[Desert Tyrant]

Covenant are cool. They control the Halos which are far more powerful than the Death Star, the Death Star II, the Galaxy Gun, the World Devastators OR the Sun Crusher.

The Empire sucks. Come on, those 'elite troops' Palpatine sends down to the shield generator in ROTJ are defeated by primitives who throw rocks and stones.

Oh, and a few Elites could probably kill every Stormtrooper on the Death Star (I mean how can a smuggler, a desert rat, an old guy, a princess and two droids stand up to 1,000,000 stormtroopers? Huh?).

Dark Troopers, son.  Let's see:
12 of the Phase two-ers slaughtered an ENTIRE rebel base.  A SINGLE DTP.2 nearly killed the entile of a Mon Calmari crusier. Phase threes are walking tanks.  In short, the Dark Troopers actually restored my faith in Imperial ground forces.

[brozozo]

Too bad Kyle Katarn had something to say about that.

[Desert Tyrant]

Too bad Kyle Katarn had something to say about that.

D'oh!  I forgot about that![inpresonation=Vader] NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!
But, seriously, Dark Troopers probley still could utterly whoop the asses of most of the Covenate army(I want to see a duel between Phase III's and HUnters

[Sarafan]

I didnt even read all this but whatever , the Empire wins for sure, the Covenant are not even ''evil'' IMO.

[Flipside]

I'm still fighting the urge to add Snuffleupagus

Seriously though, it's hard to say, if you put the whole 'tech-blurb' to one side, the Covenant excel at groud assault, the Empire rely far more heavily on space-based systems.

Thing is, if you look at the Empire as having been beaten by 'An old guy, 2 droids a kid and a smuggler', then you are looking at it as a movie, in which case you could say that the Covenant can be beaten by a 14 year kid who wouldn't even have to stand up to do it, after all, it's a computer game.

In 'reality' the Clone Troopers were far more dangerous than depicted, mainly because they were totally loyal, that was how they were designed. Just as the Covenant of the Cutscenes in Halo are 'different' from the ones you face in-game

It's all really academic anyway, two totally different universes and all, but still interesting to think about

[Desert Tyrant]

I'm still fighting the urge to add Snuffleupagus

Seriously though, it's hard to say, if you put the whole 'tech-blurb' to one side, the Covenant excel at groud assault, the Empire rely far more heavily on space-based systems.

Thing is, if you look at the Empire as having been beaten by 'An old guy, 2 droids a kid and a smuggler', then you are looking at it as a movie, in which case you could say that the Covenant can be beaten by a 14 year kid who wouldn't even have to stand up to do it, after all, it's a computer game.

In 'reality' the Clone Troopers were far more dangerous than depicted, mainly because they were totally loyal, that was how they were designed. Just as the Covenant of the Cutscenes in Halo are 'different' from the ones you face in-game

It's all really academic anyway, two totally different universes and all, but still interesting to think about

Indeed

[Polpolion]

Wow, this got bumped and not one person complained until now?

[Deepblue]

The Covenant certainly has far more inspired ship design.

[BS403]

...You-Tube, ...

LOL

[redsniper]

The Covenant certainly has far more inspired ship design.

Because Star Destroyers were soooooo old hat in 1977.

[NGTM-1R]

The Covenant certainly has far more inspired ship design.

Conversely, an Imperial Star Destroyer has a far more rational design, particularly if given an assault role.

[Flipside]

I actually like the 'function over form' design of Star Destroyers to be honest, those sloped sides give the widest possible firing arc for the entire front hemisphere guns, at the cost of making it a large, poorly defended target from the back. There was never a moments doubt what this ship was designed to do

[Desert Tyrant]

The Covenant certainly has far more inspired ship design.

And yet , arent really anygood against an enemy with ADVANCED weapons. NEXT!

[Desert Tyrant]

I actually like the 'function over form' design of Star Destroyers to be honest, those sloped sides give the widest possible firing arc for the entire front hemisphere guns, at the cost of making it a large, poorly defended target from the back. There was never a moments doubt what this ship was designed to do

Imperial classes still IMO look better than Covnate ships

[JGZinv]

Ah being an old SW junkie I'll make thee comments...

1. The clone troopers as seen in Ep 1-3 (evil razzlefrazzin GL)
did have independent minds of their own and sought to have
some individualistic character to themselves. My evidence?
Thrawn Trilogy and the other books containing sleeper cells
of clone troopers.

2. A lot of this would have to depend on what point of the Empire's
timeline you are picking as the point they would go up against the Covanent...
At one time, yes, they did have multiple SSD command ships as well as numerous
other defense platforms, 3 Dstars (creation ability), the other Sun Crusher-esque ships.
The Eye of Palpatine, and numerous smaller vessels, not to mention alien plagues meant
to wipe out entire races.

But - most of this was not ready all at once, it was built in secret over time. Plus you have to factor
in that the Rebel Alliance did break them apart with the simple loss of Palpatine. Then spent the next
10 years cleaning up the warlords and portions of the Imperial Remnant before the truce. The Galactic
Alliance did have a sizable navy at the start of the NJO, including new Calamari Cruisers that could
rival SSD's due to the upgrades (if I remember that right). They also had at minimum, 3 captured SSDs...
The Guardian, Lusankya, and one other - which I'm thinking was part of the Black Fleet or something.
Might have to check the technical commentaries at the Force.net and the Wiki...

