[Mawhrin]

You haven't explained Capella...

I'm guessing that they felt cornered, and decided to turn Capella into a temporary jump node to escape

The node to Gamma Draconis remained intact, and unless the Knossos' node has collapsed the Shivans could simply return from the way they came. There's no evidence of this. The Shivans may have been able to tell if it were collapsing, and they sent all their Sathanes through it after the Knossos was destroyed.

Some theories suggest the Shivans were being chased.

[IceFire]

You haven't explained Capella...

I'm guessing that they felt cornered, and decided to turn Capella into a temporary jump node to escape (and conveniently destroying a huge number of their enemies in the process). It seems like a good move: you get some of your ships out (which probably have the rest of the ships crews on board, or maybe they even ran the juggernauts that got destroyed by remote) and do severe damage to the foe at the same time. Its also quite possible that they can build ships in a very short time, and possibly have a sub-race dedicated to flying fightercraft that matures in a much shorter time (thus allowing them to use swarm tactics VERY effectively), so they didn't loose much. We never really see how advanced the Shivans are compared to the GTVA, outside of the ships themselves, so this is quite plausible.

(I'm getting some inspiration from Arther C Clark/Gentry Lee here. I just finished reading the Rendezvous with Rama series.)

I'd be surprised if the Shivans felt cornered by the GTVA.  80 juggernaughts could wipe out the GTVA as quickly as each could jump to each of the GTVA systems and flatten everything in their way.  Lets assume that the GTVA could be successful at somehow disabling or destroying even a handful...heck lets go half way and say 40 juggernaughts destroyed, disabled, or severely damaged and out of the fight...there are still more uber killing ships of death than there are GTVA systems to destroy.

Capella was probably very little about the GTVA and more about some sort of overriding goal or objective that required destroying a star.  My theory is that it was some sort of subspace bridge or temporary supernode.  The remaining juggernaughts jumped away...destination is unknown of course.

[General Battuta]

I just finished reading the Rendezvous with Rama series.

Heh... I'm in "The Garden of Rama" right now.

Ouch!

Isn't it all a bit downhill after the first one? Gentry Lee doesn't seem up to snuff.

[James Freeman]

You haven't explained Capella...

I'm guessing that they felt cornered, and decided to turn Capella into a temporary jump node to escape (and conveniently destroying a huge number of their enemies in the process). It seems like a good move: you get some of your ships out (which probably have the rest of the ships crews on board, or maybe they even ran the juggernauts that got destroyed by remote) and do severe damage to the foe at the same time. Its also quite possible that they can build ships in a very short time, and possibly have a sub-race dedicated to flying fightercraft that matures in a much shorter time (thus allowing them to use swarm tactics VERY effectively), so they didn't loose much. We never really see how advanced the Shivans are compared to the GTVA, outside of the ships themselves, so this is quite plausible.

(I'm getting some inspiration from Arther C Clark/Gentry Lee here. I just finished reading the Rendezvous with Rama series.)

I'd be surprised if the Shivans felt cornered by the GTVA.  80 juggernaughts could wipe out the GTVA as quickly as each could jump to each of the GTVA systems and flatten everything in their way.  Lets assume that the GTVA could be successful at somehow disabling or destroying even a handful...heck lets go half way and say 40 juggernaughts destroyed, disabled, or severely damaged and out of the fight...there are still more uber killing ships of death than there are GTVA systems to destroy.

Capella was probably very little about the GTVA and more about some sort of overriding goal or objective that required destroying a star.  My theory is that it was some sort of subspace bridge or temporary supernode.  The remaining juggernaughts jumped away...destination is unknown of course.

I don't mean they felt threatened by the GTVA's ships. I feel they may have been threatened by the GTVA collapsing jump nodes. Remember, they had 80 or so juggernauts in the system. They may have felt the best course of action was to set off a supernova in the system. Why?

