Author Topic: The state of Freespace address.  (Read 11800 times)

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Offline Unknown Target

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The state of Freespace address.
Well, what's happening to Freespace?
Personally, the game is almost done for me, as the gameplay is getting quite musty, and I've finally found a worthy game as a successor (Hegemonia: www.hegemonia.info).
Anyways, I look at Freespace now as a sort of legend to me.
It truly has changed my life, although, in many ways, not for the better, as I spend more time on the PC now than I rightfully should :D.
However, I look around and I see all this campaigns starting up, and the SCP making great headway, but I'm forced to ask the eternal question:

"How long will it last?"

HLP is a great community, it really is, but it's flaw, if it had to have one, is that it's based and centered around a 4-year-old game that's getting  even older by the second.
There are, of course, the huge new campaigns, like Black Water Ops coming out, but it's appeal would be reletavely tiny, as it would be limited to the remaining audience of the Freespace game series.
Now, one of two things could happen:

1)We could let Freespace slide. It eventually might get old enough so that Thunder, Shrike, and the rest of them, simply don't have the time to manage this site anymore, and it would shut down. That would be the true death toll for the Freespace community, as volitionwatch could not possibly handle everything and stay current enough. Freespace woud die a slow, torturous death.

2)There could somehow be a Freespace 3. The SCP could better it's material, and the entire community could pitch in to buy the now dirt-cheap Freespace liscence from the crumbling Interplay. That would be quite a good idea, as how much each person donated could be recoreded, and he would be repaid by sales, and mabey even extra.

So, what are your thoughts?

Note: this is not a "Goodbye, I'm leaving" thing. This is just me posing a viable question.

 
The state of Freespace address.
i think buying the rights from interplay is good idea, but i think not only the scp should be given them, they should also be given to :V:, so they can make FS3. however, the scp should get the source for FS3 from :V:. and i'd love topitch in for the license,
BUT  i can't give much and i want to be absoluteley sure that the money goes to the license.
just another newbie without any modding, FREDding or real programming experience

you haven't learned masochism until you've tried to read a Microsoft help file.  -- Goober5000
I've got 2 drug-addict syblings and one alcoholic whore. And I'm a ****ing sociopath --an0n
You cannot defeat Windows through strength alone. Only patience, a lot of good luck, and a sledgehammer will do the job. --StratComm

 

Offline Hudzy

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The state of Freespace address.
Just out of interest, how much would you pay for the license?

 

Offline Knight Templar

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The state of Freespace address.
It depends on how much the liscense costs.
Copyright ©1976, 2003, KT Enterprises. All rights reserved

"I don't want to get laid right now. I want to get drunk."- Mars

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Offline Razor

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Re: The state of Freespace address.
Quote
Originally posted by Unknown Target
2)There could somehow be a Freespace 3. The SCP could better it's material, and the entire community could pitch in to buy the now dirt-cheap Freespace liscence from the crumbling Interplay. That would be quite a good idea, as how much each person donated could be recoreded, and he would be repaid by sales, and mabey even extra.


Not a bad idea. Like how much could it be. I don't think it would be over 200 or 300 bucks. 400, max but I think they will never sell it. They are most probably gonna take it to their grave with them.

 

Offline an0n

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The state of Freespace address.
Make a game. Sell the game to some publisher. Buy FS rights. Trade Volition the rights in exchange for free-reign with the FS universe and access to everything they've got on FS (eg. cutscene models, concepts, unfinished ships, un-used missions and scripts etc etc).

Basically, give Volition the rights in exchange for everything from FS1 and FS2 that we've never managed to get ahold of and access to everything they cook up for FS3.
"I.....don't.....CARE!!!!!" ---- an0n
"an0n's right. He's crazy, an asshole, not to be trusted, rarely to be taken seriously, and never to be allowed near your mother. But, he's got a knack for being right. In the worst possible way he can find." ---- Yuppygoat
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The state of Freespace address.
sounds good, but making a game is a lot of work and is not going to happen. i would just like to now one thing: how much cash are we talking about? if someone could even give me an idea, like how mamny digits are we talking about? like $1000, $10.000 or $100.000 or more?
just another newbie without any modding, FREDding or real programming experience

you haven't learned masochism until you've tried to read a Microsoft help file.  -- Goober5000
I've got 2 drug-addict syblings and one alcoholic whore. And I'm a ****ing sociopath --an0n
You cannot defeat Windows through strength alone. Only patience, a lot of good luck, and a sledgehammer will do the job. --StratComm

 

Offline an0n

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The state of Freespace address.
Try to find DaveB over at VWBB: http://www.volitionwatch.com/vwbb
"I.....don't.....CARE!!!!!" ---- an0n
"an0n's right. He's crazy, an asshole, not to be trusted, rarely to be taken seriously, and never to be allowed near your mother. But, he's got a knack for being right. In the worst possible way he can find." ---- Yuppygoat
~-=~!@!~=-~ : Nodewar.com

 

Offline Stealth

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The state of Freespace address.
well first of all, you guys are forgetting something... you seem to think that as soon as volition gets the rights they'll jump in quick and make FS3...

they won't do that, no time soon anyway!  why would they do that when they've got Summoner and Redfaction that broke records and are still pulling in money.

