Author Topic: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)  (Read 17916 times)

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Offline Tempest

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  • The Star Wars Conversion
    • The Fate of the Galaxy - SWC
Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Without it's detail boxes, it's about 20k pollies, still at LOD0. LODing properly is one of my biggest concerns.

As for the number of polygons, we're still working on how we're going to do a proper BoE. As it stands, we're still trying to figure out how to install the required number of weapons onto this thing.
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Offline jr2

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Can we get some SCP coders in here & have a problem solving / brainstorming session?

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
The key problem with this ship, as has been mentioned already, is the subobject limit. Like it or not, FS2 has a 110 odd subobject limit, and you're not going to be able to effectively turret a ship 17 odd kilometers long with the 90 - 100 turrets you'll have left once the detail boxes and destroyable subobjects are done. In the old SW mod, the plan was to use this ship as a plot device - you might see it, it might kill a few ships at a great distance, or it might be a part of the background of a mission, or in a shipyard or something, but it would never be deployed as a standard combat ship. It's unkillable (or at least it ought to be) and thus plays hell with non scripted mission parts, and makes turreting it unneccesary. My advice, then, is to get it modelled and mapped but not to bother turreting it at all. If we need it to kill something, I can sort that out in FRED, but trying to treat something like this as a standard combat vessel is a recipe for, well, if not outright failure, certainly falling far short of what should be expected for a ship like this.
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Offline MetalDestroyer

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Before to choose this only option, why don't you asked to SCP coder to override the actual code to support more than 110 sub object ? I don't know the difficulties since I don't have the source code and well C++ isn't my langage of predilection :p

If it's just a value to modify, so it would be easy to have a ship with more than 110 subobject. If it's not the case and it's based on some mysterious parameter. :/

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
It looks like the limit may already have been removed, but you're still going to be left with an impossibly high number of turrets to path, table and properly pof, to produce a combat ready ship with no real mission value.
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Rarely Updated P3D.
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Offline Shade

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
I tend to agree. I'd absolutely love to see this ship fully functional in-game, but simply for pure awe factor and not because it'd be of much use to a mission designer. Ships above a certain size, such as this and the Sath and Collie from FS2, are invariably little more than scenery or plot devices in most cases.

That said, I *can* think of a few cases where a fully armed version would actually be useful, so if you've got the time and inclination to take it all the way, then by all means... Just know in advance that much of the time it'll be a prop and not an actor. Though, without a doubt, a massively impressive and utterly astonishing prop.

Oh, and I guess another reason to do it might be to avoid the masses of whining Star Wars fans you'll have crawling up your alley once they download the game and realize this ship is not fully operational, expecting to be able to play the Battle of Endor and take out the bridge deflector shield, not realizing that it would take them a full 10 minutes at full thrust just to get from the tip of the wedge to their target due to the size of the ship :p
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Offline Woolie Wool

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Dr. Curtis Saxton (maintainer of the Star Wars Technical Commentaries) believes that the Rebel fleet knocked out the bridge deflector shields, and the communication dome blowing up occurred within a couple of seconds of the shield going down, thus explaining the chain of events. Because there's no way an A-wing's pea-shooters are going to scratch the Executor's shields.
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Offline Woolie Wool

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
You know there were only three (maybe four) SSDs made, right?  :wtf:

Do you have a source for this? The Empire could build a thousand SSDs if they wanted to. Hell,  a Death Star is easily worth tens of thousands of SSDs.
16:46   Quanto   ****, a mosquito somehow managed to bite the side of my palm
16:46   Quanto   it itches like hell
16:46   Woolie   !8ball does Quanto have malaria
16:46   BotenAnna   Woolie: The outlook is good.
16:47   Quanto   D:

"did they use anesthetic when they removed your sense of humor or did you have to weep and struggle like a tiny baby"
--General Battuta

 

Offline Shade

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Quote
Dr. Curtis Saxton (maintainer of the Star Wars Technical Commentaries) believes that the Rebel fleet knocked out the bridge deflector shields, and the communication dome blowing up occurred within a couple of seconds of the shield going down, thus explaining the chain of events. Because there's no way an A-wing's pea-shooters are going to scratch the Executor's shields.
He apparently hasn't watched the movie, then. The dome is clearly destroyed before Piett's crew pipe up about the shield being downed. So weakened, certainly, and clearly to the point where a fighter could penetrate them which would be almost 0%, but not downed completely. And the domes do in fact mount the shield projectors for the nearby area (not in the domes, but mounted on top of them - They're the little spikes that protrude from the upper hemisphere), so if you blow up those, you take out the shielding permanently for that area of the ship, which is what happened in RotJ.

Speculation from someone with a nice title is all well and good, but as far as I'm concerned, what was shown in the movie is what happened, and supercedes any 3rd party speculation.
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"Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh ****ing great. 2200 references to entry->index and no idea which is the one that ****ed up" - Karajorma
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct." - Niels Bohr
<Cobra|> You play this mission too intelligently.

 

Offline SeanP

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
You know there were only three (maybe four) SSDs made, right?  :wtf:

Do you have a source for this? The Empire could build a thousand SSDs if they wanted to. Hell,  a Death Star is easily worth tens of thousands of SSDs.
To the best of my knowledge, four were built:
  • Executor
  • Lusankya
  • Iron Fist
  • Razor's Kiss

Post-Endor the Empire was severely crippled, and didn't necessarily have the infinite resources it's easy to think of them as having.

