Author Topic: How Retarded Are American Teens?  (Read 17634 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Black Wolf

  • Twisted Infinities
  • 212
  • Hey! You! Get off-a my cloud!
    • Visit the TI homepage!
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
http://www.creationevidence.org/scientific_evid/evidencefor/evidencefor.html


These are laughable - I can personally answer 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 9 and 10 (which is nothing more than a paragraph on the complexity of the human mind) off the top of my head without any reference material whatsoever, 5 I've never heard of before, but is a young earth argument rather than an anti evolution argument which I'm sure a bit of research could explain. Number 8 isn't my field, and TBH I don't entirely understand what they're saying, but overall the list is very, very weak.
TWISTED INFINITIES · SECTORGAME· FRONTLINES
Rarely Updated P3D.
Burn the heretic who killed F2S! Burn him, burn him!!- GalEmp

 

Offline Styxx

  • 211
    • Hard Light Productions
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Krackers - attack the argument, not the person. Don't do that again.
Probably away. Contact through email.

 
How Retarded Are American Teens?
God smites you all with his mad pwnage skills...

Oops! Did I say the "G" word?

The ACLU will come for us at dawn...

 

Offline Thrilla

  • 27
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Gee all you people seem to say is: "Bull****!!!, BS!! And you a ****ed up bastard for not accepting this stuff that some scientists say is true! You are an idiotic moron who doesnt know where his ass is because you lack brain cells!!"

You people take this way way too seriously. I dont have a problem with accepting evolution as a theory, because like it or not, it is a theory because it cannot be proven because there is not enough evidence to prove it the way you speak of it. And no, i wasnt talking of teaching creationism in schools, because different religions have different beliefs and it just would raise controversy. What i think would be appropriate would be to point out that evolution is a theory and not teach it as you would laws of thermodynamics.
94th Combat Support Hospital, 807th Medical Brigade

 
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Good to see someone still understands that this topic was turning to the dark side...

 

Offline Gloriano

  • silver dracon
  • 210
  • Oh
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Quote
Originally posted by .::Tin Can::.
God smites you all with his mad pwnage skills...
 



I didn't know that Styxx was god.:eek2: news for me atleast





:lol: :p
You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.- Nietzsche

When in despair I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won; there have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time they can seem invincible, but in the end they always fall.- Mahatma Gandhi

  

Offline Janos

  • A *really* weird sheep
  • 28
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Quote
Originally posted by Thrilla
Gee all you people seem to say is: "Bull****!!!, BS!! And you a ****ed up bastard for not accepting this stuff that some scientists say is true! You are an idiotic moron who doesnt know where his ass is because you lack brain cells!!"

You people take this way way too seriously. I dont have a problem with accepting evolution as a theory, because like it or not, it is a theory because it cannot be proven because there is not enough evidence to prove it the way you speak of it. And no, i wasnt talking of teaching creationism in schools, because different religions have different beliefs and it just would raise controversy. What i think would be appropriate would be to point out that evolution is a theory and not teach it as you would laws of thermodynamics.


Do you know what a scientific theory is?
lol wtf

 

Offline Zarax

  • 210
How Retarded Are American Teens?
For the last time...
Theory != Hypothesis!
Gravity is a theory, Relativity is a theory, all phisics laws are theories, evolution is a theory.
Do you see the pattern?
The Best is Yet to Come

 

Offline Fergus

  • 28
How Retarded Are American Teens?
It seems a tad odd all this, you see we (Homo Sapiens) are now actually beyond the control of evolution.  We can now control our own enviroment.  This is why the creation argument has appeared, because of thier ability to manipulate thier sorrundings and superseed evolution.  This however does not mean that evolution does not exist, indeed it can even be argued that it can be proven.  The universe is infinite, something like us was bound to happen eventually, so although we were 'random' in a sense, we were just the lucky ones (or not so lucky, depending where you are now).  Hard to get a definitive answer for either argument, but I would just like to add one final thing.  Arguments of this nature are recent in thier creation (argh, bad pun), it is only with the the arrival of modern science and its technology that we can answer some of these big questions, and I have no doubt what-so-ever that in time (if we don't get destroyed by something-or the Neo-cons win) we will have the answers to all of your questions.  Just give us a few more hundred years.  You've given creation at least 2000, now its our turn.
Generic signature quote blabber

 

Offline Zarax

  • 210
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Actually we aren't beyond evolution's control...
You want an example?
The human race is slowly getting from having 32 theets to 28, there are increasing reports of people that don't get the last 4 when it grows...
The Best is Yet to Come

 

Offline Janos

  • A *really* weird sheep
  • 28
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Quote
Originally posted by Fergus
It seems a tad odd all this, you see we (Homo Sapiens) are now actually beyond the control of evolution.  We can now control our own enviroment.  This is why the creation argument has appeared, because of thier ability to manipulate thier sorrundings and superseed evolution.  This however does not mean that evolution does not exist, indeed it can even be argued that it can be proven.  The universe is infinite, something like us was bound to happen eventually, so although we were 'random' in a sense, we were just the lucky ones (or not so lucky, depending where you are now).  Hard to get a definitive answer for either argument, but I would just like to add one final thing.  Arguments of this nature are recent in thier creation (argh, bad pun), it is only with the the arrival of modern science and its technology that we can answer some of these big questions, and I have no doubt what-so-ever that in time (if we don't get destroyed by something-or the Neo-cons win) we will have the answers to all of your questions.  Just give us a few more hundred years.  You've given creation at least 2000, now its our turn.


