Author Topic: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)  (Read 3569 times)

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Offline MP-Ryan

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Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
In the mission where the Independence takes down the Kesmet and goes after the Diablo, there seems to be a problem.  The message that the Diablo fires comes up, but the ship does not turn, and it has no turrets that I can target... just the ship itself.  Plus the Independence quits firing, and the bombers won't bomb the Diablo without any turrets or subsystems TO bomb.

I'm assuming this is a bug of some sort.  3.6.9-INF build.  Mediavps disabled.  Any ideas?
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Offline MP-Ryan

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Re: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
Ah, crud.  Seems to be the same problem as this one:  http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,44197.0.html

I even did a search on the forums too.  Anyway, is there a fix yet?
"In the beginning, the Universe was created.  This made a lot of people very angry and has widely been regarded as a bad move."  [Douglas Adams]

 
Re: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
And topic number three on this problem has been started! Topic nuuuumber three! [/fake announcer's voice]

You're not the first to have this problem...
It's caused by a red-alert glitch in the previous mission. If you can, try replaying it.
"You need to believe in things that aren't true. How else can they become?" -DEATH, Discworld

"You can fight like a krogan, run like a leopard, but you'll never be better than Commander Shepard!"

 

Offline MP-Ryan

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Re: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
And topic number three on this problem has been started! Topic nuuuumber three! [/fake announcer's voice]

You're not the first to have this problem...
It's caused by a red-alert glitch in the previous mission. If you can, try replaying it.

I did.  Now it just crashes after the transmission.  This gets better and better...

I'm going to run it in debug, see what happens.
"In the beginning, the Universe was created.  This made a lot of people very angry and has widely been regarded as a bad move."  [Douglas Adams]

 

Offline MP-Ryan

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Re: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
Yup... everytime I click commit at the transmission screen, it flickers once, the cursor jumps to the center, then back to the commit button, then the game hangs, and then finally... crashes.

==========================================================================
DEBUG SPEW: No debug_filter.cfg found, so only general, error, and warning
categories can be shown and no debug_filter.cfg info will be saved.
==========================================================================
Passed cmdline options:
  -img2dds
  -dualscanlines
  -targetinfo
  -snd_preload
  -mod Mods\INF
  -fps
Building file index...
Searching root 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\Mods\INF\'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\Mods\INF\INF_2Patch.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\Mods\INF\INF_Main.vp'
Searching root 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\FS2cutscenepack.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\root_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\smarty_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\sparky_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\sparky_hi_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\stu_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\tango1_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\tango2_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\tango3_fs2.vp'
Searching root pack 'C:\strcapps\freespace2\warble_fs2.vp'
Found 14 roots and 8575 files.
Setting language to English
Initializing OpenAL...
  Using 'Generic Software' as OpenAL sound device...
  OpenAL Vendor     : Creative Labs Inc.
  OpenAL Renderer   : Software
  OpenAL Version    : 1.1

... OpenAL successfully initialized!
GR_CPU: Family 6, MMX=Yes
Initializing OpenGL graphics device at 1024x768 with 32-bit color...
  Initializing WGL...
  Requested WGL Video values = R: 8, G: 8, B: 8, depth: 24, double-buffer: 1
  Actual WGL Video values    = R: 8, G: 8, B: 8, depth: 24, double-buffer: 1
  OpenGL Vendor     : ATI Technologies Inc.
  OpenGL Renderer   : RADEON 9500 Pro x86/MMX/3DNow!
  OpenGL Version    : 2.0.6287 WinXP Release

  Using extension "GL_EXT_fog_coord".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_multitexture".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_env_add".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_compression".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_env_combine".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_compiled_vertex_array".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_draw_range_elements".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_mirrored_repeat".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_non_power_of_two".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_vertex_buffer_object".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_pixel_buffer_object".
  Unable to find extension "GL_APPLE_client_storage".
  Using extension "GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_framebuffer_object".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_rectangle".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_bgra".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_cube_map".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_lod_bias".
  Found special extension function "wglSwapIntervalEXT".

