[karajorma]

Gay-Pride Parade Sets Mainstream Acceptance Of Gays Back 50 Years

You know, if I had the choice to eliminate a sixth finger from my unborn child, I would totally do it. A sixth finger can do nothing but hurt their chances at a job, lower their self-esteem, and make them more likely to hate people and become a serial killer.

Bet you'd feel stupid if he turned out to be a world-class pianist then.

[TrashMan]

Homosexuals are not crazy, mental illness is a whole other ball game, we are talking about things that do not effect the persons ability to interact with the rest of society, beyond societies own phobias, at least.

I'm asking you whom would you commit to a mental institution. By what standards would you judge who is crazy? - especially since it's sometimes such a file line that spearates a insane person and a genius..and we all got our little oddities.
Is he really crazy just becoause you said so or is he different?

Or would you never send anyone? Everyone is AOK, right?

It boils down to how you judge

[TrashMan]

Those gay pride parades aren't normal, peacefull marches for promotion of rights. How a real peacefull march looks like - just take a look back how King did it for hte rights of black people.

Al lthe gay pride parades I've seen are rubbish - pure excuse for perverts of all kinds. All you have to do is look at a few pictures from those parades or look at the banners that they cary.."Perversion is OK!"  Blakc leather or body paint, showing off their genital and allmost foricating during the parade - those parades hit the rock bottom of decadency.
Why can't they just march dressed normally, acting civilized hilethey do it?



As for tehy being gay or having a sixth fighter - it doesn't matter if it's natural (in the sense that it happen in nature all the time..yes you got babies with 2 heads born of **** like that..it happens), the fact is that it's a FLAWED product. As harsh and this may sind it's mearly the state of thing - a cold hard fact.
As that atricle said, the wireing got mixed up and the product isn't functioning properly..

Like a car with mixed wireing and the brake and gas pedal are switched. Hell, once you get used to it you can drive it without problems - no danger there...but it's still a faulty product...

*puts on flameproff power armor*

[karajorma]

Except that Flipside kinda pointed out a reason it might not be a flawed design but might actually be an evolutionary advantage. Now lets assume he is right. Lets assume that being gay is a deliberate evolutionary strategy either to prevent cross-breeding or to free up childless aunts and uncles to help with child-rearing.

That would mean it wasn't a flawed product. It was deliberate (or at least as deliberate as evolution gets).

In that case would you drop your objections to it or would you find another reason to deny it?

[TrashMan]

Except that Flipside kinda pointed out a reason it might not be a flawed design but might actually be an evolutionary advantage. Now lets assume he is right. Lets assume that being gay is a deliberate evolutionary strategy either to prevent cross-breeding or to free up childless aunts and uncles to help with child-rearing.

That would mean it wasn't a flawed product. It was deliberate (or at least as deliberate as evolution gets).

In that case would you drop your objections to it or would you find another reason to deny it?

What is god in evolution is determined by what survives or works good. In our current society everything survives..

Gay a next step in evolution? Hardly....

[Mefustae]

What is god in evolution is determined by what survives or works good. In our current society everything survives..

Well, it seems to be working just fine in the animal kingdom. That's still dictated by natural selection, isn't it?

Hell, the fact alone that homosexuality appears in nature on a scale that cannot be explained by random mutation demonstrates incontrovertibly that it is not a directly negative evolutionary trait, and thus shoots a rather large hole in the notion that homosexuality is a 'flaw'.

[karajorma]

What is god in evolution is determined by what survives or works good. In our current society everything survives..

Gay a next step in evolution? Hardly....

Who said it was the next step? I'm saying that this is something from mammalian evolution which has survived because it's a positive benefit. 

Besides you've completely missed the point. I was asking what would you say if that absolutely 100% was proven true. Not that it IS 100% proven true. I want to know if you'd still claim it was a flaw to be corrected even if it was proven that there was an evolutionary reason for it.

Because in that case we're proving that you don't believe it's a biological flaw but a moral one. And that's a completely different kettle of fish.

[Ace]

Next step? The very concept is flawed, and is based on an idea of 'progress' towards some goal which in reality, despite the insistence of pulp-scifi, does not exist. There are no imperatives for large brains or turning into shwooshy blobs of glowing energy who respond to intrepid explorers with mysterious riddles. Now if a large brain helps lead to more offspring, or higher 'quality' offspring with more access to resources and survival, it'll probably happen, but it is nothing more then that.

