Author Topic: what the hell, Iraqi Sovereignty thing moved to today!  (Read 3418 times)

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Offline Flipside

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
I'm glad it's back in the hand of Iraqis, but, there was a wonderful cartoon this morning in the Daily Mail, of the Iraqi President holding this enormous fizzing bomb while George and Tony wander off saying 'All yours now! Good Luck!'

I think that is the concern of most people on here ;)

 
US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Then how come we finally give them what the people have been *****ING ABOUT THE FOR THE LAST FEW MONTHS and now everyone is concerned again? WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?!

 

Offline Flipside

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
The people have been *****ing about being able to go shopping without the fear of being either blown up or arrested. That hasn't changed and won't for a long while :(

 
US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
They have just been wanting us to leave Iraq alone, and now that we are leaving it up to them people dont want us to... :rolleyes:

 

Offline ionia23

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
As stated before, some people will never be satisfied as long as anything American continues to exist.
"Why does it want me to say my name?"

  

Offline Flipside

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
.... where they aren't invited.

I've supported America when I have felt it has deserved defending on this forum, but right now, I have serious reservations regarding the 'sovereignty' of Iraq. I have serious reservations about 5 US bases being built there. I have serious reservations about American advisors in almost every department.

It's a change in words, but until I see actions, I will continue to have those reservations.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2004, 03:46:12 pm by 394 »

 

Offline ionia23

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
None of that "where they aren't invited" crud. Call a spade a spade.  America exists, that's all the reason people need to hate it, and it's denizens.
"Why does it want me to say my name?"

 

Offline Flipside

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
One word.

Bollocks.

 

Offline ionia23

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
One word.

Bollocks.


One word: Fact.  Things are much easier to deal with when they aren't sugar-coated.
"Why does it want me to say my name?"

 

Offline Flipside

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Ok, Ok, I'm down to 3 word posts, need to relax ;) Let's tale it from your perspective...

Why do think in your opinion, that Europe and the rest of the world is turning Anti American?

 
US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Iraq may have it sovereignty, but does that mean we are done fighting the war on terror? ;7

 

Offline Ghostavo

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Who's next? Syria? Korea?
"Closing the Box" - a campaign in the making :nervous:

Shrike is a dirty dirty admin, he's the destroyer of souls... oh god, let it be glue...

 

Offline ionia23

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
Ok, Ok, I'm down to 3 word posts, need to relax ;) Let's tale it from your perspective...

Why do think in your opinion, that Europe and the rest of the world is turning Anti American?


I suppose it depends on who you ask.  For myself, that's easy:

1. Really crappy foreign policy
2. Half-assed approached to "please help us"
3. Electing moronic figureheads such as the current sitting President
4. Jealousy
5. Arrogance

Maybe i can sum up:

The Dixie Chicks once stated that they were ashamed President Bush comes from Texas.  I'm ashamed that this was the best 100+ million voters could come up with. 'nuff said.

My sister and her husband took a 2 week trip to Germany last year.  He speaks fluent German, she's in school learning it but can get by pretty well.  Her goal was to try to speak exclusive German the whole time she was there.  Apparently she did quite well and people were VERY responisive to her just for making the effort.

She has a story about when she, her husband, and a few friends flew over to Venice during the trip.  She took a crack at trying to order her meal in Italian.  All of the sudden she hears:

"HAY!  Y'ALL FRUM AMERIKA???"  "WELL, HOT DOG!  Y'ALL DUN BE AMERIKANS!!!"  blah blah blah.

The group turns around to see a whole group of tourists from Texas.  She said she'd never been so embarassed in her life.  Luckily, they were able to convince the Texans that they didn't speak any English at all.

"AH THOUGHT YEW FOREIGNERS HAD TUH SPAKE SUM ANGLISH".

Foreigners?  FOREIGNERS?  You're the foreigner here, numb nuts.

There's just so many of us who set really ****ty examples for what Americans act like and think.  Sometimes I'm one of them.  It feels like anything good this nation ever accomplishes is annihilated by a whole bunch of very f-ed up decisions made.

I remember in the wake of the brewing recent Iraq war when there was this retarded anti-French thing going on.  You'll remember "freedom fries".  Some a**hole at a coffeeshop here was going off about it, all the way up to suggestion that the bodies of American soldiers killed in WWII and currently buried in France be exhumed and sent back to the US.  I couldn't resist...

Me:"Great ideas there, bub.Hey, while you're at it, how about mailing back the Statue Of Liberty?"

Him:"Why?"

Me: "They gave it to us, dumbs***".

Shut him up good, it did.
"Why does it want me to say my name?"

