[rcrph]

Are there really any good air-to-air (space-to-space ???) missiles for the aurora or badger.  A little stand-off capability would be nice to have instead of going guns only.

[NGTM-1R]

Missiles in TBP are, unfortunately, something of a joke. Even the supposedly guided ones don't really deserve the title.

[Prophet]

Venom can devastate a tightly packed formation, if you can use it right. Panther is a powerfull long range missle. You just have to launch it from a distance so that the missile has time to home. And from such angle that the target has minimal chance of evading. I don't have that much experience about the other missiles, but they seem failry useful too. Main thing to remember is that you have to deploy your ordanace very carefully. And save them to when you really can use them effectivly.

But in TBP you should be relying mostly on your guns. The missiles are for very specialized tasks. And in the series, Starfurys nearly never carried missiles (possibly 'cause they would add weight to the fighter limiting its manouverability).

[aipz]

Dwin has right whether it goes to Aurora and Badger...
they can't carry homing antifighter missles...
(ok, they have the dumbfires and Badgers do crack ships with Bulldogs nicely, but they don't have a selective missle against single manouverable enemy combatants  )
At least Aurora should be able to take 4 missles similar to Panther
/they could have worse stats to compensate this increase in power/

PS
Other races are ok...so why the humans are weaker (this wouldn't ruin the basic concept of dogfights  )

[Prophet]

Right. Aurora and Badger... What do you mean they are weaker? Its not supposed to be balanced like a board game. How cool would the Shadows be if they would be nerfed so that EA wouldn't be so "weak"?

You can modify the tables to give Aurora a missile equal to Harpoon. There, it's not Babylon 5 anymore, but you got your easy dogfights.

[aipz]

Prophet, you didn't read carefully...
I meant homing antifighter missle only with a tracking system similar to Panther but a bit weaker warhead...
Even if all Auroras had 8 Panthers one Shadow vessel needs to be hit 4 times before it dies...

[Prophet]

I did. But you missed my point. I was not part of the weapon development for TBP. And I am only saying what is my opinion. But carrying missiles is not what fighter combat in B5 universe is about. I can barely stand the fantasy missiles the mod currently has. Yes, they do come in handy, but should only be equipped in special occasions.

Why should the Aurora and Badger carry more firepower? Is it because you want to fire missiles around, because its cool? Or to make combat easy? Or something else?
There is no evidence in the show that such missiles were carried by EA fighters. And you can't argue that "they have the tech, so why not?". Because considering the size of the missiles they would add significant amounts of weight to the fighter. This mass would reduce agility. And since manouverability = life in B5 battles, it seems like a poor tradeoff in real life.
It is not up to me to decide if such weapons be added. It is possible, since there already are certain "liberties" taken to improve gameplay. But until someone gives me a damn good reason why this weapon should be added, I'm standing firmly against it.

[0rph3u5]

Because considering the size of the missiles they would add significant amounts of weight to the fighter. This mass would reduce agility. And since manouverability = life in B5 battles, it seems like a poor tradeoff in real life.

Prophet, we are in space.
the mass of fighter does not affect in manuveur ability unless gravity comes into play... and if you have passed a certain distance to an stellar object you are off its gravity... (basics of astrophysics)

[Wanderer]

Actually mass has very big influence to the fighters manoeverability in space.. Much larger than in atmosphere where aerodynamics are the main issue. Increased mass and equal force cause lower accelerations. Also additional mass in the ship - especially if placed away from the centerpoint of the ships mass - would cause increased structural stress and therefore also limit rotation velocities and accelerations.

[karajorma]

Yep. Inertia is a function of mass not weight. A body has the same inertia regardless of what gravitational conditions it is under.

[aipz]

Why should the Aurora and Badger carry more firepower? Is it because you want to fire missiles around, because its cool? Or to make combat easy? Or something else?
There is no evidence in the show that such missiles were carried by EA fighters. And you can't argue that "they have the tech, so why not?". Because considering the size of the missiles they would add significant amounts of weight to the fighter. This mass would reduce agility. And since manouverability = life in B5 battles, it seems like a poor tradeoff in real life.

Auroras definetly carried missles on some missions
(Thirdspace is a good example - the  fight against Raiders in the opening minutes)...
so the designers must have taken it into consideration when they designed the craft
Of course Auroras aren't behomots with hundreds of missles, but they do have missle carrying capacity!
Small missles would't affect the manouverablity that much;
it would be like 1/20 of the Starfury's mass (1t)
And the additional firepower would be definetly worth a slighter loss of performance...
Besides after firing the missles the craft retains it's full manoverability
EDIT: The fighters must have complex avionics, sensors etc. ( you name it...)
so they could fire such "gifts"

I'm not saying that they should always carry them or they should be their main armament...
/I'm trying not to lose the spirit of TBP here/
But I have several questions to the developers of the Babylon Project:

We have XXIII century - so why can't  Auroras carry guided missles (except of PSI Aurora which can carry Panthers)?
We have only dumbfires...OK, they are good against larger ships/fighter packs, but a single enemy fighter actually always escapes  them   
I accept the fact that in your mod and  the series guns have priority, howewer why would EA completely resign from   precise munitions on their fighters till 2248-2250(Badger enters service during EA-Minbari War)? 