  Max texture units: 8
  Max elements vertices: 2147483647
  Max elements indices: 65535
  Max texture size: 2048x2048
  Can use compressed textures: YES
  Texture compression available: YES
  Using bilinear texture filter.
... OpenGL init is complete!
Size of bitmap info = 705 KB
Size of bitmap extra info = 40 bytes
ANI cursorweb with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
GRAPHICS: Initializing default colors...
SCRIPTING: Beginning initialization sequence...
SCRIPTING: Beginning Lua initialization...
LUA: Opening LUA state...
LUA: Initializing base Lua libraries...
LUA: Performing global function/(library/object) name repeat check...
LUA: Performing library/object name repeat check...
LUA: Performing object/object name repeat check...
LUA: Performing library/library name repeat check...
LUA: Initializing library functions...
LUA: Initializing object functions...
SCRIPTING: Beginning main hook parse sequence....
Wokka!  Error opening file (scripting.tbl)!
Unable to parse scripting.tbl!  Code = 5.
SCRIPTING: Inititialization complete.
Using high memory settings...
Wokka!  Error opening file (interface.tbl)!
Unable to parse interface.tbl!
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-sdf.tbm"
ANI 2_radar1 with size 170x170 (33.6% wasted)
Windoze reported 16 joysticks, we found 0
Current soundtrack set to -1 in event_music_reset_choices
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-mus.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-mfl.tbm"
Wokka!  Error opening file (armor.tbl)!
Unable to parse armor.tbl!
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-amr.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-wxp.tbm"
pcx: Couldn't open 'Missiletrail.pcx'
pcx: Couldn't open 'Missiletrail.pcx'
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-wep.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-aip.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-obt.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-shp.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-hdg.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-str.tbm"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=25, filter="*.pcx"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=32, filter="*.pcx"
loading animated cursor "cursor"
ANI cursor with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
Ships.tbl is : VALID
Weapons.tbl is : VALID
cfile_init() took 542
Got event GS_EVENT_GAME_INIT (49) in state NOT A VALID STATE (0)
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=28, filter="*.pl2"
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=28, filter="*.plr"
ANI cursor.ani with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
Frame  0 too long!!: frametime = 0.450 (0.450)
Got event GS_EVENT_MAIN_MENU (0) in state GS_STATE_INITIAL_PLAYER_SELECT (37)
Someone passed an extension to bm_load for file '103rd.pcx'
ANI 2_Exit.ani with size 45x45 (29.7% wasted)
ANI 2_Pilot.ani with size 45x45 (29.7% wasted)
ANI 2_Continue.ani with size 45x45 (29.7% wasted)
ANI 2_Tech.ani with size 45x45 (29.7% wasted)
ANI 2_Option.ani with size 45x45 (29.7% wasted)
ANI 2_Campaign.ani with size 45x45 (29.7% wasted)
Frame  0 too long!!: frametime = 0.312 (0.312)
Frame  0 too long!!: frametime = 0.424 (0.424)
Got event GS_EVENT_NEW_CAMPAIGN (26) in state GS_STATE_MAIN_MENU (1)
Got event GS_EVENT_START_GAME (1) in state GS_STATE_MAIN_MENU (1)
=================== STARTING LEVEL LOAD ==================
ANI 2_Loading.ani with size 43x43 (32.8% wasted)
Starting model page in...
Beginning level bitmap paging...
cf_get_file_list_preallocated looking for type=7, filter="*-fbl.tbm"
loading warp modelLoading model 'warp.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'warp.pof'.
 300
MISSION LOAD: 'INFC1A-07.fs2'
Hmmm... Extension passed to mission_load...
Starting mission message count : 15
Ending mission message count : 18
Current soundtrack set to -1 in event_music_reset_choices
Loading model 'warlock.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'warlock.pof'.
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem fighterbay, believed to be in ship warlock.pof
Loading model 'Kismat.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'Kismat.pof'.
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor01, believed to be in ship Kismat.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor02, believed to be in ship Kismat.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor03, believed to be in ship Kismat.pof
Loading model 'diabloShiv.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'diabloShiv.pof'.
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor01a, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor02a, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem sgenerator2a, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem sgenerator1a, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor04a, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem reactor03a, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem fighterbay, believed to be in ship diabloShiv.pof
Loading model 'Menelaos.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'Menelaos.pof'.
Loading model 'Sabus.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'Sabus.pof'.
Loading model 'bomber2s-02.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'bomber2s-02.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 1031608016, IBX checksum: 1030538492 -- "bomber2s-02.pof"
ANI 2_lock1 with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI 2_lockspin with size 100x100 (21.9% wasted)
ANI 2_lead1 with size 26x26 (18.8% wasted)
ANI 2_energy2 with size 96x96 (25.0% wasted)
ANI toggle1 with size 20x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI weapons1 with size 20x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI 2_toparc1 with size 60x60 (6.3% wasted)
