Author Topic: Research into Fs2 Mk.2  (Read 16483 times)

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Offline Setekh

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Would this sort of thing fit best on the FS Wiki? :)
- Eddie Kent Woo, Setekh, Steak (of Steaks), AWACS. Seriously, just pick one.
HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS, now V3.0. Bringing Modders Together since January 2001.
THE HARD LIGHT ARRAY. Always makes you say wow.

 

Offline Singh

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If you want it, yeah sure. But I find it easier to update a thread as opposed to the Wiki  :P

No updates yet - posting from Genting on my vacation atm! I have pictures and stuff that ill post later when I get back to Singapore :D

"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline Singh

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Ok, I just read the Shivan Manifesto thread (well, actually just the recent updates and bumpage to it) and got a few thoughts running.

Rather than mill on them, I went on the net again and did another search for Aken Bosch, this time finding a vastly more detailed article on his life and what-not. And then I read through it. The similarities are startling to say the least.

I was going to post this large reply to the thread when my connection went out. Goober then locked the thread (darn you!) so I couldnt post there, so instead, I will post here.

So many theories...so much speculation.

And yet, there is but one probability.

The Shivans were part of a much larger problem, Volition said...

The key here, I believe....is not race... nor species but problem...


From Dictionary.com:

prob·lem    ( P )  Pronunciation Key  (prblm)
n.
A question to be considered, solved, or answered: math problems; the problem of how to arrange transportation.
A situation, matter, or person that presents perplexity or difficulty: was having problems breathing; considered the main problem to be his boss. See Usage Note at dilemma.

Problem

n
1: a state of difficulty that needs to be resolved;
2: a source of difficulty;
3: a question raised for consideration or solution



The question here should not be who the shivans are...or why they do what they do...or even whom they work for (if applicable). But, rather what is the nature of the larger problem at play against humanity?

There is a hidden hint here....one within the way the Vasudans have thrived, and how humanity was still struggling comparitively. Then comes the Bosch enigma.

http://www.morbidoutlook.com/art/articles/1999_00_bosch.html

This is a very interesting article on Bosch's nature and paintings of the time. Pay close attention to the details of the time in particular:

"Bosch lived during unsettled and anxious times. The old medieval order imposed by the Church was cracking under the growth of cities, the power and commerce of capitalism, the rise of national states, demands for religious reform and the beginnings of science. Minds were growing curious, analytical and adventurous. Historians point to this time as the beginning of the modern world.
The age was marked by violence and pessimism. Kings and dukes were murdered, soldiers pillaged and killed, cruelty to the poor and the animals were prevalent. The future seemed dim with visions of demons, darkness and hell. Opposing the current times, Bosch portrayed his message with a visual impact so fierce, it chilled his contemporaries and fascinates us five hundred years later. "

Bosch mentioned in his monologues, in his logs, the feelings he ahd of the Vasudans (especially the 4th log)...thing is there are correlations to some of hte monos and his paintings.

An example of this could be Mono 3 - the Iceni...which has some similarity to 'our' Bosch's "A ship of fools". However, it is more matching of Bosch's abandonment of the Iceni, and all of it's crew. A ship of fools and cattle that had followed him around blindly, worrying only about revenge and their hatred of the Vasudans....

"In The Ship of Fools, we see that all of humankind is sailing through the seas on a ship that is representative of humanity. Everyone represented here is a fool in Bosch’s eyes; people that eat, drink, flirt, cheat and pursue unattainable objects. Meanwhile the ship drifts aimlessly and never reaches the harbor. The sinister and monstrous things that he brought forth are our hidden forms of self-love, and the ugliness from within."