 

Offline Knight Templar

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The state of Freespace address.
Because it's frees[pace and if they play their cards right, they'll pull in more than both together.
Copyright ©1976, 2003, KT Enterprises. All rights reserved

"I don't want to get laid right now. I want to get drunk."- Mars

Too Long, Didn't Read

 
The state of Freespace address.
what about this:

once we've got the rights, we make up somekind legal thing, that says the following:

the HLP gives the rights on freespace to volition on the following conditions:

1. volition relaeses all artwork, unpublished missions and that stuff into the community
2. volition makes FS3 within x months (where x is some kind of reasonable number)
3. voltion will realese the source of fs3 after x years from publishing the game
4. the community is being mentioned in the credits of FS3
(5.) the SCPprogrammers will help with FS3 (if they want to)

and if :V: doesn't do as we like, we can simply terminate the agreement and get the rights back to us so we can relaese FS3
just another newbie without any modding, FREDding or real programming experience

you haven't learned masochism until you've tried to read a Microsoft help file.  -- Goober5000
I've got 2 drug-addict syblings and one alcoholic whore. And I'm a ****ing sociopath --an0n
You cannot defeat Windows through strength alone. Only patience, a lot of good luck, and a sledgehammer will do the job. --StratComm

 

Offline Black Wolf

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The state of Freespace address.
This is one of the most inane threads I've read in a long time. :wtf:

First off - game rights are going to cost a lot more than a few hundred dollars, no matter how old the game is. At the very least, you'd be looking in the tens of thousands. Remember, the rights al;low someone to commercially produce a game, or film , or book or whatever, potentially making them thousands of dollars. You don't sell something like that for less than a figure relative to what the buyer will make.

Secondly, even if by some freak of nature (or extremely philanthropic communtiy member) you actually managed to obtain the rights, attempting to dictate terms to [V] about their use would probably be next to pointless. Even if [V] bought the rights themselves, they might not jump straight into a game - how high a priority would they put on it if they not only had to pay a bunch of random net users a royalty (to whom precisey this would go would be another issue to resolve), but also had to agree to a set of terms, and even let relative amateurs take on the highly sought after jobs of professional programmers?

And finally, "and if :V: doesn't do as we like, we can simply terminate the agreement and get the rights back to us so we can relaese FS3"...precisely howwere you planning to make FS3? And if you say the SCP I'll headbut you. Take a look at sparky.vp, warble.vp, etc. etc. After the SCP hgad somehow produced a new engine, we'd have to do all that and much more, as an unpaid group of amateurs.

Sorry sirs, but you're dreaming.

All that said, on the initial topic of the thread I think FS2 has at least another year or two in it, simply because it's so easy to mod, and because of the SCP. FS2, given the rate that it's being  upgraded ATM, should easily be able to hold its own with modern games very soon, plus the quality of campaigns is increasing with each passing day. You're not taking into account the interest generated by thingslike TBP, which draws dozens of B5 fans in all on its own. The only real difficulty with sustaining the comunity much beyond that is the finite limit on the number of copies of FS2 that exist - it's practically impossible to buy new these days, and even if you did buy it new, or hell, even secondhand, the community links it provides (to the VBB) are useless.

Basically, IMO, the FS2 community will survive only until people complete the current major projects, and then the vets will lose interest, the newbies will come in too slowly, the forums will slow down, and eventually cease to twitch. It's the only way out, from here on in :(. Unless some developer pulls a Half Life (Buying a copy of the Quake engiune and massively upgrading it), all we can hope for is a final, crowning fan effort, where the best of the best unite to actually produce something akin to all the 'teh bestest campaign eva!' before we all go the way of the dodo. In short, we have PS to look forward to, which means it won't be so bad :D.