ANI 2_toparc2 with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI 2_toparc3 with size 29x29 (9.4% wasted)
ANI 2_leftarc with size 252x252 (1.6% wasted)
ANI 2_rightarc1 with size 252x252 (1.6% wasted)
ANI 2_reticle1 with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI targhit1 with size 21x21 (34.4% wasted)
ANI energy1 with size 41x41 (35.9% wasted)
ANI targetview1 with size 156x156 (39.1% wasted)
ANI targetview2 with size 96x96 (25.0% wasted)
ANI targetview3 with size 20x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI damage1 with size 25x25 (21.9% wasted)
ANI support1 with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI objective1 with size 21x21 (34.4% wasted)
ANI wingman1 with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI wingman2 with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI wingman3 with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI netlag1 with size 30x30 (6.3% wasted)
ANI head1 with size 132x132 (48.4% wasted)
ANI time1 with size 23x23 (28.1% wasted)
=================== STARTING LEVEL DATA LOAD ==================
ACM ERROR: Have leftover data after decode!!
ACM ERROR: Have leftover data after decode!!
ACM ERROR: Have leftover data after decode!!
ACM ERROR: Have leftover data after decode!!
About to page in ships!
ANI ShieldAldo1 with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'aldo1.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'aldo1.pof'.
ANI ShieldMenelaos with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldDanaus with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'danaus.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'danaus.pof'.
ANI shieldSabus with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI Shieldberserk with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'beserk.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'beserk.pof'.
Loading model 'SupportINF.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'SupportINF.pof'.
Loading model 'Olemus.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'Olemus.pof'.
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem corea, believed to be in ship Olemus.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem fighterbay 1, believed to be in ship Olemus.pof
Warning: Ignoring unrecognized subsystem fighterbay 2, believed to be in ship Olemus.pof
ANI shieldEnnead with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'ennead.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'ennead.pof'.
Loading model 'support2v-01.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'support2v-01.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 3033145745, IBX checksum:  311387289 -- "support2v-01.pof"
ANI Gorgon-shield with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'SFgorgon.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'SFgorgon.pof'.
ANI shieldSerpent with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'Serpent.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'Serpent.pof'.
ANI shieldbs-02 with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldDurja with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
Loading model 'Durja2.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'Durja2.pof'.
This mission requires 481 Ship_subsystems. See #define MAX_SHIP_SUBOBJECTS.
Loading model 'hornet.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'hornet.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 1463092824, IBX checksum: 1001920542 -- "hornet.pof"
Loading model 'littleboy.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'littleboy.pof'.
Loading model 'shocker.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'shocker.pof'.
Loading model 'NewHornet.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'NewHornet.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum:  252169483, IBX checksum:  788007015 -- "NewHornet.pof"
Loading model 'vortex.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'vortex.pof'.
Loading model 'arrow.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'arrow.pof'.
Loading model 'sniper.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'sniper.pof'.
Loading model 'stilettoII.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'stilettoII.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 3940925484, IBX checksum: 1329739360 -- "stilettoII.pof"
Loading model 'belial.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'belial.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 1754326632, IBX checksum: 3826719420 -- "belial.pof"
Loading model 'helios.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'helios.pof'.
Loading model 'shornet.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'shornet.pof'.
Loading model 'shivbmb1.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'shivbmb1.pof'.
Loading model 'shivbmb2.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'shivbmb2.pof'.
Loading model 'cmeasure01.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'cmeasure01.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 3857917235, IBX checksum: 1369793329 -- "cmeasure01.pof"
Loading model 'ctorp.pof'
IBX: Starting a new IBX for 'ctorp.pof'.
Loading model 'debris01.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'debris01.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 2538545483, IBX checksum: 3906274773 -- "debris01.pof"
Loading model 'debris02.pof'
IBX: Found a good IBX to read for 'debris02.pof'.
IBX-DEBUG => POF checksum: 2383342928, IBX checksum: 3124603306 -- "debris02.pof"
Paging in mission messages
Stopping model page in...
ANI 2_radar1.ani with size 170x170 (33.6% wasted)
ANI 2_lock1.ani with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI 2_lead1.ani with size 26x26 (18.8% wasted)