But hte overall theme one gets from 'our' Bosch could be summarized by the article:

"In an analysis done about forty years ago, the Dutch scholar Dirk Bax concluded that Bosch was a moralist with contempt for the lower classes. He had no sympathy for the poor and used bitter symbolism to satirize beggars, monks, nuns, soldiers, peasants, pilgrims, whores, gypsies, vagrants and jesters. He occasionally lashed out an emperors and nobles as well, but rarely against burghers like himself and others of the wealthy middle class. He vented his anger the most on the excess of lust, license, drunkenness, gluttony, folly and stupidity. Some art historians have since interpreted Bosch’s paintings as displaying less pessimism and more understanding of the difficult plight of his fellow human beings. "

A rather starkling parralel (or at least, a similarity in course) to the Bosch in Freespace 2.

What does this bode for the Shivans, however? Or indeed...how is it even related? The religious undertones that govern the existance of Bosch, indicates that the Shivans could indeed be governed by such undertones as well. From the article, the time at the period was potrayed as one of much darkness and strife, with the shadow of demons on the horizon. This could easily have been the description of the time in Fs1 when we started out - with the shadows of the Shivans in Ross128.

The main difference between real history and our paradigm here, however, is in events. In real history, this period of strife made way to capitalism, economy and the modern era.

In freespace, however, the Volition team appear to have taken a different tangent. This may be the main difference - could the so called 'demons' have appeared in the form of the Shivans? This could be equally possible in either FS1 or FS2. Judging from the trend, there is a more than likely chance that FS3 would have even more significant religious undertones and currents driving it along - the only question is which religion's?

In FS1, the Shivans were potrayed mostly from Eastern Hindu mythology. One thing about hindu mythology - it has hte largest number of dietys around, which probably allowed the devs from flexibility in naming conventions, so its probably not very in-depth than one may think...FS2 however, saw the naming conventions change to that of Demons in general.

Taking into account this fact, and that of Bosch...could the Shivans in essence, represent the inner demons that we fight everyday? Or perhaps, teh guardians or vassals of a representative hell itself?So many theories...so much speculation.

And yet, there is but one probability.

The Shivans were part of a much larger problem, Volition said...

The key here, I believe....is not race... nor species but problem...


From Dictionary.com:

prob·lem    ( P )  Pronunciation Key  (prblm)
n.
A question to be considered, solved, or answered: math problems; the problem of how to arrange transportation.
A situation, matter, or person that presents perplexity or difficulty: was having problems breathing; considered the main problem to be his boss. See Usage Note at dilemma.

Problem

n
1: a state of difficulty that needs to be resolved;
2: a source of difficulty;
3: a question raised for consideration or solution



The question here should not be who the shivans are...or why they do what they do...or even whom they work for (if applicable). But, rather what is the nature of the larger problem at play against humanity?

There is a hidden hint here....one within the way the Vasudans have thrived, and how humanity was still struggling comparitively. Then comes the Bosch enigma.

http://www.morbidoutlook.com/art/articles/1999_00_bosch.html

This is a very interesting article on Bosch's nature and paintings of the time. Pay close attention to the details of the time in particular:

"Bosch lived during unsettled and anxious times. The old medieval order imposed by the Church was cracking under the growth of cities, the power and commerce of capitalism, the rise of national states, demands for religious reform and the beginnings of science. Minds were growing curious, analytical and adventurous. Historians point to this time as the beginning of the modern world.
The age was marked by violence and pessimism. Kings and dukes were murdered, soldiers pillaged and killed, cruelty to the poor and the animals were prevalent. The future seemed dim with visions of demons, darkness and hell. Opposing the current times, Bosch portrayed his message with a visual impact so fierce, it chilled his contemporaries and fascinates us five hundred years later. "

Bosch mentioned in his monologues, in his logs, the feelings he ahd of the Vasudans (especially the 4th log)...thing is there are correlations to some of hte monos and his paintings.

An example of this could be Mono 3 - the Iceni...which has some similarity to 'our' Bosch's "A ship of fools". However, it is more matching of Bosch's abandonment of the Iceni, and all of it's crew. A ship of fools and cattle that had followed him around blindly, worrying only about revenge and their hatred of the Vasudans....

