Author Topic: Cyclone-class missile cruiser  (Read 24138 times)

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Offline Nico

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
to the repair shop? a missile doesn't go bang if it's not armed :p
SCREW CANON!

 

Offline NeoHunter

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
You do have a point there.

But if a ship gets damaged, you don't go to no freakin' repair shop. You go to the space shipyards!:D

 

Offline Shrike

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
Quote
Originally posted by NeoHunter
Seriously, if a shot accidentally hits those missile racks, you know where the crew will be heading to.
It's called a magazine explosion and that's plagued warships for as long as they've been warships.  But luckily the missiles aren't even explosive until they're armed, because they use capacitor systems.  That means they only get charged right before launch, and before that are merely flammable/meltable.

Haven't decided if they're going to have nuclear tips as well, that's another 'safe' munition type - nukes don't go off unless they're detonated, if they're hit they simply don't work.
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Offline Warlock

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
How come half the thruster glows sort of look like buttlefly wings ? ;)

Seriously though....she's coming along nicely :D
Warlock



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 We meet our fate together

 

Offline NeoHunter

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
Quote
Originally posted by Shrike
Haven't decided if they're going to have nuclear tips as well, that's another 'safe' munition type - nukes don't go off unless they're detonated, if they're hit they simply don't work.


You know, now you are going a bit to the "overkill" section. What you want the missile cruiser to do? Planetary bombardment?

 

Offline Stryke 9

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
I'd assume that'd be the plan. Nukes suck when detonated in space- you practically might as well roll up a spitball and get a straw.

 

Offline Shrike

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Quote
Originally posted by NeoHunter
You know, now you are going a bit to the "overkill" section. What you want the missile cruiser to do? Planetary bombardment?
Engaging enemy vessels with ultradrive missile is the plan.  Each of those missiles is half the size of an SLBM.  A damn big missile for how much bang they actually carry.

And despite whatever erronious information Stryke is feeding you, nuclear weapons do not suck in space, they merely have no effective blast radii, like any other weapons in a vaccum.  They're still highly effective in dumping energetic particles into a target.  You won't kill them with overpressure, but the ability to fry them with radiant energy not lessened by the vaccum.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

 

Offline Turnsky

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
stars are an excellent case-in-point
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Offline Stryke 9

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
Not really. Assuming that spaceships a century or so down the road are built to withstand direct sunlight from a star slightly larger than our own, shouldn't really be a problem. See, it's not filtered out by an atmosphere at all, and when you're dealing with something as utterly lethal as gamma radiation, you don't **** around and not make the shielding several times stronger than it would need to be under normal circumstances. That'd be like saying that, under normal operation, your car wouldn't need to hold up to much more damage than a stray piece of gravel would make, so it's okay to build the frame out of paper mache.

Now, if you could get the nukes to penetrate the hull before detonating, you'd have something going. Given the limited atmosphere of the inside of a ship, there'd be enough for a good-sized fireball and a nasty shockwave that would utterly wipe the inside of the ship but wouldn't do too much damage to anything outside of it, assuming there's enough armor to withstand **** like plasma and hundred-terawatt laser beams- it would largely hold the explosion in. Try that instead, why not.

 

Offline Shrike

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There is a very big difference between a star at 150,000,000km and a 1 MT nuke at fifty meters.  The later has a flux intensity of 133 gigajoules per square meter, delivered at a very high wattage.

If you're using multi-hundred terawatt energy weapon, you're already in the nuclear ranges anyhow... 100 terawatts is 24 kilotons/s.

Never mind if you start using shaped blast nukes or bomp-pumped lasers.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

 

Offline Stryke 9

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Well, but that's the thing- I seriously doubt a spacefaring warship would burn up if it got closer than 150 million kilometers. ****, in the FS and most other universes, they're built to handle burning balls of plasma that are several times as big as a person- that's a small sun right there, and one hell of a lot hotter than a nuclear fireball besides.

 

Offline Shrike

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Quote
Originally posted by Stryke 9
Well, but that's the thing- I seriously doubt a spacefaring warship would burn up if it got closer than 150 million kilometers. ****, in the FS and most other universes, they're built to handle burning balls of plasma that are several times as big as a person- that's a small sun right there, and one hell of a lot hotter than a nuclear fireball besides.
Riiiiiiight.  Care to back that up with numbers?  How a plasma ball is going to be hotter than a fusion explosion?  A fusion reaction is going to be solid X/Gamma rays with a bit of plasma from the casing and missile.  I haven't been able to find the effective wattage, but it's at least three orders of magnitude above the energy released.

