[Kosh]

http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=84


If it does then I might actually go to Linux......

[IceFire]

I think of people will.  more will be left scratching their heads as to what just happened.  This is bull**** really.

[Turambar]

yay for crackers

also for people who crack these things

[WMCoolmon]

MS is pushing the limits to see how far they can go. No surprise, really.

[Mars]

Well Google is starting out on Microsoft's turf  with some of their Office Applications, and Microsoft knows they can't compete, I guess they're trying to see how big their captive audience is.

[pecenipicek]

i have installed this piece of **** not so long ago via microsoft update, cause it didnt let me download updates anymore... i wouldnt have anything against this actually if it ran once to check if the windows are genuine, and then promptly delete itself, but noooo, every time i start my PC bitdefender informs me it blocked wgatray.exe from accesing the internet.

[Fury]

It's a shame how much problems WGA causes, I wouldn't really care as long as it works and does not cause problems, but this does not seem to be the case.

If it does then I might actually go to Linux......

As for switching to linux, that is quite a laughable idea. Linux rocks in precisely two environments; server and embedded. In those two environments Windows sucks. In desktop, workstation and notebook environments linux sucks. I have to add that its not entirely linux's fault however, the biggest problem are hardware drivers. Linux is not common enough in above mentioned environments for many manufacturers to really care about their linux drivers, they just offer some drivers to shut people up. And even then many drivers are properietary which is a curseword in linux world and are not even included with majority of the distros. In such cases third party drivers are used, which are usually crap. The best example of this are video card drivers, without proprietary drivers from the hardware manufacturer you could as well be using some 10 year old integrated crap instead of your monster video card. Of video cards, ATIs cards cause so much headache that you better get an NVIDIA card if you want at least relatively trouble-free installation and initial configuration. But then again, what would you use an ATI or NVIDIA card for if you can't even play 98% of the games?

That and the fact that there are half a dozen common linux distributions and a dozen not-so-common distributions which have enough differences to make hardware manufacturers to spit on them. There is only player in town that hardware manufacturers would take seriously and that is OS X. But what are the chances that Apple lets people to ever install OS X on PC's legally? Very slim. Want to get rid of Windows permanently? Do yourself a favor and get a Mac, linux is a pain especially when video cards are concerned.

[pecenipicek]

It's a shame how much problems WGA causes, I wouldn't really care as long as it works and does not cause problems, but this does not seem to be the case.

If it does then I might actually go to Linux......

As for switching to linux, that is quite a laughable idea. Linux rocks in precisely two environments; server and embedded. In those two environments Windows sucks. In desktop, workstation and notebook environments linux sucks. I have to add that its not entirely linux's fault however, the biggest problem are hardware drivers. Linux is not common enough in above mentioned environments for many manufacturers to really care about their linux drivers, they just offer some drivers to shut people up. And even then many drivers are properietary which is a curseword in linux world and are not even included with majority of the distros. In such cases third party drivers are used, which are usually crap. The best example of this are video card drivers, without proprietary drivers from the hardware manufacturer you could as well be using some 10 year old integrated crap instead of your monster video card. Of video cards, ATIs cards cause so much headache that you better get an NVIDIA card if you want at least relatively trouble-free installation and initial configuration. But then again, what would you use an ATI or NVIDIA card for if you can't even play 98% of the games?

That and the fact that there are half a dozen common linux distributions and a dozen not-so-common distributions which have enough differences to make hardware manufacturers to spit on them. There is only player in town that hardware manufacturers would take seriously and that is OS X. But what are the chances that Apple lets people to ever install OS X on PC's legally? Very slim. Want to get rid of Windows permanently? Do yourself a favor and get a Mac, linux is a pain especially when video cards are concerned.

i second this man.

its all fine and dandy, but it doesnt do what i want it to do, unlike windows, which sometimes actually does what i ask of it.

[SadisticSid]

Fury, the hardware argument against Linux skirts around the real, and ONLY issue - that maybe 1% of commercial x86 applications will run on it. Hardware support would be much, much better if a sizeable portion of the market would use it. But they don't, because Linux runs almost no programs at all. Everyone develops for Windows because everyone uses Windows. It's a catch 22 of course, but it's the root of all Linux's problems. If a good number of games ran on Linux, for example, then the card manufacturers would write proper drivers for it.

[aldo_14]

As an aside, I'd be curious as to what overall percentage of PCs - home and business - actually are used to run stuff beyond a web browser and office-type application.

[vyper]

Hang the **** on. To do this they'd need to install additional software components to check for WGA in the first place. The simple solution is to avoid installing these additional components - and if M$ try and sneak them out without telling you, the EU will probably ass-rape them for it.

[Fury]

Hardware support would be much, much better if a sizeable portion of the market would use it. But they don't, because Linux runs almost no programs at all. Everyone develops for Windows because everyone uses Windows.

It is really an unbroken loop. It is almost impossible to break the loop, as you need all of the following conditions.
1) Better hardware driver support. Won't happen because of lack of commercial requirement.
2) Better commercial software support, such as CAD softwares and games for linux. Won't happen because of poor driver support.
3) Wider adoption, won't happen because of the previous two conditions.

And last but not least, the biggest obstacle in commercial adoption of linux.
4) Each linux distro is more or less different, hardware and software would be needed to be tested thoroughly on no less than five different distros to gain marketshare in the linux world.