Other races definetly aren't so dogmatic - aside that their missles are way more powerful
(howewer they also don't always utilise them)

What I mean is a missle similar to Panther (fast, needs lock on target, moderate firepower) in quantinities no more then 4 per fighter - in order not to make the fighting too easy for player
IN SHORT: complementary secondary stand-off weapon for certain missions

Uff, lots of writing for one evening
What do you think about it?

[NGTM-1R]

Technically speaking the missiles aren't fantasy either; if anything the dumbfires are the fantasy ones.

[Prophet]

Auroras definetly carried missles on some missions
(Thirdspace is a good example - the  fight against Raiders in the opening minutes)...
so the designers must have taken it into consideration when they designed the craft

I never said they couldn't carry missilies. I saw that movie too.

Small missles would't affect the manouverablity that much;
it would be like 1/20 of the Starfury's mass (1t)
And the additional firepower would be definetly worth a slighter loss of performance...
Besides after firing the missles the craft retains it's full manoverability
EDIT: The fighters must have complex avionics, sensors etc. ( you name it...)
so they could fire such "gifts"

How would a homing missile home in space? With manouvering thrusters. Thats complex stuff and takes lots of space. Then you need the missile to be fast enought to be effective against agile space fighters. And you need somekind of ECCM systems to counter the ECM enemy craft might have. So it's like a Panther with lesser payload but better manouverability. Equally expensive, allmost the same size. But less effective because of the small payload.

Now, since one shot can kill in B5 universe. No pilot in their right mind would do anything to lessen his chance of survival needlessly. So missile armament would only be loaded if it is specificly needed in a mission. The tactical uses for a small low payload missile are... what? Kills fighters, you can do that with your guns. Cheaper, and safer.

We have XXIII century - so why can't  Auroras carry guided missles (except of PSI Aurora which can carry Panthers)?
We have only dumbfires...OK, they are good against larger ships/fighter packs, but a single enemy fighter actually always escapes  them   
I accept the fact that in your mod and  the series guns have priority, howewer why would EA completely resign from   precise munitions on their fighters till 2248-2250(Badger enters service during EA-Minbari War)? 

Thunderbolt is hevier than Aurora, and athmospheric capable. They can successfully attack larger targets in space and on planets surface. In those jobs, I suppose a longrange missile would be useful. Auroras class Starfury is more of a space superiority fighter. And it might wery well be that it isn't even designed to carry computer guided missiles. And the design hasn't been changed because it really doesn't need missiles to do it's job well. And pilots wouldn't want the missiles anyway. And then you have those nasty alien fighters, Minbari for example. Who you can't even target, and you're stuck with a load of missiles you can use.

What I mean is a missle similar to Panther (fast, needs lock on target, moderate firepower) in quantinities no more then 4 per fighter - in order not to make the fighting too easy for player
IN SHORT: complementary secondary stand-off weapon for certain missions

In real life: With those wour missiles you could propably kill off 0-1½ enemy craft (debending on the type of enemy, and if the missiles hit). Should you even get in to a firing position and are capable of gaining a lock on the target before getting killed.
Another thing. Since warships have interceptor to shoot down incoming enemy projectiles, it should be a problem to them to shoot down even slower moving missiles. Yes? Making effectiveness of missiles even more questionable when there are capships around.

In the mod: The fighting is allready (too) easy against AI fighters. An improved version of the anti-subsystem Venom would be a better idea. But I belive we should avoid getting too far from the universe. If it wasn't seen in the show, it better have a damn good reason be included.
And when did wee see missiles on fighters? Thirdspace, and Crusade. Thats on two occasions. First being the dumbfire supression missile. The second being planetary bombardment by Thunderbolts (I guess Panther has it's origins there). That tells me that, like in FS universe they use ridiculous amounts of missiles, in B5 universe they nearly never carry them.

[Trivial Psychic]

In B5 S2 "And Now For A Word", there's a point when you're riding in the gun-camera of a Starfury which is targetting Narn transports causing trouble.  IIRC, it fires a missile (requiring a lock) from an Aurora.  Also, we saw missiles during some of the Drakh engagements in Crusade (though the CGI was pretty crappy).  One hit a Drakh raider and took it out (no indication of whether it was dammaged before the hit though).

[starfox]

You will also see Thunderbolts firing missiles in "severed dreams"
It happens right after the EAS Alexander intercepts the orders from Earthforce Command...

[Prophet]

In B5 S2 "And Now For A Word", there's a point when you're riding in the gun-camera of a Starfury which is targetting Narn transports causing trouble.  IIRC, it fires a missile (requiring a lock) from an Aurora.

Look again. The starfury fired it's pulse cannons at the Narn target. He was getting a lock at the engines. They do have to get a target lock to shoot accuratley, that's why Earth sucked against the Minbari.

And yes the Severed Dreams slipped from my mind. And Crusade CGI should be approached with extreme caution (starfurys in athmosphere in the first episode?).