[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Kazan
Give me an instance of when java is the right tool and I'll give you a better tool

Any multi-machine / multi-Os programme.  I.e. anywhere where you need cross-platform compatibility with minimal cost.

For example, mobile agents.  Also mobile phones software (i.e. anything where you have components that need to be assembly language-independent and flexible) and other dedicated apps.  

Also certain business and database applications which may need to be migrated across OS's (i.e. http://www.gtnet.com/).

and Kaz - i've heard a lot smarter people than you talking about the uses for Java and the benefits (as well as the problems), so I'm hardly going to take your word for it.

[Kazan]

aldo_14:

Corss platform: C++ using wxWindows

java's supposedly cross platformness is BS -- look a little closer

mikhael is correct about JVM's in hardware

And thanks for the insult asshole - i've only been programming for ten years now.

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Kazan
aldo_14:

Corss platform: C++ using wxWindows

java's supposedly cross platformness is BS -- look a little closer

mikhael is correct about JVM's in hardware

And thanks for the insult asshole - i've only been programming for ten years now.

Insult?  All I stated was that there are people i have talked to or heard from who have better knowledge of you, who have talked about why they use Java for professional applications.  i.e. people who have been programming for longer than 10 years, and who either work academically (i.e. lecturers) or professionally
with java.  In the latter case, who have specifically chosen Java as a business and technological decision over other languages.

And i'm not sure what you're length of experience has to do with my point, regardless.  and frankly, you need to deflate your ego a bit.  Apparently you take a statement that you don't know everything, ever, as an insult and feel obliged to retort in a childish manner which only makes you look like a petty 5 year old.

  Frankly, I'm not sure what you hope to establish by calling me an asshole, other than lowering my opinion of you.

And explain why java is not cross platform?  Unless you're referring to the JVM, in which case NO language can be platform independent (as there is no way to totally disassociate from the base architecture).

[Kazan]

automatically assuming someone knows more than me because they agree with you is an insult -- I have ten years programming expirience and to off handedly dismiss my opinion because people whom agree with you like java have expirience doesn't make them smarter than me

Furthermore I know the man that used to head up the entire developement team for the Mac Newton - he taught me most of what I know -- and he's like mikhael when it comes to java ("It's cool", "It has it's uses" -- DONT try to take it beyond them)

I know a lot of lecturer's that are retards and that I can teach them things about comp sci -- just being a lecturer doesn't make you smart.

There have been a lot of companies that chose java as a business tech -m ost of them die or change their language/focus.


Java's not fully cross platform because it's behavior is not wholly consistant across said platforms.

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Kazan
automatically assuming someone knows more than me because they agree with you is an insult -- I have ten years programming expirience and to off handedly dismiss my opinion because people whom agree with you like java have expirience doesn't make them smarter than me

Furthermore I know the man that used to head up the entire developement team for the Mac Newton - he taught me most of what I know -- and he's like mikhael when it comes to java ("It's cool", "It has it's uses" -- DONT try to take it beyond them)

I know a lot of lecturer's that are retards and that I can teach them things about comp sci -- just being a lecturer doesn't make you smart.

There have been a lot of companies that chose java as a business tech -m ost of them die or change their language/focus.


Java's not fully cross platform because it's behavior is not wholly consistant across said platforms.

i'm astounded at your naivety and arrogance.  

Do you honestly think i judge the intelligence of people on whether or not I agree with them?  Did you possibly anticipate that I might have formed my opinions by listening to people whose opinions and intelligence i respect?

And i notice you throw out yet another random insult at people for no purpose.  you may think some lecturers are retards, but I can ssure you that all the ones I've had contact with at Stratchclyde (except Sotiros - he's a bit of a dick) know what they're talking about.

Not to mention i never proposed Java as a universal answer.  I know it isn't.  but I don't dismiss it out of hand the way you just did - possibly because I have a self interest, but also because i understand that every language has it's uses and can't just be discounted.

(NB:  I can only respond that in my experience I have not experienced an cross-platform behaviour changes.  Without further details, I can't tell if you're referring to the bytecode or the JVM - the latter is more understandable than the former for obvious reasons.)

And stop taking everything as an insult.  Please.  It's embarassing - i can take someone disagreeing with me and repsect their opinions.  

Frankly, my estimation of you goes down with every sneering, self rightous post you make.

[Kazan]

the actual language's behavior changes between platforms in subtle ways that can break complex programs

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Kazan
the actual language's behavior changes between platforms in subtle ways that can break complex programs

Such as?

I need examples or reference here so i can look at this - I don't have the time or means to either test programs on multiformat (well, not today at least) or search for the info.

[Kazan]

i don't write in java, i don't care about java - do you think i bother to remember the subtle ways in which it breaks across platforms.  If you really want to know i suppose i could ask dr Leavens (yes, THAT Dr Leavens.. JML)

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Kazan
i don't write in java, i don't care about java - do you think i bother to remember the subtle ways in which it breaks across platforms.  If you really want to know i suppose i could ask dr Leavens (yes, THAT Dr Leavens.. JML)

I'd be interested, of course.

  At the moment Java is my sole language (and will be for the forseeable future, until i can find the time to learn an alternate), so I'd be interested in any behavioural quirks that might affect my future work.

[Kazan]

i highly recommend learning C/C++

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Kazan
i highly recommend learning C/C++

I fully intend to.  the problem is that i'm working fulltime of a final year project, and I have to find a job after that - which entails using Java.  

So finding the time to learn / migrate to C++ is somewhat difficult... at present my plan is to work in Java over the next few years whilst learning C++ and various graphics APIs.