Author Topic: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck  (Read 8732 times)

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Offline Sandwich

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"Exposed", by Glenn Beck
http://www.youtube.com/v/3PWIK8YTZS8

It's long (~45 mins), and hard-hitting. And it's about time.
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"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill

 

Offline Bobboau

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
you know everyone who comes into this is going to have there minds made up already, they are either going to come in thinking there is a violent movement in Islam that threatens the world or they are going to think anyone who thinks that is a nut who will do what ever they can (including making movies full of BS) to try and prove there obviously stupid point of view (I'm not saying this BTW).

no bodies going to even consider anything that is said in that movie unless they are members of the choir already, in which case they will believe every single assertion made.
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Offline Mefustae

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Could you sum it up for us, Sarno? Don't have the available time to watch it.

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
* ngtm1r is tempted to post his essay on the subject...
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Offline Herra Tohtori

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Could you sum it up for us, Sarno? Don't have the available time to watch it.

Here goes. In five sentences, is that condensed enough?


1. There is a lot of hate-mongering against western world and specifically against Jewish people and USA going on in many islamic nations.

2. This is a wide-spread phenomenon induced by both religious authorities and even heads of states, and it is spread by non-independent media, which also explains why the people often buy it - they have never actually had independent media telling stuff to them, so they have weak skills in telling the fact from fiction.

3. Western world media has not yet revealed the extent of the hate-mongering going on there, but now Glenn Beck, who is NOT a journalist, has come forth to tell all the people his opinions on what is really going on in Middle East.

4. Luckily, there are also muslims who condemn the hate-mongering, terrorist actions and stuff like that.

5. The Western world needs to understand the extent of hate-mongering and act accordingly to prevent a genocide and the rise of Islamic World Order, and the most important thing to do right now would seem to be to prevent Iran from aquiring nuclear weapons technology.
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Offline Shade

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Well, I agree with 1, 2, 4 and 5. 3, I dunno... guessing that's just some self-pimpage by the author :p

I think the real problem lies in #1 and 2 though. I honestly don't think that the muslim world in general hates the west - Most of them don't know the west, so how could they hate it - But they're being led to believe a lot of wrong things by their leaders who stand to profit politically by appearing to fight some evil western empire. Those muslims who actually live in the western world, and thus know what it's like, tend to like it there.

Iran might be the exception though. I get the distinct impression that their religious leaders genuinely believe they're doing the work of god, and aren't just trying to profit from hatemongering. Which is an unpleasant thought.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Well, I agree with 1, 2, 4 and 5. 3, I dunno... guessing that's just some self-pimpage by the author :p

I think the real problem lies in #1 and 2 though. I honestly don't think that the muslim world in general hates the west - Most of them don't know the west, so how could they hate it

It's easier to hate someone you don't know. Don't have to acknowledge their humanity or anything nasty like that.
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Offline Scuddie

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
It's easy to play the victim.  Fact is, there is just as much hate mongering from Western civilization and Jewish people toward Islamic nations.  Likely the vast majority comes from Israel.
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Offline Nuclear1

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
It's easy to play the victim.  Fact is, there is just as much hate mongering from Western civilization and Jewish people toward Islamic nations.  Likely the vast majority comes from Israel.

Not that I'm justifying hate-mongering or saying there isn't another side, but the slaughter of their Olympic team, very little international support outside of the US, the attempted annihilation of their nation, and promises by prominent Middle Eastern leaders to wipe them off the face of the Earth will do that to a people.
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Offline Mr. Vega

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
I'm not going to trust CNN on a subject as sensitive as this.
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Offline IceFire

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
I'm not going to trust CNN on a subject as sensitive as this.
Nor should you...watch them and see what they say, watch the BBC and see what they say, watch whatever newscasts you can and try and weave a line in between all of the rhetoric.
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Offline Roanoke

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
I'd say it's more American media than Western media. This kinda thing just isn't shown on American TV, but over here (in the UK anyways) we see it alot.

 

Offline Bobboau

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
what?
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Offline IceFire

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
what?
He's saying that your media is overly conservative and doesn't bother to post controversial documentaries. Well I'm saying that. Its largely true.  Unless the controversy is over some hollywood star.  I haven't seen any good American documentary programs on TV for a while....sometimes Frontline does a good job on PBS but not like the 5th Estate or some of the stuff they broadcast in the UK through the BBC.
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Offline Bobboau

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
it sounded like he was saying the opposite of that...
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Offline Sandwich

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
It's easy to play the victim.  Fact is, there is just as much hate mongering from Western civilization and Jewish people toward Islamic nations.  Likely the vast majority comes from Israel.

"Hate mongering"? Is that why we (we = Israel, FYI) have Arab and Muslim cabinet ministers? Sir, you speak of which you do not know.
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Islam's problem is that the Qu'ran actually specifically charges people to take up arms and expand, or defend, their surzeainty. The collected sayings of the Prophet include one that states "He who dies without participating in a campaign dies in a kind of unbelief."

Islam's days of waging offensive war are over; they ended with the defeat of the second siege of Vienna. Arguably they ended even well before that with the beginning of the Reconquista in Spain, or the Normans retaking Sciliy. But the religion suffers from a crisis of faith now. When they were young, their rightness of purpose was assured by their victories, their power, wealth, accomplisments, influence. Truly they were God's chosen, for His favor was clearly upon them.

Then Europe resurged. The Spanish retook their country. The Normans retook Sciliy. The first siege of Vienna was broken. The second siege of Vienna ended in a rout. Cracks appeared in the monolith that Mohammed's faith was meant to be. But is was still strong, still capable, or so it appeared. The Ottoman Empire, heirs to the Caliphate if anyone was, was still regarded as a major power.

Then came WWI, and everything changed. The Faithful fractured, their empire divided, the Christians, for Islam has difficulty understanding that the term "Christendom" has lost its meaning, triumphant. And they remain divided, weak, bereft of leadership and the power they fought so long and so fiercely to gain slipping from their grasp with ever-increasing speed.

Islam remembers a time when it was strong, when it ruled vast tracts of Russia, when its armies were the terror of Europe, when it was the premier power of the world. God was with them then.

Now, He seems to have deserted them. And they percieve that as clearly as they once did their own strength.
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Offline Sandwich

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
*sniffle* That was.... *sniff* ...almost touching. :) Where'd you learn to write?
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Myself, mostly. And reading a variety of books ranging from Bernard Lewis' commentary on Islam and the West to Official History of United States Naval Operations in World War II.

This is my "scholarly" writing mode. I paraphrased a paper I wrote earlier this semester. I didn't want to post my whole essay on the subject, making you read 5 and 1/3 pages would be a little cruel.
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Offline Flipside

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Well, there are a few Psalms out there that speak of God giving strength for War and teaching Fingers to Fight (Thank you Medieval Total War 2) but the thing is, both Holy Books contain verses about love, respect and tolerance as much as Fire, Death and Subjugation, that's why I don't trust either. Never trust a God small enough to fit into a Book, that's my motto ;)

Thing is, it's easy to feel benevolent when you are well off, and easy to justify atrocities if you think it will make you better off. That's where the Second crusades came from (The first were partly defensive and partly deliberate misinterpretation of the Pope's decree).

Propaganda in general is disgusting to see, remember Saddam's 'Baby Factories'?

The problem is, bombing and shelling them isn't stopping that Propoganda, it is helping to support it, I can't remember who said it, but the enemy isn't Islam, it's not Al Quaeda, it's not Terror, it's ignorance, and you can't shoot ignorance, it needs the International equivalent of keyhole surgery, not a chainsaw.