[StratComm]

Again, I agree in theory; I've just had so much trouble trying to get things that are legitimate problems fixed that something that isn't even necessarily within the scope of the warrenty strikes me as being a real challenge to get repaired on the manufacturer's dime.  It may be assembly, but if it's legitimately a problem across all of that particular line then that speaks of a design-time error that, once sold, it's really hard to do much about.  The games that cause the problem would be interesting to know - I've had my full desktop rig brought to its knees with a GPU due to some of the "latest and greatest" games as the full capabilities of the last couple of generations of graphics cards tend to generate a ton of heat - and what kinds of issues the computer has in general beyond the somewhat vague issues that SuperCoolAl has already told us about.

If I'd had experience with non desktop-replacement style laptops that didn't suffer from this kind of problem when run to their limit, I might have a different opinion on it.  But from my experience, degraded performance on high-powered apps tends to be a common theme across all laptops.

[Descenterace]

My take on this is:

"If you want to play games, a laptop probably isn't the best machine for the job."

Portables are designed for convenience and, unsurprisingly, portability. Desktops are designed for power and don't have much in the way of size limitations. Since games typically require a lot in the power department, the desktop PC is generally a better choice. You know it's up to the job, and if there're cooling issues there's enough space to chuck in another fan.
Laptops are built to a certain spec and stay there. Desktops can be modified to suit the job. This is why desktop PCs will be superior to laptops until modular portable designs are released.
Which probably won't happen.

Seriously, though. You buy a laptop and expect it to run games? WTF? Laptops generally get rather warm during normal use; of course it's going to overheat in Doom 3!

[WMCoolmon]

Laptops are built to a certain spec and stay there.

Exactly. Thus a laptop should be able to run at full capacity without overheating, because the manufacturer knows what's being put in, how it's going to be put in, etc.

Building something that overheats is basically nullifying the value of the components that cause it to overheat. Or in other words, it's a marketing ploy to get more money without spending the extra money to ensure that the equipment runs properly within normal operating conditions. Again, it's not like he's trying to overclock anything - he's simply running something that causes the components to operate at their maximum safe values for more than 2-3 minutes.

[SuperCoolAl]

Exactly. Luckily this doesn't affect FS2 as it's an older game, or if it does the effect isn't that noticeable, so I'm not completely gameless!

I do have a quote from another forum though that's interesting:

From http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?p=1945620#post1945620
It's definitely a heat issue. What you are experiencing is called 'throttling'. The desktop I built a year ago did that a lot for a while because the cooling gel wasn't optimal for a while.

Unless you feel that you are competent enough to open the laptop and check if everything is fine and if it isn't, then fix it, then send it back. It should not throttle. As hot as my laptop runs, it NEVER throttles. The fans turn on like a desktop's, but it doesn't throttle.

If you can open your laptop and check to see if the CPU fan is placed correctly and if it isn't, then do so, the go ahead.

Another thing you may want to know is that many OLD applications take as much CPU usage as they can get. For example, I recently found my old MechCommander game and it always put the CPU under full load no matter what, which consequently made it VERY HOT. It would otherwise run fine on a Pentium II 500Mhz based computer. Thus, if it's an old application that SHOULDN'T be running at full load, find some Athlon compatible software that will allow you to manually underclock your CPU. Try 'Notebook Hardware Control'. Google it. I doubt it supports AMD chips, but check anyway.

Good luck and post back with what you did.

So it doesn't seem to be normal behaviour, I don't want to try underclocking (or opening the case) though as that might void the warranty (I'm being quite wary about stuff like that at the moment!)

[Herra Tohtori]

Normal behaviour or not, it's a. fraudulent advertisement and b. palin stupid on behalf of manufacturer IMO.

a. If advertises claim that the laptop does something, it should do it, right? So, if doing thing causes the laptop not being able to do the thing, the laptop can be considered incapable of actually doing the thing in the first place. The car metaphor was quite adequate.