"In The Ship of Fools, we see that all of humankind is sailing through the seas on a ship that is representative of humanity. Everyone represented here is a fool in Bosch’s eyes; people that eat, drink, flirt, cheat and pursue unattainable objects. Meanwhile the ship drifts aimlessly and never reaches the harbor. The sinister and monstrous things that he brought forth are our hidden forms of self-love, and the ugliness from within."

But hte overall theme one gets from 'our' Bosch could be summarized by the article:

"In an analysis done about forty years ago, the Dutch scholar Dirk Bax concluded that Bosch was a moralist with contempt for the lower classes. He had no sympathy for the poor and used bitter symbolism to satirize beggars, monks, nuns, soldiers, peasants, pilgrims, whores, gypsies, vagrants and jesters. He occasionally lashed out an emperors and nobles as well, but rarely against burghers like himself and others of the wealthy middle class. He vented his anger the most on the excess of lust, license, drunkenness, gluttony, folly and stupidity. Some art historians have since interpreted Bosch’s paintings as displaying less pessimism and more understanding of the difficult plight of his fellow human beings. "

A rather starkling parralel (or at least, a similarity in course) to the Bosch in Freespace 2.

What does this bode for the Shivans, however? Or indeed...how is it even related? The religious undertones that govern the existance of Bosch, indicates that the Shivans could indeed be governed by such undertones as well. From the article, the time at the period was potrayed as one of much darkness and strife, with the shadow of demons on the horizon. This could easily have been the description of the time in Fs1 when we started out - with the shadows of the Shivans in Ross128.

The main difference between real history and our paradigm here, however, is in events. In real history, this period of strife made way to capitalism, economy and the modern era.

In freespace, however, the Volition team appear to have taken a different tangent. This may be the main difference - could the so called 'demons' have appeared in the form of the Shivans? This could be equally possible in either FS1 or FS2. Judging from the trend, there is a more than likely chance that FS3 would have even more significant religious undertones and currents driving it along - the only question is which religion's?

In FS1, the Shivans were potrayed mostly from Eastern Hindu mythology. One thing about hindu mythology - it has hte largest number of dietys around, which probably allowed the devs from flexibility in naming conventions, so its probably not very in-depth than one may think...FS2 however, saw the naming conventions change to that of Demons in general.

Taking into account this fact, and that of Bosch...could the Shivans in essence, represent the inner demons that we fight everyday? Or perhaps, teh guardians or vassals of a representative hell itself?
"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline Singh

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Oh, just to indicate how evil the damn thing is. After my post; the number of times read that appeared correlates with a well-known Christian belief.... :eek: :
(no joke - real screenshot...)

"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline Mefustae

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Wasn't '666' deemed a mis-translation, and the number '616' deemed more accurate to the original writings on the subject...?

 

Offline Singh

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I dont remember reading that, yet it seems vaguely familiar.

In any case, time to move on. I did some more research and digging - this time into the destruction of Capella. Most of the answers so far have come from google, so why not just try and search for a familiar event? I typed in Destruction of Capella, and found little except for a neat entry down at Science-fiction database. Check it out. I then tried searching for just Capella instead.

I found This. It is a real system, albiet different. Also, Capella is known as 'she-goat' in Roman mythology, and is said to be the bringer of destructive storms, as gleamed from Here

Some interesting quotes:

Quote
History of the star: Capella, "small goat" or the "Little She-goat", is a white star in Auriga marking the goat that the Charioteer is carrying on his left shoulder.

There are many ancient stories relating to Capella, the 6th largest star in the sky.

A previous name of this star was Amalthea, which referred to the goat that suckled the baby Zeus (Jove/Jupiter). Amalthea was mother of the Haedi (the two stars depicted as kid goats - Zeta, Hoedus 1 and Eta Auriga, Hoedus 11), which she put aside to accommodate her foster-child, and with her sister Melissa, she fed the infant god with goat's milk and honey on Mount Ida and this star is appropriately positioned in the Milky Way; and for which Manilius wrote: The Nursing Goat's repaid with Heaven.

From this came the occasional Jovis Nutrix.

