[achtung]

Could we please either stop the useless banter or get some real information from recent, credible sources in this thread?

I agree.

[Mefustae]

Could we please either stop the useless banter or get some real information from recent, credible sources in this thread?

With several people *****ing about US conscription as if it were at all likely, I think you're asking too much.

[Rictor]

Could we please either stop the useless banter or get some real information from recent, credible sources in this thread?

Gates, Rice and Mullen told Cheney that he was going to have his war over their dead bodies. But they all still hate Iran, so they settled for imposing crippling economic sanctions and isolating them politically. Then they laughed and laughed.

That's pretty much the long and short of it.

[jdjtcagle]

If it came to a draft, I most certainly would volunteer before I'm drafted.

I might not like the US's current foreign policy, but it's still my country. If I went anywhere else I'd either be a stupid, rich, vulnerable Westerner or a backwater yank. If some-idiot-on-high decided to go to war with Iran, the US will need all the troops it can get.

braver than me...

[Turambar]

If it came to a draft, I most certainly would volunteer before I'm drafted.

I might not like the US's current foreign policy, but it's still my country. If I went anywhere else I'd either be a stupid, rich, vulnerable Westerner or a backwater yank. If some-idiot-on-high decided to go to war with Iran, the US will need all the troops it can get.

braver than me...

no, just dumber.

[BloodEagle]

If it came to a draft, I most certainly would volunteer before I'm drafted.

I might not like the US's current foreign policy, but it's still my country. If I went anywhere else I'd either be a stupid, rich, vulnerable Westerner or a backwater yank. If some-idiot-on-high decided to go to war with Iran, the US will need all the troops it can get.

braver than me...

no, just dumber.

So says the guy behind the rock.

Anywho.... If it comes down to the draft getting reinstated, then we're pretty much doomed. The current state of the U.S. population isn't exactly inspiring. After all, an army of obese troops isn't much of an army. Or is it? All hail the mighty McDonald's army! MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! 

[Mars]

Tell that to the Germans
http://www.reuters.com/article/oddlyEnoughNews/idUSN0447168320080304

[Turambar]

nobody who is fighting for this country is actually working in the country's best interests.  they're fighting and dying to line the pockets of individuals who are already obscenely rich.

the only time i'd pick up a weapon for this country is for a defensive war.

[BloodEagle]

the only time i'd pick up a weapon for this country is for a defensive war.

No argument there.

[MP-Ryan]

*cough*

The FinCEN report:  http://www.fincen.gov/fin-2008-a002.html
The State Department Press Release:  http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2008/mar/102437.htm

[Mefustae]

For crying out loud, conscription is not going to happen. End of story.

In the past few decades, the US has learned that a volunteer army allows them to completely avoid the problems that plagued the country during the Vietnam era. Sure, with a population of 200 million plus, there's a rather nice pool to draw from, but the infrastructure needed to not only handle the influx of new people but actually forge them into a useful fighting force... well, I just think that the current US social and economic climate just can't cope without some serious, serious problems.

If it came to a draft, I most certainly would volunteer before I'm drafted.

I might not like the US's current foreign policy, but it's still my country. If I went anywhere else I'd either be a stupid, rich, vulnerable Westerner or a backwater yank. If some-idiot-on-high decided to go to war with Iran, the US will need all the troops it can get.

braver than me...

No, as Turambar said, just dumber. Too many people these days mistake courage for abject stupidity.

[Nuclear1]

So you're saying everyone who joined the US military voluntarily (read: none of the "jail or army" types) are idiots?

[Kosh]

For crying out loud, conscription is not going to happen. End of story.

McCain said if he was elected president he would increase the size of the army by 100,000. With recruiting the way it is (namely they constantly fall way short of their quotas), how else will they get so many new people?


EDIT: BTW nuclear, why did you join?

[Nuclear1]

About a hundred reasons.

It pays for education, keeps me in shape, provides health care for a family when the time comes, etc etc

Plus being paid to go to school on the California coast and learn a trade that could potentially yield six figures in the civilian world after my service is up isn't bad either.

[Fearless Leader]

...potentially yield six figures in the civilian world after my service is up isn't bad either.

I hear that 

If they started drafting people the military would go down hill fast, morale is low enough without throwing in a bunch of people that have no desire at all to be in in the military. Everyone in now has or at one time had the motivation to serve their country, you cant say that about conscripts. The only reason people even talk about is to because its a scare tactic some politician found a way to say "vote for me and you wont be drafted" without actually saying it

[Mefustae]

So you're saying everyone who joined the US military voluntarily (read: none of the "jail or army" types) are idiots?

Not at all. When someone joins the military, there can be any number of reasons weighing in on that decision. There are some pretty good incentives for military service, and if someone wants to join, more power to them

Except when you join to fight. Volunteering to go where the bullets are doesn't mean that you're brave, it means you're too stupid to be scared.

If they started drafting people the military would go down hill fast, morale is low enough without throwing in a bunch of people that have no desire at all to be in in the military. Everyone in now has or at one time had the motivation to serve their country, you cant say that about conscripts.

Exactly. Bringing back the draft simply wouldn't be worth it. Better to have a volunteer army, where you can silence any objecting soldier with "you volunteered, remember?".

[Fearless Leader]

Exactly. Bringing back the draft simply wouldn't be worth it. Better to have a volunteer army, where you can silence any objecting soldier with "you volunteered, remember?".

lol, it only works till said soldier can say "yeah, but stop-loss started 2 days before I was suppose to get out"

[Rictor]

*cough*

The FinCEN report:  http://www.fincen.gov/fin-2008-a002.html
The State Department Press Release:  http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2008/mar/102437.htm

Yup, that's what I was talking about.
http://japanfocus.org/products/details/2707

These sanctions, if they are enacted as they seem likely to be, would be far more devastating to Iran than any bombing campaign. They are meant to shut down the economy of an entire nation - lock, stock and barrel. Punishing 70 million people for the alleged crimes of a few dozen is both incredibly evil and incredibly stupid. A backwards, starving Iran is a greater threat to security than a prosperous, content Iran.

[Mars]

So you're saying everyone who joined the US military voluntarily (read: none of the "jail or army" types) are idiots?

Not at all. When someone joins the military, there can be any number of reasons weighing in on that decision. There are some pretty good incentives for military service, and if someone wants to join, more power to them

Except when you join to fight. Volunteering to go where the bullets are doesn't mean that you're brave, it means you're too stupid to be scared.

Personal expirience? Or are you just making this up as you go?

[NGTM-1R]

These sanctions, if they are enacted as they seem likely to be, would be far more devastating to Iran than any bombing campaign. They are meant to shut down the economy of an entire nation - lock, stock and barrel. Punishing 70 million people for the alleged crimes of a few dozen is both incredibly evil and incredibly stupid. A backwards, starving Iran is a greater threat to security than a prosperous, content Iran.

Perhaps. But change always comes most effectively in the groundswell from below rather than the lightning bolt from above. It's cruel, and it's evil, certainly, but it's not stupid. If Radical Islam won't feed you...surely you can fill in the rest.