ANI 2_energy2.ani with size 96x96 (25.0% wasted)
ANI toggle1.ani with size 20x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI weapons1.ani with size 20x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI 2_toparc1.ani with size 60x60 (6.3% wasted)
ANI 2_toparc2.ani with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI 2_toparc3.ani with size 29x29 (9.4% wasted)
ANI 2_leftarc.ani with size 252x252 (1.6% wasted)
ANI 2_rightarc1.ani with size 252x252 (1.6% wasted)
ANI 2_reticle1.ani with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI targhit1.ani with size 21x21 (34.4% wasted)
ANI energy1.ani with size 41x41 (35.9% wasted)
ANI targetview1.ani with size 156x156 (39.1% wasted)
ANI targetview2.ani with size 96x96 (25.0% wasted)
ANI targetview3.ani with size 20x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI damage1.ani with size 25x25 (21.9% wasted)
ANI support1.ani with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI objective1.ani with size 21x21 (34.4% wasted)
ANI wingman1.ani with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI wingman2.ani with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI wingman3.ani with size 53x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI netlag1.ani with size 30x30 (6.3% wasted)
ANI head1.ani with size 132x132 (48.4% wasted)
ANI time1.ani with size 23x23 (28.1% wasted)
ANI ShieldAldo1.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI ShieldMenelaos.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldDanaus.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldSabus.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI Shieldberserk.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldEnnead.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI Gorgon-shield.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldSerpent.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldbs-02.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
ANI shieldDurja.ani with size 93x93 (27.3% wasted)
User bitmap 'TMP824x43+16'
User bitmap 'TMP824x43+16'
User bitmap 'TMP256x256+8'
User bitmap 'TMP256x256+8'
User bitmap 'TMP128x128+8'
Bmpman: 2254/4750 bitmap slots in use.
Ending level bitmap paging...
=================== ENDING LOAD ================
Real count = 2297,  Estimated count = 1250
================================================
Received post for event GS_EVENT_RED_ALERT during state transtition. Find Allender if you are unsure if this is bad.
Frame  0 too long!!: frametime = 135.089 (135.089)
Got event GS_EVENT_RED_ALERT (57) in state GS_STATE_CMD_BRIEF (43)
Throwing out event 15 because of state set from 43 to 44
ANI IconVesuvius with size 28x28 (12.5% wasted)
ANI IconAldo1 with size 28x28 (12.5% wasted)
ANI IconBerserk with size 28x28 (12.5% wasted)
ANI 2_ssvesuvius.ani with size 368x368 (28.1% wasted)
SHIP ANI: Found hires version of 2_ssvesuvius.ani
ANI 2_ssophion.ani with size 368x368 (28.1% wasted)
SHIP ANI: Found hires version of 2_ssophion.ani
ANI iconSD4 with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconScalpel with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconPromS with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconshocker with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconHornet with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconvortex with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconarrow with size 22x22 (31.3% wasted)
ANI iconStilettoII with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI iconbelial with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI 2_gundefault.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_disadv.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_prom.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_shocker.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_horneta.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_vortex.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_arrow.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_still3.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
ANI 2_cyclops.ani with size 304x304 (40.6% wasted)
Frame  0 too long!!: frametime = 0.698 (0.698)
ANI cursor.ani with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
Frame  0 too long!!: frametime = 0.682 (0.682)
Got event GS_EVENT_ENTER_GAME (2) in state GS_STATE_RED_ALERT (44)
Entering game at time = 151.336

Incidentally, this is the same frickin' thing that happens to me in one of the Homesick missions now.  Has this been Mantis'd yet?
"In the beginning, the Universe was created.  This made a lot of people very angry and has widely been regarded as a bad move."  [Douglas Adams]

 

Offline MP-Ryan

  • Makes General Discussion Make Sense.
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  • 210
  • Keyboard > Pen > Sword
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Re: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
Marvelous.  IF I target the Diablo's turrets in the first half of the mission, it crashes after the Incoming Transmission.  By contrast, if I don't target its turrets, the next mission runs, BUT all its systems are at 0% and the turrets are missing.

The crash is nearly identical to one I'm getting with Homesick.  Therefore, I have Mantis'd it.  http://scp.indiegames.us/mantis/view.php?id=1255
"In the beginning, the Universe was created.  This made a lot of people very angry and has widely been regarded as a bad move."  [Douglas Adams]

 
Re: Problem in El Diablo (Part 2?)
i got the EXACT SAME PROBLEM. even in homesick. inone of the missions the corvette has no turrets or subsystems but it's stillgoing 30 mps. i made it invulnerable and waited 3 hours game time (thanks to the nifty little time compresser) to see that nothing happens and i can't even warp out.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.