3. As to ground forces, I'd be willing to say the Covenant would likely win on the ground in
hand to hand or because of their walker units. The hand to hand though you'd just end up with
more stormtroopers dead per 1 elite. However, what's the Empire known to do... much less the Sith
before them? Bombard a planet from space until it's no longer inhabitable... But to invade a planet, you have
to control the space around it - otherwise you will be slowly cut off from support and eliminated. The same goes
for supply routes/hyperspace routes and planetary trade/manufacturing.

But there's my EU ten cents worth on the matter...

[Desert Tyrant]

Ah being an old SW junkie I'll make thee comments...

1. The clone troopers as seen in Ep 1-3 (evil razzlefrazzin GL)
did have independent minds of their own and sought to have
some individualistic character to themselves. My evidence?
Thrawn Trilogy and the other books containing sleeper cells
of clone troopers.

2. A lot of this would have to depend on what point of the Empire's
timeline you are picking as the point they would go up against the Covanent...
At one time, yes, they did have multiple SSD command ships as well as numerous
other defense platforms, 3 Dstars (creation ability), the other Sun Crusher-esque ships.
The Eye of Palpatine, and numerous smaller vessels, not to mention alien plagues meant
to wipe out entire races.

But - most of this was not ready all at once, it was built in secret over time. Plus you have to factor
in that the Rebel Alliance did break them apart with the simple loss of Palpatine. Then spent the next
10 years cleaning up the warlords and portions of the Imperial Remnant before the truce. The Galactic
Alliance did have a sizable navy at the start of the NJO, including new Calamari Cruisers that could
rival SSD's due to the upgrades (if I remember that right). They also had at minimum, 3 captured SSDs...
The Guardian, Lusankya, and one other - which I'm thinking was part of the Black Fleet or something.
Might have to check the technical commentaries at the Force.net and the Wiki...

3. As to ground forces, I'd be willing to say the Covenant would likely win on the ground in
hand to hand or because of their walker units. The hand to hand though you'd just end up with
more stormtroopers dead per 1 elite. However, what's the Empire known to do... much less the Sith
before them? Bombard a planet from space until it's no longer inhabitable... But to invade a planet, you have
to control the space around it - otherwise you will be slowly cut off from support and eliminated. The same goes
for supply routes/hyperspace routes and planetary trade/manufacturing.

But there's my EU ten cents worth on the matter...

This debate should take place at the height of both powers, well... power. Which should be Halo 1 and ROtJ, respectivly  BTW, that was a really good post, there.

[brozozo]

I apologize for bring up an old topic up, but its better I dont clog this place up with a topic like this again.  Anyways, disclaimer out of the way, the Empire wins, because of their better Warships(C'mon, you think anything in the Covvie arsenal can take down the Executor...Oh ****, not the fighters!), and better ground armor.  Oh, and the Dark Troopers.  So, there ya go, anybody what to ask me about this post, and i'll go in specifics.

Straight up? Covenant cruiser can take down the Executor. Engagement ranges, son, engagement ranges. The Executor isn't effective out to 150km.

I don't have any figures in front of me, but who (or what) says turbolasers don't have that kind of range? They use them for planetary bombardment, and that isn't exactly a short stroll from the gun deck to the poor bastards on the ground.

[Flipside]

Straight up? Covenant cruiser can take down the Executor. Engagement ranges, son, engagement ranges. The Executor isn't effective out to 150km.

I think they are slightly less than 150km, but I'm not sure, I do know the Rebels had an Ion cannon that certainly seemed to have no problem with vast ranges. but it's not unknown for Assault Gunboats and other Hyperdrive ships to make a H-Jump that precise, And even Lambda shuttles can be pretty nasty if they manage to get the torps away.

You'll always be left with unknowns though, like what effect would an Ion cannon have on Covenant shields? For things like that, you'll always be left in the realm of guessing.

[JGZinv]

Thank you DT, my bookshelves of material tend to be useful once every 7 years.

*coughsomeonecoughmakeacoughcovanenthack
shipsputterandwheezeblastitcroakwithaioncannon*

Wow what was that? 

Now as to turbolaser education and all other things that go boom
in the night of space...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbolaser

http://www.theforce.net/swtc/index.html

http://www.theforce.net/swtc/power.html

SSD's (although the SWTC is a far more involved read)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Star_Destroyer

Move over Executor and Eclipse... here's the Pellaeon.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Pellaeon-class_Star_Destroyer

Comparisons and listings of the Empire's ships:
http://www.theforce.net/swtc/warships.html

Turoblaser Commentaries (and Ion Cannons too ^_^)
http://www.stardestroyer.net/tlc/

Can anyone come up with facts and figures on the Covanent besides this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covenant_%28Halo%29

[TrashMan]

Stormtroopers rule!

Especially the Republic Commandos Master Chief? Meh - they would eat him for breakfest