As for a reason why we see homosexual behaviors in the wild: inclusive fitness. While the individual may not breed, it is likely to help others who are genetically related who do breed increasing the chance of survival for those related offspring.

[Flipside]

What it all boils down to is what your opinion of Gays is, people can be heterosexual and choose never to have children, there is no other difference between a homosexual and a heterosexual.

Look at it this way, how many Gays have difficulty communicating with Heterosexuals? Compare that with Heterosexuals who can't communicate with Gays. and ask yourself 'Where's the social disability, is it with me, or with them?'.

[Scuddie]

That's not really a fair comparison.  There are more heterosexuals than there are homosexuals.  Plus, I'd be willing to bet my life that 2/3 of heterosexuals who are now 'uncomfortable' with homosexuals no longer remain that way if the homosexuals in question would acknowledge their homosexuality and dismiss it in a matter-of-fact kind of way.  The discomfort comes in most part due to the different culture.  Many gays and lesbians have decided to set a standard for their culture, and in many of their eyes, it is expected for gays and lesbians to act a certain way.  It's just like inner city thug culture.  I doubt an upper class person, gay or straight, would be comfortable around a street hooligan, gay or straight..

[TrashMan]

What is god in evolution is determined by what survives or works good. In our current society everything survives..

Well, it seems to be working just fine in the animal kingdom. That's still dictated by natural selection, isn't it?

Hell, the fact alone that homosexuality appears in nature on a scale that cannot be explained by random mutation demonstrates incontrovertibly that it is not a directly negative evolutionary trait, and thus shoots a rather large hole in the notion that homosexuality is a 'flaw'.

nope...it's just a flaw that continues to survive..

As I said, even the biggest morons are allowed to breed in our society, so there really isn't any selection present to start with.

Who said it was the next step? I'm saying that this is something from mammalian evolution which has survived because it's a positive benefit.

What positive benefit?

Besides you've completely missed the point. I was asking what would you say if that absolutely 100% was proven true. Not that it IS 100% proven true. I want to know if you'd still claim it was a flaw to be corrected even if it was proven that there was an evolutionary reason for it.

Because in that case we're proving that you don't believe it's a biological flaw but a moral one. And that's a completely different kettle of fish.

Proven that it's a product of evolution? Evolution is a hit-and-miss process, so it wouldn't surprise me at all.....

[Flipside]

Look at it this way, even if it is genetic, is Stephen Hawkings someone with MND who is also very intelligent or someone who is very intelligent with MND? Say we could detect MND and terminate the Foetus, do you think the world would have lost out then?

[Scuddie]

Someone with MND who has high intelligence...
Someone with high intelligence who has MND...

What's the difference?

[TrashMan]

Look at it this way, even if it is genetic, is Stephen Hawkings someone with MND who is also very intelligent or someone who is very intelligent with MND? Say we could detect MND and terminate the Foetus, do you think the world would have lost out then?

Terminating? Who said anything about terminating?

B.t.w. - Stephen Hawking, Bob Ross, George Bush or Jimmy from across the street - who is more important? Answer - no one. They are all equally important since you can't tell for sure who will they end up being anyway.

EDIT:
Who's the one who said  - "It's no a bug, it's a feature!" ?

[Flipside]

Someone with MND who has high intelligence...
Someone with high intelligence who has MND...

What's the difference?

Priorities.

EDIT:
Who's the one who said  - "It's no a bug, it's a feature!" ?

No-one.

B.t.w. - Stephen Hawking, Bob Ross, George Bush or Jimmy from across the street - who is more important? Answer - no one. They are all equally important since you can't tell for sure who will they end up being anyway.

The same with homosexuals.

[karajorma]

Proven that it's a product of evolution? Evolution is a hit-and-miss process, so it wouldn't surprise me at all.....

Dodging the question yet again I see.

[S-99]

Well there's some obvious bad traits like being really far sighted or being born with a walking disability or something. **** happens, but today we live in a day and age where people with specific traits and disabilities can flourish. Well for me my bad trait is being extremely far sighted, but that gets supplemented and fixed with glasses and contacts. Also i'm dyslexic (dyslexia causes me to accidentally mix and match my words such as "my hoot furts" aka "my foot hurts", or "my stickers are fingey" aka "my fingers are sticky" (i ate ribs one night)), as well as dyslexia causing me to have to re-read because of my wierd ass decoding skills. Dyslexia isn't a bad thing, people learn to work with it and get better at stuff like reading and speaking.

