[kasperl]

ok, me and Thunder had a little chat on IRC, and here's the log, please, look it over and give comments


first, I would like to know what you add thought up already
yep? Go ahead and have a ramble - I'll bounce ideas about all night
first, I am thinking about having a PHP script generate missions for multiplayer
or at least something that can look into a (My)SQL Dbase
so for the larger jumps you press alt+j, go into some coded menu, and then the DBase gives you a new mission to play in
the hard part is to make it possible fort people to join into missions in mission
so that you don’t have to wait for the end of the "mission" until you can join a certain sector
*glances at chat*
wow, bit of a surprise to see you here, Thunder/Kalfireth
I know, I installed IRC especially for this
I was thinking about making the all thing a bit like aldo's FS tournament
you join in "matches" in certain areas, and a Dbase keeps your score
you win money by killing people
you buy guns and better ships
hmm... are we thinking *perpetual* world (that is - always online) or something that can be made, started and stopped at will?
hey, funny idea about the MMORPG thinger, although I'm not sure it'd fly well with DragonClaw:  integrate it with FleetWars
mmm
I thought of that
I think you might be able to share a large amount of code, or even a server, but the dbase should be separate
and I am more like starting/stopping at will
always-online constant would be too hard with the current engine
but if you could save it at a point - that'd be neat
unless some coder is about to tell me that you can make a multiplayer game where people can join in mission
and with the way i'm thinking, you’d save after each mission
a progressive campaign? Individual missions generated at random? Both?
more like individual missions, where you build a career
you make money by killing opponents
you start with some cash
and you pay to enter matches, and the pot goes to the winner
plus a certain amount for each kill
with a dynamic server, the tables could change every mission
so could the models
so people could make their own ships, get them to a mod, and use them in game without anyone seeing them first
sounds really promising - and certainly a good basis for something even larger down the line....one problem though, cheating? I mean I could mod the game so that my fighter had the same hull as a sathanas...
dangit, Kal, ya beat me to it
no
the models are given out by the server
the tables
for each match
it would need a major source change though
loading the table for each mission instead of when started
not sure how hard that would be
mmm, but it *could* be done
but basically, you can’t cheat, because the mod's check your ship stats, give it a price, and then the game handles it further on
works for me
you could even make a standard pricing system, like some one is making for FW
BUT
it would require a dedicated Dbase server, and a dedicated game server(s)
http://nodewar.penguinbomb.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1444
well it’s certainly got potential - that’s what really matters
this is an attempt at a price thingy for FW

[Galemp]

Why not just play Freelancer?

[kasperl]

Originally posted by GalacticEmperor
Why not just play Freelancer?

uhm, FS models are already in FS, i like the FS controlls better, i don't want to spend €50 on it, and i'm too lasy to warez FL. FS dogfights are more fun if the FL demo is any indication, i like the FS interface better.

edit:

could a coder please tell me if you can make a multiplayer mission where a player joins in half way in the mission?

[Lightspeed]

that'd be something like the in-game coop join in FS1 -- tended to screw up with FS2's multiplayer code (which we are once we implemented an IRC applet and a Database Server, i assume gonna use, since coding a new multiplayer code would take AGES).

[DragonClaw]

I'm all for it if you can get it to work, but I doubt it.

The amount of coding would be enormous(probably wrong on this, but the net code have to be totally re-written to allow connections in the middle of a match)

[kasperl]

more rambling:

  and I am more thinking of a system where you set up matches to win cash, not roam around the galaxy
  Privateer is one of THE best games ever
  It's set in the WingCommander universe
  aha
  Has free-roaming play
  Random missions
 * Kasperl sighs
  And a central story that you can follow at your discretion
  if you get bored of raping freighters
  I wish I had the time to play anything right now
  and it's the one reason I've got 98 installed:  2k and XP won't run it
  Really?
  ****
  Kick/ban the ot
  bot
 * JC_Denton sets mode: -o FS_Trivia_Bot
  y'know whats funny An0n?
  Me?
  I made the comment about my grandma being dead BEFORE I saw your post...what're the odds
  I think I might reset KTs post count
 * Kasperl thinks about setting that MMORPG thing up with a minimal coding
 * Kasperl thinks that there should be some free flying/goofing/chatting rooms
 * Kalfireth thinks there should be Bosch beer
  easy
  heck, add in raiding missions
  raid entire TC-TRI's full of the stuff
  Why not just tweak the multiplayer game to have one huge flying space in Sol and then add a simple weapons/cargo/money exchange system?
  Missions are set by other player who give you something to do in exchange for cash
  it'd take forever to get from A / B wouldn’t it?
  An0n
  You can call in a support ship and buy weapons from it
  one problem, how and when would you save?
  Use the Stats system
  erm
  yeah, well
  I think that would be too heavy for server loads
  12 player max in game remember?
  You want a MMORPG with low server loads?
  Hahahaha
  and a toilet off solid gold.
  well, FS2 just ain't made for it
  but if things were broken down
  so you should try and limit the Massive part
  and make a lot of players play in a lot of places
  where everyone will eventuallty find each other
  ..
  getting from point a to point b:  you'd need a navigation screen to pick locations in systems to jump to, and an intersystem drive to jump through a node to another system.  but effectively, you could make an intrasystem jump to anywhere from anywhere
  but not all at the same time at the same place
  You do realise that a server load is regardless of how big, or small, or numerous your areas of play are, right?
  not if you make on DB server, on lobby
  and multiple game servers
  I was thinking on a grander scale than a 65-km field of battle
  yeah well, that's nice and pretty, but the FS engine isn’t made for more then 12 players in a mplayer game
  ...
  I am not saying that it is impossible, but it will be damn hard
  and why do things the hard way, when you can just go around it?
  *sigh* never mind I said anything
 * An0n ignores JC
  Hmmmm
  well, if you want grander battles, play games of chess
  You know
  have players meet each other, each with a fleet set up with key/commo commands
  You need a gravity-well for subspace jumps
  So why not have each 'game' centered in the 65km around a planet
  Then you jump to other planets go to another 'game'.
  good idea
  idea
  but
  in system jumps are unlimited
  the entire system is good
  What?
  and you can’t jump anywhere too close to a planet
  at least if I remember the FS REF BIBLE correctly
  No, you do what Privateer does and jump to a nav-point near the planet
  similar to IW2?
  Yeah, kinda
  Only without seeing the travel
 * Kasperl goes for tea
  sounds like it'd work...
  Use some kinda cut scene for jumps
  brb
  Hmm. , you could do away with after-burners and use the Tab button for in-system jumps
  But
  I don’t see people liking that...
  Have it so it goes to a REALLY high-speed after-burn, then cuts to the cut scene as you approach the 65km limit
  it'd have to be stupid fast - I'm not sure how FS2 copes with that
  And we could use the 'in-node' code stuff to have it so depending on which nav-point you were near, you'd go to a different part of the system
  Well, it could flip all your normals to make you invisible and make a subspace-tunnel thing around you
  I do like that - nav points and jump nodes would be a lot more useful if they pointed somewhere specific
 * JC_Denton is now known as JC|astronomy
 * Kasperl is back
  coursework beckons.  bbl
  bye JC
  so you are talking about a large playing area, where we have 12+ people in one area at a time?
  bye
  Fairly
  we're talking about multiple areas and getting between them - aren’t we?
  It'd be like.......that convoy mission in FS1 where you start at the Arcadia
  And having about 20 such spaces
  All based in a single system
  but
  how do you plan on generating the mission files?
  You wouldn't
  how long will one mission last, how hare they set up
  Just have people giving each other missions
  how would one check to see if it’s completed?
  They wouldn't
  how would the AI behave without goals?
  That's the fun
  They wouldn't
  All AI would be doing is providing background traffic
  People would run their own convoys, make their own deals, attack other player
  ok
  s
  one problem
  could have spontaneous encounters....shivans, HOL and such
  Yeah, Shivans would just be popping up all over
  it's all fine and fun, if you have enough players
  Yes, and with FS2 being free now via HOTU and the game being free to play online, loads of people would join
  the moment anything below 20 people are in game, everything pretty much freezes
  right
  are you paying for publicity?
  If there aren't enough people, you just use fewer areas
  mmm
 * Kasperl still doesn't like it
  it sounds too heavy
  for servers
  how large would one play area be?
  and how much players would there be?
  You could give the SW goons GTVA ships and dump civilian craft on everyone else
  and how long would one "mission" last
  One area would be 65km
  mmm
  65*65*65?
  ok
  You'd just leave the 'missions' running
  won’t work
  I think, at least I have a feeling, that FS2 won’t run for more then one hour at once
  then the game pretty much needs to end the mission, just to clear all the data
  it may, but it's not built for it right now
  You could just have it dump all the data into Stats after every hour
  and have a lag fest in the middle of a dogfight?
  no thank
  .....
  No, foo
  Kills and **** would be fed into the server as they happen
  Then every hour the server would store all that and start anew with the score-counting
  mm
 * Kasperl thinks that's too heavy
  you would need to run the game and Dbase on one machine
  ......Yes
  Have all the 'games' for a single system running on the same server
  and if you jump to another system, you would have to wait to fill the hour until you have your money back?
 * Kasperl doesn't like it
  .......No
  If you quit, it uploads all your current stats
  Err
  Submits
  All you current stats
  mmm
  but when would the other server receive those?
  check every second?
  too heavy
  ....
  No
  where the hell is the log function in mIRC
  It would all be linked to a single database
  ./log on
  yes
  thnx
  but then
  if you link it all to one dbase, and you go from one system to another, the game server of the first system uploads the data to the dBase, but then when would the server of the second system download that data?
  sorry for typos
  It wouldn't need to
  It could just get it whenever you checked your bank balance or whatever'
  if you link it all to one dbase, and you go from one system to another, the game server of the first system uploads the data to the dBase, but then when would the server of the second system download that data?
  mmm
  what about your ship stats?
  It'd get them when you joined
  mmm
  could perhaps work
  'but I am still rather concerned with server loads
  If you're running a MMORPG, server loads are always going to be big
  But by having each system on a separate server, and optimising the number of commands and queries it has to perform, it'd be fine
  where would the servers come from?
  People willing to host
  For large amounts of in-game cash and control of an Orion
  yeah
  Or even an arcadia
  but how many 24/7 servers would you get?
  Basically, they'd be God in their little system
  An0n, could you DCC me the log of the chat before I started logging it?
  Well you'd start out with 1 and as you got more and more players, by the time you needed a new system, there'd be so many players you'd be bound to have another player willing to host
  Grrr
  mm, ok
 * Kasperl starts seeing chances

[kasperl]

*bumpage*

please, coders, tell us that this ain't possible, and we'll shut up.

first thing is in mission joining, the second is running a mision 24/7.