[Ghostavo]

I was cruising around Gamespot's Gamespotting and this caught my eye.

"FreeSpace 2 was the last great space sim, and it was fantastic." Oh Yeah... "Of course, it required a joystick." WHAT? Since when?

If you read since the beginning, you will see they, as many people, are worried about future of the games' industry in 2005. They say no good game is being announced to come out in the next years. I still don't understand why hasn't the Space Sim Genre got new "great" titles since... well... to be honest... '98! They also mention two games that have been mentioned here in the forums, StarShatter and Galactic Federation. Yet they don't ask about why no developer is making a Space Sim... isn't that a contradiction? As I'm writting this post I have no idea why I have done so...

help?

[ShadowFox]

Independance War 2 was good.. but nothing has come close to FS2 and the genre is just about dead.

[neo_hermes]

Space sim's bit the dust way too soon...

[Singh]

Originally posted by neo_hermes
Space sim's bit the dust way too soon...

That's why we're bringing out the cloth duster here

[Cabbie]

Yeah I kinda got into spacesims (okay actually just freespace 1 and 2) late into the game so I'm really curious what were the factors that lead to the deline of the genre.

I usually hear people say its the vicious cycle of lack of marketing thus low sales which results in lack of development. Other's say that  it's the nature of the game itself which takes time to get into. etc.

Is there any article anyone knows out there that explains it?

[ShadowWolf_IH]

i think of it has to do with multiplayability.  lag shooting is a ***** in space.  Look at M$, they delved into mechwarrior and took a great series and trashed it, then freelancer, which is a good game, but not a great game.  Star wars is star wars, and we were all riding high on the legend of star wars when we started playing these games, but the newer movies are lacking in the magic, and i think that is carrying over into the entire genre.  The two big names are faltering, those being star wars and wing commander.  Even then think about M$ venture before freelancer....starlancer.  To be honest i found it to be a second rate rip off of fs1.  It came out same time as fs2 iirc, and let's face it, fs2 smokes it.  So what are your choices.....choose a sucky game from a company you know, or take a chance with a company you don't know?  Not many people are willing to take a chance with 50 bucks.  The only reason i own starlancer is that i bought it used for $1.99, at that price it's not so bad, but would i ever pay as much for it as i would for fs1?  not in a million years.  

The genre of the space combat sim is dying, We need a good game with a good advertising campaign.  Freespace never got the billing it deserved.  If it had, we might be playing fs3, instead of having our guys make it for us.   Wait a minute...i like the fact that they are doing what we want them to do.

I think that in the end a number of factors can be counted as reasons for the decline of the space sim, not least of all is what i call the Post Millenial Freefall.  Think about it, the year 2000 was always an invisible barrier between science fiction and science fact.  We could always look to that barrier as the future, and dream of that future.  We are now on this side of it, and nothing has changed.  We were supposed to cross into sci fi, and we haven't.  Space sim fans in today's world are probably the closest to "The Lost Generation" that there has been.  We have no war to fight, save that war that we create ourselves.

[Liberator]

Originally posted by ShadowWolf_IH
Space sim fans in today's world are probably the closest to "The Lost Generation" that there has been.  We have no war to fight, save that war that we create ourselves.

*weeps*

[Brando]

Originally posted by Cabbie
Yeah I kinda got into spacesims (okay actually just freespace 1 and 2) late into the game so I'm really curious what were the factors that lead to the deline of the genre.

BLAME CANADA!

Er... Interplay. I'm glad they were piledriven into the ground. GG NUBS KTHX DIE! Crappy games.

They released the first game ever to require up to 1GB of HDD space to play... I believe it was, Starsiege? Or Shattered Star? Something of the like... way back in the day...

[Ace]

StarSiege is from Sierra and takes only 300mb

FreeSpace 1 (FS1 I believe can get up to 800mb or so) and 2 (that gets into the GBs) take quite a big chunk, same with Baldur's Gate and BG2.

[castor]

Originally posted by ShadowWolf_IH
Star wars is star wars, and we were all riding high on the legend of star wars when we started playing these games, but the newer movies are lacking in the magic, and i think that is carrying over into the entire genre.

Well said.

Theres nothing left to ignite the imagination of the "masses" anymore. And imagination is something one needs to immerse in games like space sims, in order not to dismiss them as boring, far-fetched etc.
Somehow this progress has been ongoing since 80's, the more realistic the games have become, the less willing (capable?) have people become to excercise their imagination as part of the gaming experience.
There is no passion nor fascination, only instant satisfaction - point-blank.

