[Janos]

bbbut i dont want to refgister

[aldo_14]

Whoops.

EDIT2; sod it; the bb code ****s up the cached copy link

New, improved and more lethal: son of napalm
By Ben Cubby


The Pentagon no longer officially uses the brand-name 'Napalm', but a similar sticky, inflammable substance known as 'fuel-gel mixture', contained in weapons called Mark-77 fire bombs, was dropped on Iraqi troops near the Iraq-Kuwait border at the start of the war.

"I can confirm that Mark-77 fire bombs were used in that general area," Colonel Mike Daily of the US Marine Corps said.

Colonel Daily said that US stocks of Vietnam-era napalm had been phased out, but that the fuel-gel mixture in the Mark-77s had "similar destructive characteristics."

"Many folks (out of habit) refer to the Mark-77 as 'napalm' because its effect upon the target is remarkably similar," he said.

On March 22nd, correspondent Lindsay Murdoch, who was travelling with the US Marines, had reported that napalm was used in an attack on Iraqi troops at Safwan Hill, near the Kuwait border. Murdoch's account was based on statements by two US Marine Corps officers on the ground.

Lieutenant-Commander Jeff A. Davis, USN, Office of the Assistant Secretary for Defense (Public Affairs) had called Murdoch's story "patently false".

"The US took napalm out of service in the 1970's. We completed the destruction of our last batch of napalm on April 4, 2001, and no longer maintain any stocks of napalm," Commander Davis told smh online. He was apparently referring to Vietnam-era Napalm-B, which consisted of inflammable fuel thickened with polystyrene and benzene.

The inflammable fuel in Mark-77 fire bombs is thickened with slightly different chemicals, and is believed to contain oxidizers, which make it harder to extinguish than Napalm-B.

Neither weapon technically contains napalm. The chemical mixture that became known as 'napalm' - a combination of naphthalene and palmitate - was used only in the earliest versions of the weapon.

Napalm was banned by United Nations convention in 1980, but the US never signed the agreement. Use of Mark-77 fire bombs is considered legal by the US military.

Ms. Toni McNeal, a spokesperson for Rock Island Arsenal, in Illinois, said the facility is currently producing a further 500 Mark-77s for the US Marine Corps.

She said she did not consider the Mark-77s to be napalm bombs.

But Mark-77s are referred to as 'napalm' in some current US inventories and public affairs documents.

A US Navy public affairs document dated 22/10/99 says that the US Navy no longer uses napalm but "the US Marine Corps has a requirement and uses it at ranges at Yuma and Twenty-Nine Palms."

Twenty-Nine Palms, in California, is the home base of some of the Marine Corps units that took part in the attack on Safwan Hill in Iraq.

Captain Robert Crum, USMC, Public Affairs spokesman for Twenty-Nine Palms, said: "Mk 77s are not routinely used in training at 29 Palms. Yet it would be inappropriate to say that they are never - or never would be - used in training here.

"The average young Marine may be unfamiliar with the technical nomenclature, and probably does refer to this munition by the vernacular 'napalm'."

[Janos]

Napalm was banned by United Nations convention in 1980, but the US never signed the agreement. Use of Mark-77 fire bombs is considered legal by the US military.

whoa. I am been trained to use illegal ammo. YAY

[Liberator]

[Flipside]

Mark 77s?

They're using Mk77 bombs in a city??

[Liberator]

from that article, it sounds like they used a few at the beginning of the war to break Saddam's Army so that they would give up instead of fight, which is what it's supposed to.

[Flipside]

Well, I don't doubt they would work, but the margin for error must be tiny, those things cover quite an area with extremely nasty stuff, even jumping into water won't stop the burning.

[Unknown Target]

So are the British making a **** fit about this?

[Flipside]

The British papers are more interested in David Blunkett giving his ex-girlfriend a free Rail pass.....

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Flipside
Mark 77s?

They're using Mk77 bombs in a city??

In that article, on bridges.  But any use of 'napalm' in Baghdad & Fallujah would most likely also be said bombs.

I don't think embedded journalists are being allowed much access to Fallujah, so it'll be hard to find an 'independent' report on it. I guess  Napalm can be consider acceptable in a attack on (for example) bedded-in troops (albeit any other country would consider it illegal), but not if it's being used in a city.

[Flipside]

Come to think of it, they were also accused of using those anti-runway Mk88(?)'s on areas of Baghdad. They drop mini landmines to stop the runway being repaired. Though, considering no-one has managed to accidentally tread on one since the troops moved in (or at least, it hasn't been reported), I wonder.....

[an0n]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this brings the US actions to:

An unprovoked war against a member of the United Nations, using banned weaponry.

[aldo_14]

Ah, but it's ok because the US didn't sign the ban & don't recognise international law anyways.  Or the Geneva convention for POWs.

[Flipside]

Well, banned is a funny word, it's not banned by America, therefore, whilst they are breaking everyone elses rules, they are, in fact, perfectly within their own.

I mean, let's face it, do you really think the UN is going to get off it's arse and do anything soon?

[aldo_14]

And break the habit of a lifetime?

[an0n]

Originally posted by Flipside
Well, banned is a funny word, it's not banned by America, therefore, whilst they are breaking everyone elses rules, they are, in fact, perfectly within their own.

I mean, let's face it, do you really think the UN is going to get off it's arse and do anything soon?

It's on Iraqi soil, and I'm assuming Iraq signed the treaty.

[kasperl]

The old government did, an0n, not the new........

At least, that's what the US'll say. You do know the US is still using mines?

[Flipside]

They did indeed, the thing is, because America didn't, this whole thing will wrangle it's way through the UN for months, in fact, probably just long enough for it to no longer be neccesary for them to reach a decision.....

[pyro-manic]

The yanks seem to think they can do whatever they want. Problem is, until someone proves otherwise and does something about them, it's true.

[Flipside]

They can.......

We can complain and whinge and throw bits of paper at them till we are blue in the face.

It's not the fact they can do what they like that scares me, so much, so could the Greeks, the Romans etc, it's what they are choosing to do with that ability that scares me.