Dyslexia i would rather call a good trait i guess as opposed to a bad trait where i can't see very well. The 6th finger argument is just purely stupid. There is piano music out there that only 6 fingered people can play. After that having a 6th finger does not go really go past considering someone to be abnormal. The 6th finger would most likely not be chopped off, as the person with it would most likely deal with some humiliation from other kids growing up, but after that, they'd probably like the fact that they have a 6th finger as it is unique and can open up awesome possibilities with stuff that requires multiple fingers such as musical instruments like a piano or guitar, or something else that is not music oriented that i'm not thinking of right now. Now if the 6th finger was a finger that was rather a deformity, like a finger that couldn't be moved something the person with it couldn't utilize at all, you might as well chop it off.

The 6 fingered argument is retarded, because it's like saying if i got my dick chopped off in some freak accident. Then being a man without a dick wouldn't be normal so following this logic i would have to get a sex change operation and become a woman.

Homosexuality is a different thing from the retarded 6th finger abnormality argument. Some people can choose to be gay, but usually someone is just gay without having made a choice. There was a friend mine who was bisexual, and she slept with chicks and her bf. A year later she got rid of her bf and was single for a while and she found out she absolutely liked guys more than girls. She was a person who obviously was one of the few who made a choice as opposed to other people who are born gay.

After that up at college here in alaska, i have several gay friends who grew up in alaska just like i have. And because environment is 70% of your development where 30% is your genetics. So, me and my gay friends grew up in the same alaskan environment. Low and behold in alaska, some people are gay some aren't (pretty much just like everywhere in the world). Now the thing that's special about alaska is that it's hard to see a family where the parents haven't separated or possibly if a friend, relative, or other family member hasn't committed suicide or is abusing drugs. My family parents haven't split up and no ones committed suicide in my family here in alaska. Absolutely all of my other friends come from broken families and have developed through hard circumstances. And what i mean by this is that me and all of my friends do come from different situations in the same alaskan environment. Out of all of my friends only one person was confused about whether they liked girls or guys. After that the majority of my friends are straight, and some are gay where they obviously didn't make a choice to be that way.

Nothing can be proven absolutely yet because more research needs to be done, but i think it's safe to say that it's possible for people to be born gay, as opposed to people becoming gay because of the environment they developed in.

On the fun side of this topic, i'll bring up a what if situation. What if homosexuality is a gene? Then that gene should be isolated and weaponized. And with that weaponization should have been the first thing to launch at the palace saddam was living in

EDIT: LOL i can see that the banner ads for this thread are fitting the situation

[BS403]

You know, if I had the choice to eliminate a sixth finger from my unborn child, I would totally do it. A sixth finger can do nothing but hurt their chances at a job, lower their self-esteem, and make them more likely to hate people and become a serial killer. I'm not saying all deformed people are serial killers, but you get my point.

A sixth finger actually is a good thing.  A lot of baseball pitchers with six fingers have been successful. Antonio Alfonseca was a successful closer for several years and made more money then i'll make in my lifetime.  There were also several other successful six fingered pitchers in baseball that i can't think of off hand.

[TrashMan]

Who's the one who said  - "It's no a bug, it's a feature!" ?

No-one.

Nah..it was someone from the computer industry..someone from Microsoft or Steve Jobs...can't recall

B.t.w. - Stephen Hawking, Bob Ross, George Bush or Jimmy from across the street - who is more important? Answer - no one. They are all equally important since you can't tell for sure who will they end up being anyway.

The same with homosexuals.

Your point? You saying Bob will end up a mass murderer becouse whatever triggers gayness has been "untriggered" while he was still a fetus?

Dodging the question yet again I see.

I belive I answered it rather clearly. Being a product of evolution or not is irrelevant, given that everything is a product of evolution.

Aslo, having a slight beneficial or negative impact is also a moot point.

A bug is a bug. A fluke is a fluke. Deviation from the norm, from the standard, from the blueprints. Call it what you wish.

The 6 fingered argument is retarded, because it's like saying if i got my dick chopped off in some freak accident. Then being a man without a dick wouldn't be normal so following this logic i would have to get a sex change operation and become a woman.

Now that is retarted. With advanced medicine today, they should be able to put it back on. Even if not, that is a product of an accident that was out of your control....Hm...I wonder if there is such a thing as a dick transpolant?

[Janos]

so basically what I have understood is that TrashMan thinks that gays are a bug of society and as such should be removed