Oh, and FYI, the flux intensity at 1 AU is about 1 kW/m^2 from the sun.  8 orders of magnitude difference from our 1 MT bomb.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

 

Offline Turnsky

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
actually, pure lightning, is hotter than the surface of the sun(dunno how much tho), and the big fireball produced just on the onset of a nuclear detonation is precisely the same type of reaction that keeps the sun oh so hot and shiny (fission and fusion) plasma i think is beyond steam (when i mean by steam i mean vapor in general) and therfore by no means, hotter than a star, the trouble is however is keeping plasma contained, it has a nasty habit of destablizing without proper containment. hell energy delivered via bigass balls of plasma aint nothin compared to what hypervelocity objects could do to current spacecraft i.e a object the size of a pea travelling at several hundred clicks plus completely obliterating a satellite. think of hurling a piece of metal the size of a shipping container with a explosive warhead into a large fs stye cruiser or destroyer at near light speeds, not only would it have the power to penetrate the hull, but the warhead itself would cause a lotta internal damage to boot
« Last Edit: March 14, 2003, 03:39:39 pm by 86 »
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Offline Shrike

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The temperature at the surface at the sun has as much relevance to the temperature of a fusion reaction as the outside temperature of your car does to the temperatures inside the pistons as they combust.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

 

Offline Turnsky

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point noted
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Offline Stryke 9

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Fusion or fission, Shrike? They're not interchangeable.

For one thing, fusion is plasma-based (the hydrogen and lithium(?) field is plasmicised at extreme temperatures) while a conventional fusion bomb hardly generates enough heat to make any plasma at all. Plasma is the **** at the core of the sun, and it is many many times hotter than a degrading uranium sphere.

The radiation from a fission reaction is estimated to be many times greater than a fusion one (only reason the sun can irradiate anything is because it's a combination of the two), and that's where the useful weapon in a nuke is- emphatically not in the heat generation, which is negligible on this scale and could be generated much more efficiently.

However, if you were thinking of some sort of fusion bomb when you said "nuclear", that'd be a very nasty antiarmor device indeed, though its spread probably wouldn't be nearly as great as a conventional nuke's.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2003, 04:04:26 pm by 262 »

 

Offline Turnsky

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Cyclone-class missile cruiser
depends on where or how you use it,
(eg. nagasaki did less damage than hiroshima although the yeild on both bombs were the same it was because the terrain contained the blast)
 now if anyone actually succeeded in producing and containing antimatter.. (big bang theory anyone?)
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Offline Stryke 9

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We're talking about using it in space. Against other capships. Evidently, from outside the hull.

 

Offline Turnsky

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oops
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Offline Shrike

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Quote
Originally posted by Stryke 9
Fusion or fission, Shrike? They're not interchangeable.

For one thing, fusion is plasma-based (the hydrogen and lithium(?) field is plasmicised at extreme temperatures) while a conventional fusion bomb hardly generates enough heat to make any plasma at all. Plasma is the **** at the core of the sun, and it is many many times hotter than a degrading uranium sphere.

The radiation from a fission reaction is estimated to be many times greater than a fusion one (only reason the sun can irradiate anything is because it's a combination of the two), and that's where the useful weapon in a nuke is- emphatically not in the heat generation, which is negligible on this scale and could be generated much more efficiently.

However, if you were thinking of some sort of fusion bomb when you said "nuclear", that'd be a very nasty antiarmor device indeed, though its spread probably wouldn't be nearly as great as a conventional nuke's.
Actually, they are fairly interchangeable in end results.  Fission spews out heavy radioactives and various particles, yes, but they both spike in the X/Gamma ray spectrum.  I think it's safe to assume any future nuclear weapon would either be thermonuclear or straight fission, however.  I don't know the last time the US or Russia built straight fission weapons.  Not recently, I'm quite sure.

And I'd really like to see your data sources on fusion reactions and weapons.  The entire sun is made of plasma, going from millions of degrees at the core to ~6000  degrees at the surface.  A fusion detonation will have temperates in the millions to tens of millions of degrees and will plasmacise all the non-reacted material around it.  This is exactly what generates a nuclear fireball.

A fission bomb generates more long-term radiation by scattering various unpleasant isotopes, but a fusion reaction is entirely prompt radiation, X/Gamma rays.  These have excellent penetrative abilities and will dump a lot of thermal energy effectively instantaneously.  In fact, a fusion reaction is probably superior, because the radiation it emits has superior penetrative abilities compared to many of the atomic products of a fission bomb.  And I don't know why you say that 133 gigajoules per square meter of surface area is 'negligeable'.  It's really a hell of a lot of energy.  Plus it's a much simpler delivery system then trying to dump terawatts of energy through a laser, where you have to worry about the heat generated by such a device.... and by the time you can realistically generate that kind of energies, warheads of much greater than 1 MT could easily be used.  Especially if you go AM.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.