Others said that the star represented the Goat's horn broken off in play by the infant Zeus and transferred to the heavens as Cornu-copia, the "Horn of Plenty", a title recalled by the modern Lithuanian "Food-bearer".

The words Keren-happuch, the "Paint-horn", or the "Horn of Antimony", of the Book of Job xlii, 14, — the Cornus tibii of the Vulgate are all said to be connected.

"Capella's course admiring landsmen trace, but sailors hate her inauspicious face". This star, along with the Haedi, were known for their stormy character throughout classical days and this was called the "rainy Goat-star". The word "goat" was analogous to a "Storm Wind".

Pliny and Manilius treated it as a constellation by itself, also calling it Capra, Caper, Hircus, and by other hircine titles. Our word is the diminutive of Capra, sometimes turned into Crepa, but this star was more definitely given as Olenia, Olenie, Capra Olenie, and the Olenium Astrum of Ovid's Heroides. In the present day it is Cabrilla with the Spaniards, and Chevre with the French.
The Arabic had various names; Ayyuk, Alhajoc, Alhajoth, Alathod, Alkatod, Alatudo, Atud, Alcahela. Al 'Anz, "Goat". The early Arabs called it Al Rakib, the Driver. The Tyrians called it 'Iyutha.

Capella's place on the Egyptian Denderah zodiac is occupied by a mummied cat in the outstretched hand of a male figure crowned with feathers; while, always an important star in the temple worship of the great Egyptian god Ptah, the Opener (of the year), it is supposed to have borne the name of that divinity and probably was observed at its setting 1700 BCE from his temple, the noted edifice at Karnak near Thebes, the No Amon of the books of the prophets Jeremiah and Nahum. A sanctuary of Ptah at Memphis also was oriented to it about 5200 BCE. There is believed to be at least five temples oriented to its setting.

It served, too, the same purpose for worship in Greece, where it may have been the orientation point of a temple at Eleusis to the goddess Diana Propyla.

In India it also was sacred as Brahma Ridaya, the "Heart of Brahma".

It was the Akkadian Dil-gan I-ku, the "Messenger of Light", and Dil-gan Babill, the "Patron star of Babylon",

One Akkadian cuneiform inscription, supposed to refer to Capella, is rendered by Jensen Askar, the "Tempest God"; and the Tablet of the Thirty Stars bears the synonymous Ma-a-tu; all this well accounting for its subsequent character in classical times.

The ancient Peruvians identifying this star with Colca, the Shepherd's Star as was the title in Mediterranean countries and with English poets.

In astrology Capella portended civic and military honors and wealth. (Allen).


An interesting thing about Ptah. His name means "Creator".

From the Memphite Theology:

    "Thus it is said of Ptah: 'He who made all and created the gods.' And he is Ta-tenen, who gave birth to the gods, and from whom every thing came forth, foods, provisions, divine offerings, all good things. Thus it is recognized and understood that he is the mightiest of the gods. Thus Ptah was satisfied after he had made all things and all divine words."

    (Ancient Egyptian Literature, Volume I: The Old and Middle Kingdom translated by Miriam Lichtheim)


From the lines I underlined in the passage above, one must note that Bhrama was known as the creator as well, in Indian mythology. This connection....it is simply too fascinating to ignore. I do not know if Volition did this delibrately or not, and it sparks significant thoughts on various religious connections.

The backbone behind the Shivans actions...was it to get back at the creator? Are we really seeing, veiled behind a heavy mask, a very massive and gargantual battle between good and evil, with humanity caught in the middle? It would certainly fit with what was found earlier about Admiral Bosch, and of how he tried to conspire with the demons. But then, one must ask - where is the evidence of the creator, the 'good' side that the Shivans were supposedly fighting? Perhaps this was supposed to be the climax in FS3 - the penultimate and epic battle between the traditional good and evil...or is it something far more sinister, something far, far deeper?
"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline pecenipicek

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this is getting seriously complicated, and you deserve a fecking medal for this :)
Skype: vrganjko
Ho, ho, ho, to the bottle I go
to heal my heart and drown my woe!
Rain may fall and wind may blow,
and many miles be still to go,
but under a tall tree I will lie!