I'm afraid the genre will continue on it's downslope till consumer-level VR-tech products hit the market.

[Gloriano]

Originally posted by ShadowWolf_IH
haven't.  Space sim fans in today's world are probably the closest to "The Lost Generation" that there has been.  We have no war to fight, save that war that we create ourselves.

Agreed, it's realy sad that Space sim genre almost died
but there is still hope for space sim

[vyper]

Didn't someone post a link the other day to a new sim?

[Turnsky]

Space sims--FreeSpace 2 was the last great space sim, and it was fantastic

that it was, i have yet to see anything that came close to freespace's massive scale of things..

Starlancer looked purdy, but lacked a sense of scale
freelancer was the same, both had lackluster stories..

has anybody shown the lads up at Volition what the SCP has been up to as of late?

[aldo_14]

of course, this all might change when the next Elite (is it 3 or 4?) is completed.  I wouldn't hold your breath for that one, though...... methinks the release target is late 2005 or 2006

[neo_hermes]

@ vyper *cough* looks at the Galactic Federation thread... *cough*

edit: oops was talkin to vyper

[Zarax]

About the fact that we aren't close to sci-fi there should be much to be said...
Note that your blamed MS is currently researching with success stuff like advanced machine interaction (with a cam or even better, stereo cams and a microphone the computer will learn from human voice, gestures and so on and act properly... Someone remembers Star Trek i'm sure), "light" human/machine integration (not chips underskin but rather using the skin itself as a power and communication bus, patented a couple of weeks ago) and so on...
Basically those who survived the New Economy bubble are developing to commercial feasibility most of the prototype stuff shown in the late 90's... And if the various space agencies will finally collaborate maybe mars won't be so far...
Going over more experimental stuff scientists have been able to send subatomic particles faster than lightspeed...
Now, maybe with some time and the rising cost of oil (all hail GWB for that...) cold fusion will be an interesting topic again...
Finally, things doesm't appear suddenly so we get used to them... But 20 years ago things like the actual knowledge level about DNA (not to mention the staminal cells not sure about how it's written in english) was more akin to SCI-FI than reality...
Hell, in 2001 Space Odissey Kubrick showed the video phones as big as a TV, now you have them as portable devices inside your cell phones...

Getting back on topic, the gaming industry is getting concentrated in few hands, and really conservative ones... Like in holliwood games are getting incredibly expensive to develop and they have less economic potential (in most cases) than movies...
Personally i'm watching very closely Strategy First, if they screw up Jagged Alliance i'll gut them alive...
About Starlancer, it was more of an unofficial Wing Commander than something akin FS... Look at the creators and you'll get the names...

[Turnsky]

Originally posted by Zarax
About Starlancer, it was more of an unofficial Wing Commander than something akin FS... Look at the creators and you'll get the names...

yeah, i know, the roberts guys..

the fact being, that there hasn't /been/ anything close to freespace ever since it was made..

[Zarax]

You're right Turnsky, that's why i think someone should dump the idiotics consoles... They are ruining the PC environment...

[Turnsky]

Originally posted by Zarax
You're right Turnsky, that's why i think someone should dump the idiotics consoles... They are ruining the PC environment...

don't be too harsh on consoles, they can be quite good depending on the game..
the problem being is the developers/producers for such things, and the target demographic.. pre-teens and teenagers for the most part.   and the dumbing down of complex games to suit that demographic.. and most of these people have ADD and a shorter attention span than that of a gnat

and when they're converted to PC, the results can vary...
a dual development schedule between a PC and a console is usually a very good idea, KOTOR is testiment to that.

another prime example of the problems with Console->PC conversions, is Halo... it's good on Console, but it has astronomical requirements on PC.

personally i think Space sims will make a comeback, since we're receiving a glut of FPS's on the market.. good or bad.

we only need a space sim to define the genre once again, then it may revive it all over again..

that said, i want more complex, in-depth games, with a kickass story, dammit!

[Gloriano]

that said, i want more complex, in-depth games, with a kickass story, dammit!

I'am waiting that too.

don't be too harsh on consoles, they can be quite good depending on the game

There is some awesome games in console like Ninja Gaiden etc.