Forgive me my ramblings - it's late :)
« Last Edit: January 14, 2003, 12:48:44 pm by 302 »
TWISTED INFINITIES · SECTORGAME· FRONTLINES
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Offline Fury

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The state of Freespace address.
Quote
1. volition relaeses all artwork, unpublished missions and that stuff into the community

:wtf:
Quote
2. volition makes FS3 within x months (where x is some kind of reasonable number)

:no: :lol: :no:
Quote
and if :V: doesn't do as we like, we can simply terminate the agreement and get the rights back to us so we can relaese FS3

:no: :doubt: :no:

Quote
Originally posted by Black Wolf
This is one of the most inane threads I've read in a long time. :wtf:

:yes:
« Last Edit: January 14, 2003, 12:43:09 pm by 173 »

 
The state of Freespace address.
ok,some of my idea's might be a bit, overexagurated, but i still think that :V: would be happy with free rights for a game like FS, and if you look, point 5 is between brackets, so it's optional. and i know trieing to realease the game ourselfs would be almost impossible,but we could try to sell the rights to some other company. so if :V: hears about that, they'll finally get interested.

and what's wrong aout point 1? it's a good traid, game rights in traid of some stuff laying on a shelf catching dust.

point 2 seams valid as well, cause that way we will force :V: to begin production of  FS3 with a reasonable amount of people.

and i wouldn't expect :V: to do anything for the people who buy the rights, just they'remoeny back after the game is realesed and a little free copy of FS3 if they payed over,let's say $50.

in some other thread about this most people where in favor of this plan, so i think we've got a reasonally good change of succeeding
just another newbie without any modding, FREDding or real programming experience

you haven't learned masochism until you've tried to read a Microsoft help file.  -- Goober5000
I've got 2 drug-addict syblings and one alcoholic whore. And I'm a ****ing sociopath --an0n
You cannot defeat Windows through strength alone. Only patience, a lot of good luck, and a sledgehammer will do the job. --StratComm

 

Offline Stealth

  • Braiiins...
  • 211
The state of Freespace address.
Quote
Originally posted by Black Wolf
This is one of the most inane threads I've read in a long time. :wtf:

First off - game rights are going to cost a lot more than a few hundred dollars, no matter how old the game is. At the very least, you'd be looking in the tens of thousands. Remember, the rights al;low someone to commercially produce a game, or film , or book or whatever, potentially making them thousands of dollars. You don't sell something like that for less than a figure relative to what the buyer will make.

Secondly, even if by some freak of nature (or extremely philanthropic communtiy member) you actually managed to obtain the rights, attempting to dictate terms to [V] about their use would probably be next to pointless. Even if [V] bought the rights themselves, they might not jump straight into a game - how high a priority would they put on it if they not only had to pay a bunch of random net users a royalty (to whom precisey this would go would be another issue to resolve), but also had to agree to a set of terms, and even let relative amateurs take on the highly sought after jobs of professional programmers?

And finally, "and if :V: doesn't do as we like, we can simply terminate the agreement and get the rights back to us so we can relaese FS3"...precisely howwere you planning to make FS3? And if you say the SCP I'll headbut you. Take a look at sparky.vp, warble.vp, etc. etc. After the SCP hgad somehow produced a new engine, we'd have to do all that and much more, as an unpaid group of amateurs.

Sorry sirs, but you're dreaming.

All that said, on the initial topic of the thread I think FS2 has at least another year or two in it, simply because it's so easy to mod, and because of the SCP. FS2, given the rate that it's being  upgraded ATM, should easily be able to hold its own with modern games very soon, plus the quality of campaigns is increasing with each passing day. You're not taking into account the interest generated by thingslike TBP, which draws dozens of B5 fans in all on its own. The only real difficulty with sustaining the comunity much beyond that is the finite limit on the number of copies of FS2 that exist - it's practically impossible to buy new these days, and even if you did buy it new, or hell, even secondhand, the community links it provides (to the VBB) are useless.

Basically, IMO, the FS2 community will survive only until people complete the current major projects, and then the vets will lose interest, the newbies will come in too slowly, the forums will slow down, and eventually cease to twitch. It's the only way out, from here on in :(. Unless some developer pulls a Half Life (Buying a copy of the Quake engiune and massively upgrading it), all we can hope for is a final, crowning fan effort, where the best of the best unite to actually produce something akin to all the 'teh bestest campaign eva!' before we all go the way of the dodo. In short, we have PS to look forward to, which means it won't be so bad :D.