The Apocalypse Project needs YOU! - recruiting info thread.

 

Offline Singh

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More connections. I ran a search for the term "The Great Destroyers" and came accross these related articles. The first, and most direct is from the Bible. however the only connection here is related to teh other connections to teh bible. Many of the Christians would no doubt be aware with the four horsemen of the apocalypse?

Quote, from Here
Quote
"This is grand enough, but take note of the place where this vision shows up in the Revelation. In the chapter right before today's passage, the Lamb began breaking the seven seals on the scroll. The first four seals unleash the four horsemen of the Apocalypse -- war, violence, famine, and death-- the great destroyers of human life and civilization. Breaking the fifth seal reveals the cries of faithful people who had been martyred for their faithfulness. The sixth seal initiates a series of catastrophes greater than the damage that the four horsemen had accomplished. Reading through this series of tales of what happens as the seals are broken is a terrifying tour of widening disaster made more dreadful by the feeling that the worst is yet to come.

Six seals broken, only one left to go. Warfare and famine and death and global upheaval and cries for vindication-- what's next? What's next, as Revelation recounts it, is a pause in the drama. Instead of a seventh broken seal bringing things to an inevitable end of final judgement, what John saw was a vision of the Church of Jesus Christ -- his faithful followers, first those on earth, and then, the great company in heaven. Here's what Professor Boring has to day about this: "Instead of seeing the expected End, what we see is the church. This is ... a reflection of the experience of fist-century Christianity. They looked for the End and what came was the church, not as a substitute for the act of God but itself a dimension of God's saving activity."


The interesting thing is could there be a connection with the breaking of the seals, and the coming of the apocalypse, in this case? Could one of the seals have been delibrately broken in FS1, bringing about the great destroyers? What about the Trinity, and Bosch's gambit? Was this too, what the ancients did and suffered for it?

The first freespace's seal would have to be war - war with the Vasudans, primarily. The second seal would hav ebeen the NTF, and the voilence that ensued, most poetly described in Bosch's own description of himself - "A butcher of innocents."

A similar parrellel could have gone with the Anceint's fate. They started first with war against the civilizations and the second being voilence (from Ancients Monologue 1, the sentence "We crushed them or we subdued them." would be applicable of this.) The third seal would have been the siege of their homeworld...and finally, the last one being death as they were slowly hunted down by the shivans. A rather rought parralel, but plausable nonetheless.

In relation to it, though, I ran a search for "Sathanas"

Most of the results came from a black metal band that arose in the 80's and weren't very succesfull. Then I ran a search for it on dictionary.com and got this result:

1 entry found for Sathanas.
Sathanas

\Sath"an*as\, n. [L. Satanas. See Satan] Satan. [Obs.] --Chaucer. Wyclif.


Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.

Rather interesting, don't you think? But unfortunately, not THAT related to the four horsemen.

Then of course, came the other result for the great destroyers. This one fits in far better to Volition's theme and overall plan. Someone on the team obviously knew Chinese culture as well as indian and christian/jewish.

http://www.artmediaresources.com/item.cfm/100075

Quote
The entombed terracotta army of China's First Emperor, accidentally discovered in 1974, was hailed as 'the archaeological find of the century.' What manner of man built so grandly for the afterlife? Over 2,000 years after his death, Qin Shihuangdi is still vilifed as one of the great destroyers of history. Yet, by annihilating the warring states, he unifed China; while burning books and executing scholars, he also standardised the written script; after dismantling fortifications and city walls, he ordered the Great Wall to be built. Concisely written and handsomely illustrated, this is an account of the paradoxical tyrant and reformer behind that astonishing mausoleum.


