[Bobboau]

discuss..

[Sandwich]

"...one nation, under God, indivisible..."

That is all I have to say. Take it as you will.

[Turambar]

thats it, i think im gonna move.
it really isnt safe here anymore

[redmenace]

Free speech. Regaurdless of it being in bad taste. But if flag burning is legal (I assume you thinks thats ok), then I am not sure why you would take offense to this.

[Unknown Target]

I see it as a protest.
And Sandwich, for the record - that "Under God" line was added in the 1950s to distinguish us from the "Godless Communists" - it wasn't in the original pledge.

[Bobboau]

I didn't say it was or should be illigal, nor did anyone else, actualy I didn't say anything realy, though I don't realy think I need to, my opionion is known.

[redmenace]

Sorry, that was directed at Turambar.

[Turambar]

theyre completely within their rights to do it,  no question about that.  i just wonder where they are, so that i can not be near them.  (and they'd wonder the same as me if they had a photo of me at one of my bi-weekly flag torchings)   




no, i dont burn a flag twice a week, but if i did, i'd burn everyone's flag, in alphabetical order, to show my contempt for the concept of nations

[Goober5000]

Maybe if America actually behaved like a Christian nation, that might be appropriate...

[redmenace]

theyre completely within their rights to do it,  no question about that.  i just wonder where they are, so that i can not be near them.  (and they'd wonder the same as me if they had a photo of me at one of my bi-weekly flag torchings)  

no, i dont burn a flag twice a week, but if i did, i'd burn everyone's flag, in alphabetical order, to show my contempt for the concept of nations

I was trying to prove a point though, I think you got it though. The main idea I was trying to communicate is that others might find flag burning to be in bad taste, just like some one else might think that the Statue of Liberty holding a cross is in bad taste as well. Point is show a little bit of respect towards one another.

[achtung]

Maybe if America actually behaved like a Christian nation, that might be appropriate...

We're not purely a Christian nation to begin with, there are lots of other folks here you know.

[Bobboau]

that immage may fill my little heart with malice, but it never crosses my mind to try and get a law passed makeing that activity banned and made illigal, I think that makes me a good American

[Nuclear1]

I really don't find anything truly horrible about this. I do a lot of driving down in the southern half of Indiana, and it seems that every house I pass on the way has a flag and a cross in the yard.

If people are allowed to burn flags and make posters that make Bush look like Hitler, I think a group of Christians should be allowed to use this as a symbol for their beliefs. Where was this picture taken anyway? If it's somewhere rural and in some out-of-the-way church courtyard, especially in the more conservative areas of the country, there's not really a whole lot wrong with it.

[Mefustae]

Maybe if America actually behaved like a Christian nation, that might be appropriate...

qft.

[Rictor]

Oh God, it's not that Christo guy again, is it?

This level of debate, and I don't mean here but rather the "statement" presented by the picture, far from being all sophisticated and intelligent, is not worthy of a five year old. Pretentious assholes.

[Kazan]

"...one nation, under God, indivisible..."

That is all I have to say. Take it as you will.

yes. the pledge violates the constitution and should be restored to it's original form - which didn't have "under god" - those were added in 1954

the original version, written by a minister, lacked those words - however he had considered them - he felt them INAPPROPRIATE for the pledge of allegience since the united states had the seperation of church and state

[Kazan]

Maybe if America actually behaved like was a Christian nation, that might be appropriate...

but it isn't one, it's a secular state that is being coopted by theocratic totalitarians in alliance with corporatists

[aldo_14]

Maybe if America actually behaved like a Christian nation, that might be appropriate...

Well, they're busy killing Muslims in the Middle East, howzat?

[redmenace]

Maybe if America actually behaved like was a Christian nation, that might be appropriate...

but it isn't one, it's a secular state that is being coopted by theocratic totalitarians in alliance with corporatists

Funny, the people you want to criticize say pretty much the same thing about athiests etc. And for proof they point to forcing of boyscouts off of military bases etc.

[Kazan]

touche aldo

oh btw christian supremacists who think "under god" belongs in our pledge - let's subject it to the lemon test

does the insertion of "under god" into the pledge fit the following three critereon

   1. The government's action must have a legitimate secular purpose;
   2. The government's action must not have the primary effect of either advancing or inhibiting religion; and
   3. The government's action must not result in an "excessive entanglement" of the government and religion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_test#The_.22Lemon_test.22

Fails 1 - "under god" is explicitly religious, impossible to have a secular purpose
Fails 2 - saying that the nation is under god patently advances religion
Fails 3 - "under god" is government forwarding religion (we know by implication it is christianity), this is entangling government and religion especially since little children are often forced to participate in displays of reciting the pledge [even if they're allowed to be silent they are there in the presence of agents of the government promoting religion]


then by the established supreme court standards for whether or not something violates the establishment and free exercise clauses "under god" in the pledge is in violation of the 1st Amendment to the US Consitution