 

Offline Axem

  • 211
Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Shade: Brand-X showed me this quote from the Visual Effects guy who did ROTJ.
"We're also still working on the sequence where Mad Max crashes his A-wing into Vader's ship and causes the star destroyer to lose control and crash into the Deathstar. The penetration shot with the mushroom-cloud explosion we've had for some time, and we've got the shot where the ship's been hit and is starting to heel over. A very large explosion is coming out of the bridge area and it's causing several others to go as well; and one of the big radar domes up on top has been blown away, and that's spewing flames."

(Emphasis mine)

SeanP: Which is exactly why the Empire built the Eclipse Star Destroyer. :p
« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 10:35:23 am by Axem »

 

Offline Shade

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
None of that contradicts what I just posted, though. I did agree that the actual domes are not shield projectors, it's just that there are shield projectors mounted on top of them. I didn't know Mel Gibson was flying the fighter that rammed the bridge, though :p

Basically the on-screen sequence goes like this: Ackbar orders all ships to concentrate fire on the Executor. A little later after it has taken a lot of pounding, an A-Wing strafes the left sensor dome (which also happens to have the local shield projectors mounted on it. It's in some tech manual or something, I can't actually remember where it's from) and manages to blow it up. A different A-Wing (piloted by Braveheart) then rams the bridge, causing much badness for the imperials. Crowd in cinema cheers :)
« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 10:51:18 am by Shade »
Report FS_Open bugs with Mantis  |  Find the latest FS_Open builds Here  |  Interested in FRED? Check out the Wiki's FRED Portal | Diaspora: Website / Forums
"Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh ****ing great. 2200 references to entry->index and no idea which is the one that ****ed up" - Karajorma
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct." - Niels Bohr
<Cobra|> You play this mission too intelligently.

 

Offline Axem

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
That could explain it, but I also heard that the dome blowing up was supposed to show the effect of the shields going down.

 

Offline Shade

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Maybe it was and it's just the editor that screwed up and reversed the sequences. Wouldn't be the first time a writer's vision and what an editor produced didn't quite fit with eachother. If that's the case, then that would certainly invalidate events as shown in the film as an editor can't overrule Lucas on anything starwars (Except for ep. 1-3, everyone can overrule Lucas on those... I refuse to accept any and all retcons made by those three movies). For now though, I'm going to be stubborn and stick by my childhood memories :p
« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 11:15:45 am by Shade »
Report FS_Open bugs with Mantis  |  Find the latest FS_Open builds Here  |  Interested in FRED? Check out the Wiki's FRED Portal | Diaspora: Website / Forums
"Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh ****ing great. 2200 references to entry->index and no idea which is the one that ****ed up" - Karajorma
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct." - Niels Bohr
<Cobra|> You play this mission too intelligently.

 

Offline Axem

  • 211
Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
There's a good reason we're trying our best to stay within the Original Trilogy and Pre-Vong EU. ;)

 

Offline Shade

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
Those are definitely the best parts, and the only ones worth bothering with :)

[Edit] Except possibly some of the precursors to the modern Star Destroyers as seen in Ep. 3. The prequel stories may be far below par, but the capital ship designs aren't bad... one of the few things I liked about the prequels. In fact, the very start of Ep. 3 where you're skimming the hull and then drop down into a massive battle is very original trilogy-ish. Too bad it goes to hell as soon as they zoom in on the pilots :blah: That, Yoda kicking ass and the fight at the end of Ep. 1 is more or less the whole list though.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 11:41:44 am by Shade »
Report FS_Open bugs with Mantis  |  Find the latest FS_Open builds Here  |  Interested in FRED? Check out the Wiki's FRED Portal | Diaspora: Website / Forums
"Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh ****ing great. 2200 references to entry->index and no idea which is the one that ****ed up" - Karajorma
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct." - Niels Bohr
<Cobra|> You play this mission too intelligently.

 

Offline MetalDestroyer

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
About the Vong, did you have any ships models for this race ? Because, well, the novel are great but I don't have any clue to what they do like and especially there ships. I know they are organics but that 's all.

 

Offline Turambar

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
sorry, there will be no vong in the SWC.

our accepted SW canon starts just before ANH and ends a few years after Vision of the Future and Survivors Quest.
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Offline Tempest

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  • The Star Wars Conversion
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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
While the prequels certainly aren't as great as the originals, they've still got a few kickass ships. I'd like to see a few prequel ships get in eventually, like having the rebels be able to use an N1, and have their recursant or whatever CIS destroyer. The Venator should also make it to SWC eventually, too, as we can use it as an older Star Destroyer. That definatley isn't our focus right now, though.

I also agree that we shouldn't go much farther past 20 ABY, as there's more than enough GCW material we can use without having to touch the Vong.
"... and the klingons also were the soviet's space program. i mean can you really believe that a bunch of communist farmers can make rockets like that?"
-Axem

My photobucket: with all my shiny new stuff on it! http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o116/Tempest_77/

  

Offline MetalDestroyer

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Re: It's large and has many weapons...(WIP)
sorry, there will be no vong in the SWC.

our accepted SW canon starts just before ANH and ends a few years after Vision of the Future and Survivors Quest.
I know, I know. Sorry if my post was a little confuse. When I spoke about Vong Model, it's on general not specially for the SWC. I saw some models in Warlords, but are they truly the right models or not since we didn't have a Star Wars games/movies/series/or whatever you like in its era.