Eeeenteresting. The quest for more insight continues....
"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline FireCrack

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The first seal may have been the opening of subspace, in conection with the ancients monolouges.
actualy, mabye not.
"When ink and pen in hands of men Inscribe your form, bipedal P They draw an altar on which God has slaughtered all stability, no eyes could ever soak in all the places you anoint, and yet to see you all at once we only need the point. Flirting with infinity, your geometric progeny that fit inside you oh so tight with triangles that feel so right."
3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944 59230781640628620899862803482534211706...
"Your ever-constant homily says flaw is discipline, the patron saint of imperfection frees us from our sin. And if our transcendental lift shall find a final floor, then Man will know the death of God where wonder was before."

 

Offline aldo_14

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Interesting thing.

Aken - as in Aken Bosch -  was patron of the boat that carried souls into the underworld. (http://touregypt.net/godsofegypt/aken.htm)
[q]Patron of: the ferryboat that carries the souls of the dead to the underworld.

Appearance: A man dressed in the garb of a sailor, standing in the stern of a papyrus boat.

Description: Aken was the custodian of the ferryboat in the Underworld. However, he was somewhat amusing, for he had to be woken from slumber by the ferryman Mahaf to provide the boat for travel on the celestial waters.

Worship: Not truly worshipped, but mentioned in many hymns and passages of The Book of the Dead.[/q]

Note; dressed as a sailor (Admiral Bosch, military uniform similar to a naval officer).  Also, 'had to be woken from slumber' - can be considered a reference to either waking the Shivans, or whatever revelation in the GTI rebellion led to his plan and the NTF.  Additionally, by the time Bosch left it, the Iceni was effectively a ship of the dead; although the passage to the underworld would seem a more apt reference for the NTF hierarchy departing with the Shivans.

Note2; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aken_(god) Ra  - the sun god - was apparently connected to Aken.  Specifically Ra used Akens boat to cross the underworld (possibly referencing the Capellan supernova and wherever the Shivans went afterwards; perhaps Bosch provided a key to that).  Also, Aken was considered having the head of a ram; IMO the Iceni design loosely resembles that. 

It's considered Aken may have led to other similar mythologies, such as Charon.

Joseph van Aken was a flemish painter.  I haven't found any specific details on him, though; I'd suggest the symbology and Egyptian mythology makes the prior source more likely (especially as van Aken seems quite obscure).

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Except, of course, in connection with the name Bosch...that puts a bit of a different spin on Flemish painters.
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Offline aldo_14

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Except, of course, in connection with the name Bosch...that puts a bit of a different spin on Flemish painters.

From what little I've found on Van Aken, he seems to be fairly bog-standard landscape; there doesn't appear to be the inner meaning of Hieronymous Bosch there.

EDIT; er, that could be because he changed his name to Hieronymous Bosch.   :nervous:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/ww2/A871391

 

Offline Polpolion

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Quote
\Sath"an*as\, n. [L. Satanas. See Satan] Satan. [Obs.] --Chaucer. Wyclif.

aww man... ANOTHER ship class that means 'devil'  :ick: (lucifer, demon, hades[sorta])

 

Offline Singh

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Interesting thing.

Aken - as in Aken Bosch - was patron of the boat that carried souls into the underworld. (http://touregypt.net/godsofegypt/aken.htm)
[q]Patron of: the ferryboat that carries the souls of the dead to the underworld.

Appearance: A man dressed in the garb of a sailor, standing in the stern of a papyrus boat.

Description: Aken was the custodian of the ferryboat in the Underworld. However, he was somewhat amusing, for he had to be woken from slumber by the ferryman Mahaf to provide the boat for travel on the celestial waters.

Worship: Not truly worshipped, but mentioned in many hymns and passages of The Book of the Dead.[/q]

Note; dressed as a sailor (Admiral Bosch, military uniform similar to a naval officer). Also, 'had to be woken from slumber' - can be considered a reference to either waking the Shivans, or whatever revelation in the GTI rebellion led to his plan and the NTF. Additionally, by the time Bosch left it, the Iceni was effectively a ship of the dead; although the passage to the underworld would seem a more apt reference for the NTF hierarchy departing with the Shivans.

