN nuclear weapons is not the solution on the contrary, but what I agree is the fact that th UN needs a powerfull milatary and to be more independent not serving varios powerfull goverments across the globe.
[/b]
HOW WOULD IT GAIN THE AUTHORITY TO DO SO? Would they just be granted with absolute power? Who would decide of it? It's a bit hard to say "hey, we now have absolute control over you and **** you if you want to have anything to say about it". Success of such an institution would be counted in months, if not days.

Of course, examples like, oh, Gulf War 1 and well, Korean war have shown that sometimes, when the decision not sunk by some permanent SC member, UN has given legitimacy to perform acts of war. Whoever has the willingness and firepower to achieve the goal would then be granted the right to **** **** up.

Quote

They should take an example from the EU wich is now tring to be form its own police and own milatary force to protect its interests.
As far as I am concerned go EU go EU:yes:


But EU is not a huge international forum of hundreds of different cultures, but instead a market and political area with 25 countries who share much more united history and culture than let's say UK and Congo.
lol wtf

 

Offline Fergus

  • 28
The UN is corrupt in many of its ares, Britain is corrupt, the US is corrupt, France is corrupt, Italy is corrupt, Spain is corrupt, China is corrupt, Chechnya, Afganistan, Iraq (oh yes), Russia, Ukraine, Ireland, Colombia, Libya, Japan, christ New Zealand is probably corrupt to.  There is nothing we can do about it.  You may say "lets not pay it anything till it fixes it".  Fine, if you are prepared to let thousands die because a lack of funds has reduced the amount of aid you are going to recieve.  The UN may make some mistakes, but for goodness sake look at what it has managed to do.  Angola and Ethiopia once the poorest countries in the world, wracked by poverty, hunger and bitter civil war, now doing much better, with a great degree of these problems solved.  The anti-desertification process to stop the enroaching sands of the Sahara has met some success.
  I'm sorry, regardless of the corruption we need the UN.  I am not giving up on it yet, I'm not that jaded.
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Offline vyper

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  • The Sexy Scotsman
[q]the amount of aid you are going to recieve[/q]

I wasn't aware I recieved any.
"But you live, you learn.  Unless you die.  Then you're ****ed." - aldo14

  

Offline Fergus

  • 28
bad grammer, nothing more.  Okay then not you, the millions of people below the poverty line.
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