If I plugged a dual turbo on a Nissan Sunny from 1985 and sold it saying that it accelerates to 100 km/h in 8 seconds (not gonna happen but anyway...) and didn't mention that if you accelerate to that 100 km/h three times in a row, the modded engine components produce enough heat that it wont accelerate that fast anymore (or worse, suffers an engine failure), I'd be considered a car dealer from the worst end, I think.

b. It's plain stupid because the manufacturer could achieve the same overall performance with equipment that is not as fast but doesn't generate that much heat either, so it could even be more efficient in long run. As for fast responsiveness in normal programming, I'd agree that a video card of that quality is kinda overshot... Also, if the computer is not full of spyware, a weaker processor would do its work just as well in normal processing, like using Word, Excel, Mediaplayer () and other traditional of Windows applications. That processor really comes in useful IN extensive use, but since extensive use causes too much heat, I think it could well be replaced with a weaker processor that could longer and better maintain its original capacity because not generating as much heat.

I suppose a laptop would benefit more of additional memory in using basic applications and, for example, Photoshop and stuff. So it would be as responsive with, say, a little slower video card and a little slower processor, but having 2 GB memory. It would be cheaper to manufacture with lower prices on GPU and CPU, and it would work better along the specs.

One solution would be to connect an additional display, keyboard, mouse and speakers, throw the machine itself into freezer and play along.  A real redneck-1337 solution for cooling problems...

[Descenterace]

2GHz for a laptop is not the same as 2GHz for a desktop. The CPU throttling is not there simply to save power. It is there because running the machine at full speed continually causes heat problems.

You're right, the manufacturer does know what's in there. In normal use, the machine should be fine. High-end games on a laptop are not 'normal use'.

[SuperCoolAl]

You know something, I think there's an incorrectly mounted fan in there, whenever they speed up I can barely feel any air coming out of the main vent.

[Herra Tohtori]

Perhaps it's an intake? 

[SadisticSid]

I have almost exactly the same system specs - in an Acer Ferrari 4005 - and it never throttles either, even during 24-hour Oblivion marathons. The downside is that the fan is ALWAYS on. But at least the CPU never throttles down. Try turning off things like WiFi and Bluetooth, and pull the battery out too. That might help reduce your temperature a few degrees.

[SuperCoolAl]

Thanks Sid, I'll try unhooking the battery now.

No, it's definitely a outlet, I believe there are intakes underneath but there are no other vents on the sides. It kinda sounds obstructed too, unless it's just me imagining things 

But it definitely blew more when I first got it I'm quite sure, when I put my hand right up to the vent now while the fan's on I feel warmth but the force of the air coming out is rather small, which may explain why I don't remember having this problem when I first got it, but maybe I did and I just didn't notice or don't remember.

I'm wary of opening my case because I'm not sure if it's usual that that voids the warranty.

edit- nope no joy. Lasted about 10 minutes in Day of Defeat Source, didn't throttle but instead chose to hard poweroff 

[Turambar]

my laptop plays oblivion just fine, mediumish graphics.   i can do farcry, hl2, doom3, and make them all look pretty good

but then my laptop is a beast

Gateway 7510GX,  Athlon64 (does the same scaling thing, but not when i play) 3700+, x600 mobile (ati sux), 100gb HD (teh internet is for pr0n!) and 1 gig o' RAM.   

definitely a nice find for $1250 (at Best Buy, no less)

[SuperCoolAl]

Nice, but I wouldn't say Ati sucks. My Mob X700 been able to handle just about any game I've thrown at it at 1280x800, apart from the FEAR demo.

[aldo_14]

I have an x300 on my work laptop, which seems to cope with GalCiv2 nicely during lunchtimes.

[StratComm]

I'm wary of opening my case because I'm not sure if it's usual that that voids the warranty.

I wish I knew the answer to that one.  Usually opening the case alone doesn't void the warrenty as it's something that has to be done to install new components (and while they aren't covered by warrenty, they also usually don't break it either), but that seems to vary from manufacturer to manufacturer.  I can tell you that it does not invalidate the warrenty coverage for Dell, Apple, and IBM/Lenovo machines though.  Check the fine print.

[SuperCoolAl]

Well the text is at http://www.evesham.com/MyEvesham/TermsConditions.asp?e=5E7B7B62-B336-4AB0-96AA-31849717F911

I'm going to check my own documentation though to see if it differs, but it looks the same at first glance.