Note2; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aken_(god) Ra - the sun god - was apparently connected to Aken. Specifically Ra used Akens boat to cross the underworld (possibly referencing the Capellan supernova and wherever the Shivans went afterwards; perhaps Bosch provided a key to that). Also, Aken was considered having the head of a ram; IMO the Iceni design loosely resembles that.

It's considered Aken may have led to other similar mythologies, such as Charon.

Joseph van Aken was a flemish painter. I haven't found any specific details on him, though; I'd suggest the symbology and Egyptian mythology makes the prior source more likely (especially as van Aken seems quite obscure).

Interesting indeed. For the painter's details, look above in my post - ive posted a direct link to Bosch's paintings and their analysis.

I also ran a search for Mahaf. This is what I found:

Mahaf was the ferryman who navigates the boat provided by Aken, along the winding waters of the Underworld. he also acts as a herald announcing the arrival of the king into the presence of the sun god, Re.

A direct three-point connection, definately.

However, the only connection to the events that we saw happening is the Iceni itself, and it's ferrying of Bosch himself, and maybe the Supernova. It fits, but not completely. Definately an interesting theory to consider, though.

Perhaps....there is a different connection of sorts; one between the  Aken, and the painter Bosch? Probably not....

*goes to check anyway
"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Aken Bosch IS Hieronymous Bosch. Look at the link aldo provided.
"Load sabot. Target Zaku, direct front!"

A Feddie Story

 

Offline Singh

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Re: Research into Fs2 Mk.2
Augnes Dei

Sound familiar?

Perhaps Volition had hte last say in the game....



Now, if someone can just help me analyze and put down accurately, the latin words/characters for the endpart1 chant, it'd be absolutely great. :)
"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline CaptJosh

  • 210
Re: Research into Fs2 Mk.2
Interestingly enough, though unrelated to this research in particular, there's another video game connection with religious music. According to the end credits of Homeworld, the songe that most of us(us being those who listen to, appreciate, and have knowledge of classical music) know as Samuel Barber's Adagio for Strings is actually titled Agnus Dei.

I love the choral rendition used in Homeworld. I went so far as to get the tools to extract the AIF files from the music archive of the game and then run it through winamp to get a wav so that I could then use AudioGrabber to make a nice , high quality Mp3 of it, much better than the one Relic offers for download.
CaptJosh

There are only 10 kinds of people in the world;
those who understand binary and those who don't.

 
The article from Volitionwatch was taken directly from LFTS, which, to say the least, is a terribly written fan-fic with little or no connection to the FS universe, and is generally inconsistent. The writings on the "vasudan tablets" are identical in to the ones that LTFS' author invented.

Another thing: the sheer quantity of misspellings and grammatical errors in the article are inconsistent with any official Volition releases, but is consistent with the quality of LFTS.

The article is also inconsistent with the official Volition story of the Shivans wiping out the Ancients 8000 years ago (it claims both 50000 and 2000 years ago), the ancient monologue in FS1 (the ancients were warlike conquerors, anything but peaceful), and a variety of other official sources.

Moreso, it is a total rip-off of the Battlestar Galactica storyline (Shivans being built as slaves and rebelling? Shivans != Cylons).
« Last Edit: February 22, 2006, 10:59:34 am by Ares III »

 

Offline mnftg64

  • 27
Re: Research into Fs2 Mk.2
WOW! This stuff is thoroughly interesting... you keep this up and we may find all of our answers and more. I personally think that all the connections are more than "someone working at Volition knew about this and decided to put it in the game"... I think it's pretty darn safe to say this was all planned well in advance. We have all kinds of history here. Roman, Chinese, US, German, Christian... Too much for just someone to know. Keep it up!

 
Re: Research into Fs2 Mk.2
According to the end credits of Homeworld, the songe that most of us(us being those who listen to, appreciate, and have knowledge of classical music) know as Samuel Barber's Adagio for Strings is actually titled Agnus Dei.

Adagio for Strings is simply thr title of the non-choral version of Agnus Dei, theres no "its actually titled" there, just so you know.
The needs of my belly, outwiegh the needs of the few.