[IceFire]

Originally posted by Ace
Considering the fact that we have the technology to have a sustainable economy and "go by what the environmentalist wackos want" yet companies in the US are refusing to make the necessary changes, perhaps treaties such as Kyoto or even the emission standards that McCain and Lieberman proposed are a necessary kick in the pants?

When the US military is moving to hybrid vehicles, but a certain popular consumer car is getting at best 7 mpg, there's something wrong.

YEP...for sure.

The Japanese thankfully are much smarter than the US car makers.  I've read that most of them are going towards an all hybrid line by 2007 or 2008.  They will probably be the first to adopt widescale hydrogen if that ever comes along.

[Bobboau]

and well get slaughtered in the market... worse

[EtherShock]

Originally posted by Ace
When the US military is moving to hybrid vehicles, but a certain popular consumer car is getting at best 7 mpg, there's something wrong.

I have heard we could've had fuel cell cars by now, that Detroit has been pushing for it, but they just can't beat the oil lobby. Now that gas prices are skyrocketing, they should be able to market more efficient vehicles and ultimately, develop clean burning cars. It's either that or repeat the mistakes of the 70's all over again.

[Kosh]

Originally posted by DeepSpace9er
Thats because Kyoto is targeting countries like the US not Canada to go by what environmentalist wackos want. This is basically institutionalised socialism when it all boils down.

Canada is also a developed country. It isn't like the US is the only major economy you know. Where do you find all this garbage anyway?

And this is going way past environmentalism. Getting off fossil fuels would be highly beneficial to national security.

But appearently you seem more interested in protecting the oil industries' profits than this countries' future.

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by DeepSpace9er
Thats because Kyoto is targeting countries like the US not Canada to go by what environmentalist wackos want. This is basically institutionalised socialism when it all boils down.

I was goin to write a considered reply about how Kyoto targets all first-world nations (with the ability to replace pollutant technology with cleaner alternatives both in existing and future applications) such as Germany and Japan, and how it's no more socialist than say the Geneva Convention or existing corporate law (do you even know what socialism is?  by nature it can't be anything but institutionalised, for one thing....), but then I realised you're still talking rubbish with terms like 'environmentalist whackos' and are working from a viewpoiint of wilful ignorance, bias and short term self-interest.

Of course, Kyoto is suppossed to target all heavy polluters, so it would sort of have to target the country that produces 25% of the worlds pollution as much as any other.  I'm sure they'd be happy to let the US wallow in its own filth if it wasn't for the somewhat tricky 'global' part of 'global warming'.