Forgive me my ramblings - it's late :)


right ,exactly.. there's no way that we'll ever get the rights, so why even dream.

i was saying that EVEN IF VOLITION DID get the rights, they wouldn't make the game... why would they... they saw what happened with FS2!

they've got many more important projects ahead of them i'm sure!

but i don't think the game rights would be that much (i hope)... probably no more than $15,000, for a game that hardly broke even

 
The state of Freespace address.
...and who exactly is going to decided all this, who is going to do the administration for buying, selling the rights, and handling all the money.   Bad idea.  Sorry. :blah:

"Your cynicism appauls me Collosus - I have ten thousand officers and crew willing to die for pants !"

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Offline Unknown Target

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The state of Freespace address.
Ummm...boy, you guys took the last idea in my post and ran with it. This wasn't really emphasizing buying the liscence, because it would cost OBSCENE amounts of money, even for an old liscence like FS.

BTW, dictating terms to the developer? I know you're sorta new, and I can give you leeway in that respect, but I doubt that's feasible, if even the right thing to do.

EDIT: I'd happily divert most of my time to developing the next installment in the FS saga, but I'd have to see an actual USE for my time.
How about this: Interplay chugs, and we release the game over the internet, called something else. People can download and play it for 20 bucks, sorta like Combat Mission.
Just a thought, and it's about as inane as the rest in here, but, what the hell. Everyone would benefit. We could post a "secret" thing in the game, where it tells about the game's true origins and such.
Or, we could just watch this die, and lazilly sit back and watch the latest campaign come out, gradually becoming more and more tired of the same "rotate your ship and fire" gameplay.
I know that's what I'm doing right now, and I hate doing nothing while seeing something good pass away.


DOUBLE EDIT: You see that line in my siggy? The Robotech mod right now is all but dead. Because of the fact that I'm unable to texture properly, and get bored of simply re-naming models, I've even stopped working on the project. If you knew me, you'd be stunned. I've been a Robotech fan all my life, and nearly sh*tted myself when I got accepted into the team.
But I'm a future thinker. I look at this mod and think to myself:
"It won't matter, only the die-hards will even remember it, unless we get some new blood in the Freespace community. Why bother?"

I ask you, then: Why bother with all the campaigns? Why bother with this board? Why bother even posting this message? Why? Because we love to. This game is one of the greatest ever made, that's why. Because this game, this community is something totally unique. Others may claim that, but this place and the game it's based on are truly gems in a sea of rocks.
Fine, let it die if you want to. Just let the ones who want to save it, try.


TRIPLE EDIT: Just found out on the private forums: The Robotech  mod has now been declared deceased. None of the staff members (except maybe me) have enough time to do it anymore, and it's going out. If enough of the younger crowd on HLP want to take it over, PM me and I'll start a thread.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2003, 01:21:12 pm by 368 »

 

Offline aldo_14

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The state of Freespace address.
1/  the value of the Fs licence is based not on the money it could make, but also the money it could take off Titus / Interplay.  which makes it more expensive than it may seem.  It'll also be priced / valued based on the cost of developing the games and advertising them.

2/ Surely we don't need FS3, just a moddable space sim (Homeplanet seems promising IMO)? I mean, if we had FS3, most of the campaigns here would be instantly invalid.... FS2's open ending is the best thing that could have happened for modding, even if it is a shame it wasn't completed.  Beside which, any othe rmajor projects I start (unlikely as it may be) after Reci will not be set in the FS universe.

3/ Methinks we may be going over old ground here.

 

Offline Knight Templar

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The state of Freespace address.
Quote
Originally posted by kasperl
what about this:

once we've got the rights, we make up somekind legal thing, that says the following:

the HLP gives the rights on freespace to volition on the following conditions:

1. volition relaeses all artwork, unpublished missions and that stuff into the community
2. volition makes FS3 within x months (where x is some kind of reasonable number)
3. voltion will realese the source of fs3 after x years from publishing the game
4. the community is being mentioned in the credits of FS3
(5.) the SCPprogrammers will help with FS3 (if they want to)

and if :V: doesn't do as we like, we can simply terminate the agreement and get the rights back to us so we can relaese FS3
[/size]

Ooo ooo lets make them do our homework and chores too!! And on donut tuesdays, we get to pick first and come back for seconds, then they can have the crumbs!!!11

:doubt:
Copyright ©1976, 2003, KT Enterprises. All rights reserved

"I don't want to get laid right now. I want to get drunk."- Mars

Too Long, Didn't Read

 

Offline Nico

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The state of Freespace address.
Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14
Beside which, any othe rmajor projects I start (unlikely as it may be) after Reci will not be set in the FS universe.

 


same here. If I get to finish OTT, if there's something next, it won't be FSuniverse based. OTT is my vision of how he FS2 story might end, and I'd have nothing more to add to it.
SCREW CANON!