 

Offline ionia23

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Quote
Originally posted by .::Tin Can::.
Iraq may have it sovereignty, but does that mean we are done fighting the war on terror? ;7


The war on terror is never won, and it cannot be won by military firepower alone.
"Why does it want me to say my name?"

 

Offline ionia23

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Quote
Originally posted by Ghostavo
Who's next? Syria? Korea?


Hopefully neither.  I'd rather see us get a number of other UN nations to give President Karzi (sp?) of Afghanistan the troops he's so desperately asking for.
"Why does it want me to say my name?"

 
US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Quote
Originally posted by ionia23


She has a story about when she, her husband, and a few friends flew over to Venice during the trip.  She took a crack at trying to order her meal in Italian.  All of the sudden she hears:

"HAY!  Y'ALL FRUM AMERIKA???"  "WELL, HOT DOG!  Y'ALL DUN BE AMERIKANS!!!"  blah blah blah.

The group turns around to see a whole group of tourists from Texas.  She said she'd never been so embarassed in her life.  Luckily, they were able to convince the Texans that they didn't speak any English at all.

"AH THOUGHT YEW FOREIGNERS HAD TUH SPAKE SUM ANGLISH".

Foreigners?  FOREIGNERS?  You're the foreigner here, numb nuts.


THAT, is an INSULT to us Texans. That is not how we talk, and that is certainly now how we behave. We have rednecks, but not where I live. That kind of idiotic behavior should not be used as the standard for which we are all represented. :mad:

 

Offline Flipside

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
LOL Ionia...I'll agree, that wouldn't help ;)

Though, the image of Americans has always been of loud overweight Texans carrying cameras, no offence to any Texans here, that is just how they are typically portrayed in Europe. Like most British football supporters are often portrayed as skinhead hooligans, I don't really mind that, most people I have encountered judge on a one to one basis, it's only when you get mobs things get sticky :(

I think there is genuine fear and concern in the world for a conflict which is escalating, not diminishing, Muslims are Fighting christians in Africa, people throughout Europe and America are living each day half expecting to hear the Bio-Warning sirens go off. We want it to stop, all of us, America, Europe, Israel, Palestine, the only people who don't want it to stop are the Terrorists, because they are calling the shots while this goes on.
But, as you said in your second post, Firepower alone won't do it.

Also, there is a 'trend' among certain English (I don't know about European) teenagers to vocally dislike America (Whilst wearing Nike trainers and drinking Coke I might add). But that is hormones more than hatred, give them 5 years and they will swear they were above that sort of thing.

As Blair, in one of his accurate moments put it 'To deny there are rifts would be foolish'. but I don't think most of the world truly hates America, we are concerned, about what has happened and about what will happen in the future. America really does hold 4 billion lives in it's hands at the moment, just be careful with 'em, this is the kind of War where one move to save a hundred lives might cost 10000. :(

To be honest to you, you are a victim of media in that respect, it's not so much that you have had bad press, as that you have had press at all. Even World War II was mostly limited to B&W stills, but nowadays the Marines are practically tripping over the cameramen, something which I find revolting in a way. Bit it did open up peoples eyes to what War is, and most people were squeamiish. But you haven't made war any differently to any other country.

I won't agree with you that you are hated. I don't think you should have gone into Iraq in the manner that you did, and I think it was unfortunate that your government was either fed false information or gave false information regarding WMD's. But of all countries, of all people, Americans have the greatest responsiblility to be aware and tolerant of the outside world and the differences in it, because they have the most influence over it, and that, as you say, is where a large majority of the public fall down :(

 
US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Do you realize how humanity would unite if we discovered aliens? :wtf:

 

Offline Ghostavo

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Not exactly, it could have the opposite effect of that you are trying to think of... it could drive us further apart with another topic on which to talk about.

Of course I'm pessimist :nervous:
"Closing the Box" - a campaign in the making :nervous:

Shrike is a dirty dirty admin, he's the destroyer of souls... oh god, let it be glue...

 

Offline Rictor

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US hands over sovereignty in Iraq 2 days early (Iraq is now a sovereign nation, etc.)
Quote
Originally posted by .::Tin Can::.
They have just been wanting us to leave Iraq alone, and now that we are leaving it up to them people dont want us to... :rolleyes:


You do understand that what the Iraqi people have been *****ing for is not limited to sovereignty, but US troops getting the hell out of their country. They seem to think they are up to the challenge, or seem to be willing to take the risk that they're not, so why does everyone go on how "we've given the Iraqis what they want". No, this is not what they want, they want all US troops out, including their bases, down to the last man. I don't see how anyone can at this point hold on to the notion that the US military is wanted in Iraq.