This is also the reason why linux has gained marketshare in server and embedded environments. Servers are always qualified only for one or two linux distros at most. In embedded the hardware changes even less than in server environment. Sure there is the LSB, but it is far from perfect and so far has not really helped much.

OS X would have much better chances to rival Windows in desktop, workstation and notebook environments than linux ever would. But as said, OS X will most likely only install on Macs (legally).

[übermetroid]

I'm waiting for google OS. 

[Kazan]

the "no software runs on linux!" argument is even more retarded than the "no driver support"

Name me a piece of software and I will name you it's OSS replacement (Which is often superior)


I use linux as a desktop every day at work, I have a computer at home that runs linux 100% of the time and is my multimedia system driving my TV, recording my shows, etc.

my fiancee (a technonewblet) ran nothing but linux for 9 months straight - reinstalled windows just for running everquest (wine cannot *quite* run it - but very close)

yes, don't forget WINE - most of your "ZOMG! gotta have this application! it doesn't run on linux!" things run in wine, including many games

PS: making your ATI card work on linux is laughably trivial.  I have less problems getting my card working on Fedora Core 5 than I do on windows

compare:

Windows Install
spend 1 hour in the ugly windows installer
tolerate 640x480 while on the internet to get driver
navigate to ATI's website
download the appropriate driver
restart the machine
pray it worked
spend 12 hours installing other software I need

Fedora Core Install
spend 20 minutes in the beautiful Fedore Core Anaconda Installer
have full 32bit whatever res I want when I reboot already (generic OSS ati driver)
run two commands to setup FedoraFaq repositories
yum install fglrx
log out, log back in
(already have all the software I need)

[Kazan]

as for windows


They are a dieing operating system, we should let them pass.

[Fury]

Linux's support is defined by commercial use by businesses, not home users. Hardware and software makers do not get their money from home users, they get majority of their revenues from businesses.

Name me a piece of software and I will name you it's OSS replacement (Which is often superior)

Businesses don't use open-source, open-source is not trusted and is unreliable. And unreliability comes from the fact that the software is free, it does not bring food to the table and the programmer is free to quit programming it anytime. There is no true guarantee of technical support.

I don't know if there is any comparable open-source software to AutoCAD for example. But guess twice if businesses will buy AutoCAD or download open-source alternative. They will go with AutoCAD.

yes, don't forget WINE - most of your "ZOMG! gotta have this application! it doesn't run on linux!" things run in wine, including many games

"Maybe it works, maybe not" is not what businesses want to hear. Any emulator is unreliable.

PS: making your ATI card work on linux is laughably trivial.  I have less problems getting my card working on Fedora Core 5 than I do on windows

I have an ATI card. After installing FC5, installation went fine and post-installation configuration as well. However, where login screen was supposed to be, there was black screen instead. (K)Ubuntu graphical installer presents a black screen as well, I can get Ubuntu installed if I use text mode installer. After installation there is again black screen where login is supposed to be. I can install fglrx drivers when I boot Ubuntu into recovery mode, after that it works. Later I decided to give FC5 a new chance, this time around FC5 installer wouldn't even start, not even text mode installer. Re-burning the image did no good.

Every distro that has a graphical installer reeks of poor quality. Of the most popular distros only SuSE worked out-of-the-box without black screens and driver installations, sadly hardware video acceleration did not work and graphics were slow. Majority of the other distros will give a black screen either already during installation or when you're supposed to login for the first time. FC was the worst, the installer did not even start up the second time.


The bottom line is that open-source community is unreliable, businesses do not trust in anything that has not been made by another commercial business. I think it is called capitalism.

Edit: Business critical servers always run either Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL) or Windows Server. RHEL is backed by Red Hat as a company, Red Hat supports their product.

[IPAndrews]

Fury and M$ sitting in a tree. K-I-S-S-I-N-G. Okay that was very childish but what else do you expect from me. To be perfectly honest Microsoft do have the right to prevent unauthorised use of their software. Also what they are planning does not prevent you using an out of the box copy of Windows and running it. So really I fail to see what all the fuss is about. You want to make use of their free update service, you pay for their operating system. I'd say that's more than fair.

[Mefustae]

I'm waiting for google OS. 

QFT

[Fury]

So really I fail to see what all the fuss is about.

I think the problem here was that WGA is causing (technical) problems to even those who use legal copies. Other than that, WGA is fine, pirates don't have a say.

I'm waiting for google OS. 

QFT

Yay, another linux distro? Don't you think we already have more than enough of them? In fact, besides of Apple coming to PC market with OS X, the best change of linux ever succeeding in workstation/desktop market is Red Hat coming with a desktop version of their RHEL. At the moment that is Fedora Core, but since its not supported by Red Hat, it's good for nothing. What linux needs is the distro, not yet another distro.

[Kosh]

It's a shame how much problems WGA causes, I wouldn't really care as long as it works and does not cause problems, but this does not seem to be the case.

"Anti Piracy" schemes like this usually only hurt paying customers, as pirates usually have a way around it.

As for switching to linux, that is quite a laughable idea.

Then again if my perfectly legitimate copy of Windows on my laptop does get broken what do I have to lose?

The issue with Linux not being run on many desktops does have quite a lot to do with the anti-competative, monopolistic practices of M$.