1: if the GTVA was going to set of another Menson bomb, they would probably have their ships leave first. And even if they didn't, the ships would be just as worthless. No need to destroy something that is already unrecoverable. (I'm assuming that the Shivans do NOT have intelligence on how the GTVA is researching the Knossos portal to stabilize jump nodes.)

2: if the ships where gone, and the node closed, destroying the star would be a waste of Juggernauts. And even though fighters are expendable, a juggernaut is not nearly as easily wasted, never mind how many that couldn't get out. The Shivans where maximizing their ship's value.

I just finished reading the Rendezvous with Rama series.

Heh... I'm in "The Garden of Rama" right now.

Ouch!

Isn't it all a bit downhill after the first one? Gentry Lee doesn't seem up to snuff.

It's not that bad. They ARE another author's work, after all. And I agree, they aren't as good as the original Rama.

[Droid803]

Problem: The Shivans started the Supernova thing before the GTVA collapsed any of the nodes.

[Killer Whale]

Wrong, they collapsed the knossess (though it didn't work) and the one that the bastion blew up. There was one to go and they were evacuating the last civilians before they took the last node, and all of a sudden capella supernovaed.

[Droid803]

Yea, but the saths are all around Capella long before the Clash of the Titans II. (Of which I have no idea why the mission is named that way - there's only one big ship in it, and a whole lot of Nahemas. The Colly vs Sath mission would have been a better mission to use that name...)

[IceFire]

Wrong, they collapsed the knossess (though it didn't work) and the one that the bastion blew up. There was one to go and they were evacuating the last civilians before they took the last node, and all of a sudden capella supernovaed.

Might be a lesser point but they didn't collapse the Knossos portal.  They destroyed the device.  It doesn't suggest directly that they were destroying or planning to destroy the node from within.  Small point and I see the obvious contention that you had a half logical mind then it wouldn't take much to go further and suggest the node could be destroyed by that magnitude of weapon.

The other thing I do have to point out is that the Shivans began powering up the subspace field long before the Bastion blew up the node so the supernova plan was not likely in response to the Bastions actions although perhaps may have caused them to expedite the plan.  That we can't be certain of.

[James Freeman]

Wrong, they collapsed the knossess (though it didn't work) and the one that the bastion blew up. There was one to go and they were evacuating the last civilians before they took the last node, and all of a sudden capella supernovaed.

Might be a lesser point but they didn't collapse the Knossos portal.  They destroyed the device.  It doesn't suggest directly that they were destroying or planning to destroy the node from within.  Small point and I see the obvious contention that you had a half logical mind then it wouldn't take much to go further and suggest the node could be destroyed by that magnitude of weapon.

The other thing I do have to point out is that the Shivans began powering up the subspace field long before the Bastion blew up the node so the supernova plan was not likely in response to the Bastions actions although perhaps may have caused them to expedite the plan.  That we can't be certain of.

Point taken. I'll see if I can work this in somehow... Perhaps they got isolated from Shadowspace, and needed to blow up a star to get there? Perhaps the 'Knossos Nebula' had a portal to Shadowspace in it, but did the GTVA destroy the jump node as well? Or maybe the node collapsed when the Knossos was destroyed? Damn it, I need to get my ass back in my fighter and play up to that point again (I lost my save file).

[FreeSpaceFreak]

Perhaps the 'Knossos Nebula' had a portal to Shadowspace in it, but did the GTVA destroy the jump node as well?

No, we didn't.

Or maybe the node collapsed when the Knossos was destroyed?

No, it didn't. At least, not that we now of.

Damn it, I need to get my ass back in my fighter and play up to that point again (I lost my save file).

Yes, it might help a lot.

[Fearless Leader]

The other thing I do have to point out is that the Shivans began powering up the subspace field long before the Bastion blew up the node so the supernova plan was not likely in response to the Bastions actions although perhaps may have caused them to expedite the plan.  That we can't be certain of.

What if they had some sort of master plan, and us destroying the nodes around the star system messed it up, disrupted whatever they were trying to do? Has anybody ever asked that before?