Author Topic: Athena Improved!  (Read 9024 times)

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Offline TrashMan

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I just need to add pilots and it will be done.
Note that it's not a complete higher-poly Athena copy, it has a several subtle differences (which made mapping it more difficult), like for instance a added missile launcher on it's belly (which is not textured as a missile launcher to keep it compatible with the standard Athena) or longer upper gun pod.

I plan to edit the textures and create another, meaner version.
But all in do time...

Erm..where can I find the pilot models?
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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KARAJORMA !!!!!!!!!1

Help :nervous:

 

Offline Col. Fishguts

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Offline TrashMan

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thanks.. I'll have the Athena up and running very soon :D

ERm... on a unrelated note, if anyone has hte Perseus Advanced model, can he plase send the perpod.pcx?
It appears I lost it in the chrash and can'd find it anywhere. Needless to say that it isn't in the shipPack.rar for my campaign, but since the ship doesn't appear in the demo it's no biggie....

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Offline Freespace Freak

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No offense, Trashman, but your spelling is seriously trash, man.   :lol:

Good model, though.  :yes:

 
What's this belly bay look like?

 

Offline Mefustae

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Are the differences you've made in any way performance related, or are they entirely aesthetic?

 

Offline TrashMan

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I hit a snag.
When I try to convert it I get a stack overflow error (too many polys in the same location).
Now I did some testing and the Athena model converts normaly w/o the cockpit. I can't understand what's wrong with the cockpit itself so I'll probably make a new one.
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Too many Polys total?  :confused:

 

Offline Vasudan Admiral

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Why does no one check the wiki about this sorta thing? :(

http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/POF_Constructor_Suite

Quote
If PCS gives a "Too many polygons in same average location!" error, it can mean one (or both) of two things. Either there is a duplicate of one of the objects in the SCN in the EXACT same position as another of the EXACT same shape and size, or your object is too small in TS for PCS to be able to clearly tell the difference between two polygon locations during conversion. (This is a common problem for fighters and bombers because of how small they will appear in TS in order to fit the standard conversion ratio of 20 FS meters to each TS meter.)
To fix the first problem, find the duplicate object and delete or move it. To fix the second, scale the whole ship up in TrueSpace to the size you want it to appear as in Freespace - meter for meter. Then, before converting, set PCS's scaling to 1 rather than 20 and convert.
This should fix it by effectively giving PCS more accuracy when it gets to really small numbers. The up-scaling of your model is counteracted by telling PCS that one TrueSpace meter should equal one Freespace meter, so you don't end up with cruiser sized fighters and the like.
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Offline TrashMan

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It ain't the cockpit.
I think the duplicate object might be the culprit - detail 1 is actualy a copy of detail 0 but wo the cockpit.
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Offline TrashMan

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Well now I'm completely stumped... get this:

The model converts normally
The cockpit converts normally

Model + cockpit + Insignia  (detail0) converts normally

With debris it gives the stack overflow (conversion scale set to 1, size of ship in TS is 21 units)

With other lods it gives stack overflow

Methinks there might be something wrong with .scn conversion in 1.3.6.

Now I allways use the same model for 2 LOD's - detail1 is without turrets (if it has any)
In this case it's just detail0 without the cockpit and non-transparent glass.
Detail 2 and 3 are original athena models (re-named and without thrusters)


Now I've tried everything - deleting detail1 and moving 2&3 up a notch, scaling and moving detail1...but nothing works.

I have converted both Athena version, but ONLY LOD0...wihtout debris..and it's killing me!
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Offline Kazan

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bad geometry in your debris.. not suprising realy
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Offline TrashMan

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bad geometry in your debris.. not suprising realy

Actually I used debris from the [V] model..

And it won't convert properly even without it.

It's like it refuses to convert the scene/object if there are lower lods present.. LOL
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Offline Vasudan Admiral

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Nothing's wrong with the scn conversion - if it crashes with debris/lods but does not without, then it's a problem with the debris/lods for sure.
I'd suggest you should make better debris anyway - I always hated it how when a ship is destroyed, 80-90% of the hull just vapourises without a trace, and the athena's debris is no exception. ;)

The best way to do that is to take the original [V] model and begin separating chunks of it, filling the holes in with polys and giving them a debris texture. Glue a light to each new piece and name them debris01 onwards, and you've got the entire ships mass still present in the debris.

We do still need the debris' survivability increased though, since a lot of it still just explodes as soon as it spawns. :\

Back on topic, have you tried things like doing a final triangulation of the entire model before conversion? What's your hierarchy look like?
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Offline TrashMan

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Yes I tried triangulating and yes I know how to make debris.
My hierarchy for the scn file is the following:
detail0
+insgLOD00
+cockpit
detail1
+insgLOD01
detail2
detail3


EDIT - correct hierarchy (as seen in TreeView for hte .scn)

detail0
+InsgLOD00
   ---InsgLOD00
   ---H_InsgLOD00
+cockpit
    --cockpit
    --H_cockpit
-athenahull
-H_detail0

detail1
+InsgLOD01
   ---InsgLOD01
   ---H_InsgLOD01
-Athenahull2
-H_detail1

detail2
-hullb
-H_detail2

detail3
-hull3
-H_detail3
« Last Edit: September 14, 2006, 07:05:17 am by TrashMan »
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Shouldnt LOD0 be the root?  :confused:

 

Offline Vasudan Admiral

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CD's right there - see what happens if you make details 1, 2 and 3 children of detail 0.
If that doesn't help, next try removing the insignias to see if they might be intefering with the LODs in any way during PCS' autogen.

Yes I tried triangulating and yes I know how to make debris.
Never doubted it - but in this case you used debris that you did not make, the geometry of which you may, therefore, not be totally familier with - meaning whether or not you know how to make debris is irrellevant. :p
Besides, I've never seen any of your models with full hull mass debris, which was why I pointed it out in the first place, since it's just a cool thing to do. ;)

Also, I was pointing out the final triangulation not because I didn't think you knew about it, but simply because I've had one or two models that wouldn't convert at all until I made a final triangulation. Even though the total polycount did not change, the models converted fine afterwards. Still haven't figured out why.

Another thing that somehow occasionally helps otherwise inexplicable crashes is to completely collapse your hierarchy down to detail0, select a light or something else in the scene, re-select detail0, and then save as a .SCN - give that a go too.
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Offline TrashMan

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Ups...a mistake..

You see I wan't typing the above message, rather a friend of mine was and he wasn't listening very carefully either (I posted that while I visited him at work).

The hierarchy is correct - I found the problem. It was the PCS.

I tried converting with the PCS-facet verion and it goes off without a hitch. To test it I tried converting various combinations and the same models PCS 1.3.6. failed to convert several times in a row. It coverted EVERYTIHING I threw at it.

Needless to say that now I'm finally done.
I'm uploading the Athenas to HC as I type this...
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Offline asyikarea51

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Me likes it lots.  :nod: :yes: :D

But I like the alternate blue texture more... :lol:

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