no no no
Evolution is just different "genes" "trying" to survive. A horribly inaccurate statement, I know, but the pressure is still on, even though it is a bit different from what we traditionally think of as evolution.
Even though humans are no longer that directly affected by things like weather and so on (at least not in the modern Western countries) for prolonged periods, the enviroment issues (such as hunting) have become less important "for species". They have kinda lost their relevance, for now. However, things like fitness, sex appeal and stuff like that - it continues all the time and we cannot get rid of it. Males and females compete of partners, all the time. They pick up the "best", all the time. Having sex is the second most important goal for a generic being (the ultimate being passing your genes onwards, same thing basically), so mating rituals and looks/adaptability/whatever the passive partner finds important play a really significant role.

This happens quite fast, in less than dozens of generations. Of course, humans are quite long-lived animals and adaptations take much longer time than in bacteria, insects, mice or even birds*.

*Offtopic, but even in such advanced animals as birds decreasing aspects of evolution may kick in in less than 20 generations - 20 years! Many birds, when trapped in isolated islands, lose their flight in really short amount of time.
lol wtf

 

Offline Flipside

  • əp!sd!l£
  • 212
How Retarded Are American Teens?
At the end of the day though, this isn't a discussion about whether those beliefs are right or wrong, it's a discussion about whether someones belief of the truth is more important than what 'current thinking' is?

That's a lot harder question, since some of our greatest scientists have suggested things that went vastly against current thinking, even after that thinking had changed from religious to scientific.

What happens if someone thinks the structure of the atom is completely different, or that Quantum mechanics has forgotten one major fact?

Whether he is right or completely insane, he is still allowed to have his own opinion.

Admittedly science teaches self-correction, scientists look for fault in their own work, religion teaches faith, which is the belief in the untouchable, however, the right to not believe in 'current thinking' is as vital for us to advance as it is a threat for us to backslide, but it's a risk we MUST take.

 

Offline Black Wolf

  • Twisted Infinities
  • 212
  • Hey! You! Get off-a my cloud!
    • Visit the TI homepage!
How Retarded Are American Teens?
I don't think anyone's advocaing a dogmatic approach towards the current view of things like the structure of the atom, nor are we trying to prevent kids hearing about the latest theories and ideas. It's just that people, especially school  students, tend to accept what their teacher, someone whom they see as far more knowledgable than they, tells them. Using that position to advocate science as the changing, dynmic field it is is good. Using it to placate a bunch of young earth fundies by teaching a hypothesis that is unsupported by evidence is wrong, and most definitely not what science should be about.
TWISTED INFINITIES · SECTORGAME· FRONTLINES
Rarely Updated P3D.
Burn the heretic who killed F2S! Burn him, burn him!!- GalEmp

 

Offline StratComm

  • The POFressor
  • 212
  • Cameron Crazy
    • http://www.geocities.com/cek_83/index.html
How Retarded Are American Teens?
But you have to teach what is accepted truth, for if you teach nothing you simply widen the gulf between the experts and the average man, and you make it harder for someone to advance into an expert if you don't present him with at least the basic knowledge of his age.  It makes us much more prepared to accept a change in the theory if we know what the theory is.
who needs a signature? ;)
It's not much of an excuse for a website, but my stuff can be found here

"Holding the last thread on a page comes with an inherent danger, especially when you are edit-happy with your posts.  For you can easily continue editing in points without ever noticing that someone else could have refuted them." ~Me, on my posting behavior

Last edited by StratComm on 08-23-2027 at 08:34 PM

 

Offline Flipside

  • əp!sd!l£
  • 212
How Retarded Are American Teens?
I agree, if atheists have to study religion, then creationists have to study science, all I'm saying is that, after they have studied and learned science, they still choose to believe in creationism, I guess it's their choice to make. I'm an evolution man myself, though I note even scientifically inclined people sometimes blur the lines between Evolution and Natural Selection.

I'm not suggesting we tell people that 'both' things are the truth, by the way, that would just confuse them ;) And most creationist arguments that try to use science are usually more holey than holy anyway.

But no matter how hard you bash him or attack his beliefs, you won't change what a creationist thinks, no offence to anyone, but religion is good at being persecuted.

 

Offline Cyker

  • 28
How Retarded Are American Teens?
This is probably a bit late on in the thread, but re. the 'mutations' thing, well as someone said they are just copying errors of our code, and can be caused by loads of stuff from random chance to radiation exposure.

We can cope with a certain level of radiation screwing up our code (corrupt cells usually get destroyed) but sometimes they don't and the mutation is perpetuated to further generations.

