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Author Topic: Don't worry, I'm alive  (Read 15907 times)

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Offline Sandwich

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Reply #180 on: June 26, 2002, 05:04:35 am
Quote
Originally posted by Grey Wolf 2009
Sandwich, to truly assess this, you must view this from a 3rd-person perspective, prefferably one which doesn't favor destroying everything :D

But anyway, the fact that the Palestinian militants want to destroy Israel is not a true cross-section of the Palestinian people. I bet that if we took your standard, mild-mannered, peace-loving Palestinian and your standard, mild-mannered, peace-loving Israeli, they'd probably get along pretty well. If you didn't talk about religion, they probably would be very similar, other than the fact that the Muslim would be sober all the time due to the ban on alchohol. Most people's opinions are based on what they hear in the media, whether independent, corporate, or state-run. You have to remember that all these sources are BIASED. BIAS is BAD. You get misconceptions, which are formed into beliefs. If you were to base your opinions on what the media reports, you'd probably think that all Americans are pot-smoking, acid-taking, drunken bastards who complain all the time and get into accidents (BTW, most of that is wrong expcept for the fact that quite a few people do complain that much.)

But anyway, always use common-sense when considering this sort of subject. Are they all blood-thirsty terrorists? Or are they most likely normal people?


So, of course they'd get along - that's exactly what heppened in the area before Oslo! It even happens to a certain extent today - just last night my brother went to a going-away party for a friend of his - they went to eat in Abu-Gosh, an Arab neighborhood on the outskirts of Jerusalem. Israelis go there all the time, mainly for the restaurants, which are simply outstanding. The people running those places are, to the best of my knowledge, Israeli-Arabs. Do you know what the difference is between a Palestinian and an Israeli Arab? (sounds like the beginning of a joke, I know - but it ain't) The Israeli-Arab has Israeli citizenship, while the Palestinian doesn't. That's it. So you have today a situation where Jew and Arab not only "get along", but out-and-out profit from an ongoing relationship.

So why the hatred on the Palestinian side? Why can't they realize that we can live in relative peace and harmony, without blowing each other up?

Indoctrination. The Palestinian children are brought up with the notion that Israel is an enemy, that becoming a martyr is oh-so glorious, etc etc. Before the Oslo accords, the Abu-Gosh situation was repeated throughout the country - Jews and Arabs living in harmony with each other.

And don't assume that I have misconceptions about Americans, Grey Wolf. In case you didn't know (apparently you didn't...), I'm an American just as much as any other American. Born and raised, etc etc. :)

Quote
Originally posted by Grey Wolf 2009
On another note, "Jihad" does not mean just "Holy War". AFAIK, it mean service to Islam in many different forms.


Quote
From The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
[color=444490]ji·had[/color][/size] also [color=444490]je·had[/color] (jĭ-häd').
n.
[list=1]
  • A Muslim holy war or spiritual struggle against infidels.
  • A crusade or struggle: “The war against smoking is turning into a jihad against people who smoke” (Fortune).
    [/list=1]
    [Arabic jihâd, from jahada, to strive.]
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline Blitz_Lightning

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Reply #181 on: June 26, 2002, 05:12:55 am
Yes, although Jihad means "holy war", Jihad can only end when Islam takes over the whole world. According to Islam, the world is split up into two: Al-dar-Harb (land of the lawless) and Al-dar-Islam (land of the lawful). These two lands are in constant conflict until either Islam takes over the world or is wiped out. This war doesn't end until the whole world submits to Islam.
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Offline Sandwich

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Reply #182 on: June 26, 2002, 07:05:49 am
Quote
Originally posted by Blitz_Lightning
Yes, although Jihad means "holy war", Jihad can only end when Islam takes over the whole world. According to Islam, the world is split up into two: Al-dar-Harb (land of the lawless) and Al-dar-Islam (land of the lawful). These two lands are in constant conflict until either Islam takes over the world or is wiped out. This war doesn't end until the whole world submits to Islam.


Well then, there you go. That's why I don't believe there will ever be a lasting peace between those that adhere faithfully to Islam and the rest of the world.

The Muslims that people in Western countries are familiar with personally usually aren't the kind that strictly adhere to Islam, therefore the West doesn't truly understand what the situation is like.
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
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