[ARC_Shrike]

lol i still rember the first time my machine crashed because i had WAY too many ships.... (what can i say ? i salvaged anything even recoursers)

[StyffyDawgIX]

salvettes are for lamers, dolts, and llamas

[Thorn]

Just because he uses an effective tactic, it doesnt make him a "lamer", "dolt" or "llama".....

[Alikchi]

..it makes him a winner, and it makes the underestimater the loser.

[Setekh]

Ummm...

Damn...

[StyffyDawgIX]

lol you guys don't know how it is to have some fruit hyp 4 minelayers and mine all the ru patches with the poor man's carrier trick.

you don't know what it's like to loose a maxed out fleet to a huge wall of mines that some newbie made

you don't know how annoying and time consuming it is to make a mine sweeper carrier group

you don't know how funny it is to kill a person that uses mines.....WITH his own mines.

Salvetts are lame tactic in most games

both tactics are for lamers because there is no strategy or gameplay involved in either of them whatsoever.  

[Skippy]

Originally posted by Thorn
Just because he uses an effective tactic, it doesnt make him a "lamer", "dolt" or "llama".....

Right, I use this tactic

[Thorn]

Originally posted by StyffyDawgIX
lol you guys don't know how it is to have some fruit hyp 4 minelayers and mine all the ru patches with the poor man's carrier trick.

you don't know what it's like to loose a maxed out fleet to a huge wall of mines that some newbie made

you don't know how annoying and time consuming it is to make a mine sweeper carrier group

you don't know how funny it is to kill a person that uses mines.....WITH his own mines.

Salvetts are lame tactic in most games

both tactics are for lamers because there is no strategy or gameplay involved in either of them whatsoever.  

Again, because he used an effective tactic, it doesnt make him lame...
The idea isnt to be fair, the idea is to win...
Anyone who complains about someone who uses a good tactic is a pansy. Why do you think they put the things in the game?
Besides, if you won even though he used those tactics, why are you complaining?

[USS Alexander]

Just make a swarm of heavy corvettes and fighters and bombers and you can take out anything, then come with ya cap's

[Fineus]

Just to bring a thought to this... the point of strategy - in real life or otherwise is to win, yes?

Somehow I don't see military commanders being shouted at for using lame tactics if they win.

And if your better than a newbie you should be able to find a way around hit tactics, because there's always a way - if you can't counter his movements it makes you a worse tactition than he is if you ask me

[Thorn]

It's the same with any game, even FS...
Pirhanas being a good example.
*Player 1 fires a couple of fish*
*Player 2 is killed by fish*
*Player 2 whines, quits, etc*
What I always say to stuff like this..
LEARN TO EVADE THE DAMN THINGS!
Same goes for anything else, if he starts to beat you with a tactic, adapt, do something to counter it.
A wall of mines in your way? A small wing of MGCs with some scouts running through it on evaisive will clear it faster than a MD.

[StyffyDawgIX]

this is a game...and seeing as it's not real military combat.....and is just for fun, lame newbie tactics are not a good thing to use.  They make YOU look like a newbie.

Yeah, the reason to play a game is to win, but it's also about being a good sport.  Yeah i can beat these newb tactics no prob, but it's just an annoyance.  

How many mp games have you guys played?  I've had probly over a thousand.   If you guys had played that many games you'd know that this:

Just make a swarm of heavy corvettes and fighters and bombers and you can take out anything, then come with ya cap's

is harder then it appears on text.  I could go on and pick that strat apart...but i'll refrain


Furthermore this statment here:

The idea isnt to be fair, the idea is to win...

makes you look horrible Thorn, no offense man, but to be a good player, you need to be fair, and not a brutal assh0le.

And it's not a 'good' tactic, it may be effective, and easy to use, but it's not a good tactic, it's lame, it's too easy, it's like what we in the Icks call pulling a Zilly.  Zilly is a member of our clan, he's matured quite nicely sense he was branded one of the lamest tactic users in the clan....in several FFA's, he would wait until the other 2 people were in a battle, then he'd hyper his fleet to one of the two people's MS', and proceed to kill them...he did this to both people, effectivly winning the FFA.  Now that was an unfair way to play, it was lame and just not good sportsmanship.

In the same respect, in football, winning is all that matters right?   yeah, so what if there were no fouls, and players merciless broke other player's necks, legs etc...hey, they would be winning!  And that's all that maters? riiiiiight.

The tactics aren't hard to beat, they're annoyances.  Mind you i only say this concerning big maps, on small maps it's different, because there's no buffer between you and the other player, which means you can counter the tactics within seconds, and not lose a whole fleet, because it takes you minutes to arrive with fighter support.  

If you guys play using those tactics, I don't think less of you as a person, but i do think less of you as an HW player...   There's just codes of play that some players follow (namely IX) i follow these thoughts and it's just how i am.

When you get to be able to play without using miners and salvettes, you're generally a better player.

I'm just stating my thoughts, and not trying to flame anyone, i don't mean any hostility guys

[StyffyDawgIX]

good example of this argument, read this:

http://www.homeworldfreaks.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?s=3c6f4f297050ffff;act=ST;f=1;t=188;st=0

[Fineus]

Don't worry - we're just discussing the pros/cons of tactics and so on here - if it gets to hot I'll lock the thread

I can see what you mean about it being a game and how not doing certain things makes it more fun/diverse/better for everyone. But surely finding a way to defend against such an attack and kicking the crap out of the enemy is far more satisfying than complaining that they use the tactic... thats how I see it

[StyffyDawgIX]

yes, defeating a foe who uses them is very satisfying...lol but defeating the tactics allows one to ***** about them

i do love the devilishly large smile that crosses my face when i kill a guy who's encased his ms with a globe of mines, WITH his own mines...lol it's the funniest thing, people usually quit when that happens tho =\

[Anaz]

Heh...when that happens to me, I usually laugh at myself for stupidity...


Something that I did when I was bored and playing against the computer, is I mined all of his resources...

[ARC_Shrike]

hey styff salvage 'vettes are useless in multi unless you are running with the AI's ships.. players will simply attack your 'vettes and they will be dead

now whats so bad about useing mine'ers offencively ? they can be a great annoyance against low coverage target's like Ion Frig's... but i must agree the mine wall is first of all too easy to defeat and quite lame

[WMCoolmon]

I disagree...today I had a bunch of multiguns guarding a couple of ions. I send the multis forward to use against an incoming ion fleet. Then they activated the gravwell and sent in some salvage vetts; I managed to get one out of the four before they grappled on and had to scuttle one of the ions. Used right, they can be dangerous, but only if used right.
BTW, how are you guys going to be doing grav gens? SEXPs and subsystems damage?
(I later jumped in near their Carrier with my ally and found the same ion being towed to it...then my ally blew up the carrier, winning the game for us )

[StyffyDawgIX]

mine'ers offencively

Shrike....there's a difference between using miners offsensivly and using them with a bug

4 miners on a small map can cause alotta probs.....but four miners being hypered to and fro from patch to patch with the poor man's carrier trick.....is very bad...and is just not a good playing style.  (IE Psylence)

[ARC_Shrike]

try readin the post