Generally any changes are so small that they are practically unnoticable anyway, but if it aids you some how, e.g. you're slightly more immune to disease, then you are more likely to survive and thus this mutation will be passed on.
Now, the effect will be small, and that carrier might get killed by some other means (e.g. crushed by a falling Sathanas) and all that combined means you won't see any results for thousands of generations.

The most obvious 'benficial' mutation that comes to mind is the one that has allowed groups of people in Africa to become highly resistant to maleria - It is just one gene that is slightly altered, but it was enough to grant this resistance and has perpetuated itself slowly over time.

Of course, there is a bad side to this: If a child is born with one copy of the gene it will be normal, but if the child doesn't have the gene it will be vulnerable to maleria. However, if it gets 2 of these genes it will likely develop sickle-cell anemia.

Humans as a species are AFAIK unique in one thing however: Unlike the rest of nature's children we have access to drugs and med-tech. Because of this, someone with really ****ty code won't necessarily die - We can cure what ails them so to speak, but the problem there is that any faults in there genes will be passed on to offspring.

I reckon this is a lot like why Asian countries have such a greater number of short-sighted people than Western countries - They had access to corrective lenses a lot earlier than the West; Being able to see clearly is a very important trait for a species which relies on sight as it's primary sense, so whereas an English guy might have got crushed by a elephant 'cause he didn't see it, his Chinese counterpart would have seen it thanks to his glasses and lived to pass on his code to the next generation.

Track this down a thousand or so generations and we have the state where we are now.
An interesting thing I have been noticing is that increasing numbers of people need glasses/lenses to see clearly in this age too...

 

Offline WeatherOp

  • 29
  • I forged the ban hammer. What about that?
    • http://www.geocities.com/weather_op/pageone.html?1113100476773
How Retarded Are American Teens?
This place has a big problem, Lets agree on one thing, let everyone belive what they want, and don't flame e'm for it. This is the worst place I have seen, not even the Ubi forums that has thousands of members do this. I mean its not that hard to not flame someone.  Maybe someone should rename the place Flame-Lit Productions.
Decent Blacksmith, Master procrastinator.

PHD in the field of Almost Finishing Projects.

 

Offline Krackers87

  • 158 crew
  • 29
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Quote
Originally posted by WeatherOp
This place has a big problem, Lets agree on one thing, let everyone belive what they want, and don't flame e'm for it. This is the worst place I have seen, not even the Ubi forums that has thousands of members do this. I mean its not that hard to not flame someone.  Maybe someone should rename the place Flame-Lit Productions.


[SIZE=9]F I R E [/SIZE]


And if you want to see flaming go to half life planet and start picking at mild descrepencies with hl2, or even try to mention its not the best game in the world.
Put this in your profile if you know someone who is fighting, has survived, or has died from an awp no scope.

just like seventies goofballs
he's waiting on last calls
well listen method man
'cause if you leave on the last line
don't leave on the ground kind
born just a little too slow

 

Offline Kamikaze

  • A Complacent Wind
  • 29
    • http://www.nodewar.com
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Quote
Originally posted by Thrilla

I dont have a problem with accepting evolution as a theory, because like it or not, it is a theory because it cannot be proven because there is not enough evidence to prove it the way you speak of it.


The reason we call BS is because you're trying to discuss science but you actually don't understand some very basic concepts of science.


Here's an explanation I posted earlier:
Quote

A theory is an explanation of why things are the way they are. An example of this is theory concerning the electromagnetic force. It explains why electric fields do what they do.

Meanwhile, the actual effects of electric fields are described by laws (Coulomb's law in this case: (k(Q_1)(Q_2)) / (r^2) ), which are rules to describe what things actually do. This is derived from empirical findings.

A theory, if accepted by scientists, is a fairly solid thing that isn't "theoretical" and in science limbo land like some people claim. Although some solid, long-lasting theories do eventually get replaced (Newton's theories by Einstein's for example).


Quote
Originally posted by Thrilla

evolution is a theory and not teach it as you would laws of thermodynamics.


Again, you don't understand what the words you're using mean. A theory is an explanation backed up by mathematical justification and experimentation. Laws are rules derived from our observations.

A law doesn't explain anything, it just tells you *what* happens. Laws of thermodynamics don't tell you why things work and your claim that the theory of evolution is more tenous than thermodynamics is absurd. If you only had the *laws* of thermodynamics you would have less "proof" for thermodynamics than evolution.
Science alone of all the subjects contains within itself the lesson of the danger of belief in the infallibility of the greatest teachers in the preceding generation . . .Learn from science that you must doubt the experts. As a matter of fact, I can also define science another way: Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts. - Richard Feynman

 

Offline Clave

  • Myrmidon
    Get Firefox!
  • 23
    • Home of the Random Graphic
How Retarded Are American Teens?
Everything is just a theory until enough weight of proof is put behind it...

Evolution exists, full stop.
altgame - a site about something: http://www.altgame.net/
Mr Sparkle!  I disrespect dirt!  Join me or die!  Could you do any less?