I might not even open it before I contact them anyway just in case.

(btw I'm on RTB)

EDIT- NO!

Customer undertakes:
1. To carry out routine day-to-day preventative maintenance as may be recommended under the Customer operating instructions supplied with this equipment.
2. To permit no alteration to apparatus or wiring except by Agreement with the Company and work to be carried out in accordance with approved procedures.[[/i][/u]
3. To notify the Company in writing in the event that the Equipment is to be re-located.
4. Responsibility for adequate back-up of its data since its protection or recovery forms no part of the agreement.
5. Responsibility for costs incurred for the safe and insured return of the equipment to Evesham, and subsequent return to the customer. (Collection and return of the equipment can be arranged for a charge by Evesham Technology if required).

[Descenterace]

I've just fished a large lump of dust out of the CPU cooler of an Athlon 1900 laptop. The system was BSODing when installing XP and the case was almost hot enough to burn skin.

First thing we checked was the hard disk. One of my housemates had a faulty hard disk in her gaming machine which was overheating and causing all kinds of problems, so we figured this system had the same problem, but it turned out to be the CPU instead. The cooler (a large lump of metal with a blower offset to one side) seemed to be pumping a little air out the bottom, but blowers are supposed to take in air through the fan...

Removed cooler from case and fan from cooler. Couldn't see daylight through the fins. Gingerly stuck a screwdriver into the airguide and came across a thick mass of dust...
There was a 8mm thick layer of dust across the fins. Since the fins were entirely enclosed, we'd never have found this if we hadn't dismantled the fan assembly. Cleaned off the thermal grease, replaced it with Ceramique, and the system's as good as new.

Sounds like you could have the same problem. The air could be backing up against a wall of crap.

[GodisanAtheist]

Running high end games on a laptop is normal use. Believe it or not, computers are designed to run programs, which is exactly what games are. If a program is more than a computer can handle, then the computer should run the program like crap, not overheat...

Abnormal use would be using the laptop as a coaster or trying to smash a fly with it or something.

To the TC - Sorry if you mentioned this, but have you tried dropping the res/detail ALL the way down?

[StratComm]

I know a little about what goes in to designing computers, and they ARE NOT made to run all programs equally.  There is a degree of general-purposeness to most personal computers, yes, but that doesn't mean they are automatically supposed to be able to run everything you put on them without fault.  I've got a dedicated gaming rig, and I've had the thing overheat when running DOS programs that make use of all of the CPU for extended periods of time.  Modern processors generate more heat per unit area than an efficient hotplate, and that heat is very difficult to remove.

SuperCoolAl: And that's why smaller laptop brands can be a pain.  One could qualify opening the case and looking at/cleaning or perhaps remounting the fan assembly as "routine maintenence" but that's a really gray area.  Call tech support and find out what kind of maintenence they are willing to do that will not void the warrenty; they very well may walk you through it over the phone.

[WMCoolmon]

2GHz for a laptop is not the same as 2GHz for a desktop. The CPU throttling is not there simply to save power. It is there because running the machine at full speed continually causes heat problems.

You're right, the manufacturer does know what's in there. In normal use, the machine should be fine. High-end games on a laptop are not 'normal use'.

Well, if they aren't normal use, they aren't all that uncommon either. Were this laptop just meant to browse the web, do accounting work, etc etc there would be no need for the x700 graphics card. The inclusion of that component in particular marks the laptop as being meant to at least be seen as capable of playing the latest games. (My 6600GT is the equivelant of the desktop x700, and can still play something as new as HL2 in 1280x1024 resolution. I'd expect something as new as Oblivion to still be playable, although I haven't it yet.)

If the manufacturer assembled the laptop and found that the components would overheat in testing, all I can say is that it was a ploy to get people to pay extra cash for hardware that is, in practice, worthless - and they got called on it. Short of modelling or engineering work, there isn't anything besides games that would need as money- and heat- costly as the x700.

[Descenterace]

I can think of a reason they'd include an X700 in a non-gaming machine.

Marketing.