[Charismatic]

I will probably end up *****ing and ranting about life in this topic but eh.
Discussion on the US military. Pros and cons.

I have a friend who is concidering joining the military, for money, travel, experiance in the carear she wants to get into, stuff like that.
Sadly, she mostlikely will join.

I am deadset against it, yet cannot offer a better alternative.
I know many  people that were in the military and are ****ed up.
Jarheads, people getting mentally and emotionally ****ed up. PDS syndrome, social anxiety and fear. I know a guy in college, hes 26, spent only a few years in the military, got a new family, and he has some sort of degenerative back problem. Constant pain, and 26.
My stepdad has arthoritus, and has had 3 hip surgeries. Very painful and i always hear him yell in pain. The military ****s you up, shes too young for this ****.

This that and the other thing, and my opinion on the government\military is complicated and i just dont want her to join. I know people change, and especially with all the dumbass wars were getting into, i fear for her. I dont want her to change, or die. If anyone should go it should be me, tho i hate the military. I hate the fact that if shes in trouble i wont be there, and cannot protect her.

yada yada, you get the jist.
So, Discuss about the Pros, Cons, and alternatives, and about my situation if you feel like it.

[Nuke]

pros, well it has the hardware and isnt afraid to use it. furthermore we kick total ass. that said theyve never had to defend the country so its mostly an assault force. i could forsee problems if they ever had to fight a battle on american soil. of course thats unlikely to happen without us firing off a few nukes in response.

*reads* oh this is about joining the military. well i tried to do that but i was already crazy so they said i couldnt join. but yea i think i just wanted an excuse to kill things. 

[Janos]

pros, well it has the hardware and isnt afraid to use it. furthermore we kick total ass. that said theyve never had to defend the country so its mostly an assault force. i could forsee problems if they ever had to fight a battle on american soil. of course thats unlikely to happen without us firing off a few nukes in response.

*reads* oh this is about joining the military. well i tried to do that but i was already crazy so they said i couldnt join. but yea i think i just wanted an excuse to kill things. 

RAPTORS!!

**** YEAH!!

*gets blown up by an IED*

[StarSlayer]

Probably depends entirely on the branch of service and what she is looking to specialize in.

Pros:
USAF and USN probably have a much lower chance of being involved in direct combat and have more technical opportunities.  The military is a pretty big organization so their are plenty of jobs that don't involve getting blown up by an IED even in direct combat oriented branches like the Corps and Army.  If you can fit into the "culture" of it then you probably will like it and benefit from the experience.

Cons:
Pay is ****, and basically you sign away your freedom for four years.  You sign up and realize its not for you then thier is no turning back.  If your superior ends up being a dick then your stuck with it. Their is no looking for another job, no disobeying orders, you do what your told to do and thats it.  Even though title IX has made pretty strong inroads sexism is still exists.

Its difficult to paint you a decent picture when your using the "military" with such broad stokes.  Depending on her situation i would suggest making a deal where she does a year in the regular work force for a year and if she still feels the need to join up then she can.

[Rian]

On the one hand, I’m all for women taking whatever path they feel is best for them. Your friend sounds like a strong, competent person – she is, after all, making a somewhat unconventional choice. And I hate to say it, but I’m hearing a little condescension on your part. Much as it might pain you to hear it, she probably doesn’t want your protection.

On the other hand, my personal reaction is that the military is a bad choice for most people. I’m inclined to agree with all your arguments there, and I had very similar feelings to yours when a young (male) acquaintance enlisted. He’s being deployed to Iraq next month, and I doubt that he’ll be the same person I knew when he returns. I didn’t know him well enough to talk him out of it, and I didn’t find out about it until it was too late, but I wish that someone had.

If you do end up talking to your friend about this, I would say you need to make it very clear that your objections aren’t because you don’t think she can handle it. Chances are she’s just as capable as any other kid who’s about to make this choice, though I suppose that it could be argued that most of those aren’t really prepared for what they’re getting into either.

[Janos]

the voluntary service has give the united states a domestically unassailable and politically cheap tool for imperialistic policies around the globe

qtiyd

[Charismatic]

She wants to be a nurse or a nurse assistant. Working in hostpitals and stuff. Shes not into the navy or AF, just the regulary Army. Not national guards, but active duty.

Still, they train everyone to be infantryman at first dont they? Teach everyone how to fight. As stated, war or no war, it still ****s up many soldiers bodies for life.

[General Battuta]

She wants to be a nurse or a nurse assistant. Working in hostpitals and stuff. Shes not into the navy or AF, just the regulary Army. Not national guards, but active duty.

Still, they train everyone to be infantryman at first dont they? Teach everyone how to fight. As stated, war or no war, it still ****s up many soldiers bodies for life.

If she's deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, her chances of PTSD will still be quite high. Modern low-intensity war involves psychological stress that past wars (pre-Vietnam) did not.

The initial basic training probably won't do too much damage, so long as she can tolerate the culture.

Her chances of being sexually assaulted do increase in the military. Make sure she knows that she can report any harassment or assault, and that she should do so immediately.

The skills and discipline she'll pick up may be very good to her in the civilian world. It all really depends on her personality and where she's lucky (or unlucky) enough to be assigned.

[Janos]

She wants to be a nurse or a nurse assistant. Working in hostpitals and stuff. Shes not into the navy or AF, just the regulary Army. Not national guards, but active duty.

Still, they train everyone to be infantryman at first dont they? Teach everyone how to fight. As stated, war or no war, it still ****s up many soldiers bodies for life.

If she's deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, her chances of PTSD will still be quite high. Modern low-intensity war involves psychological stress that past wars (pre-Vietnam) did not.

To nitpick that can also indicate that A) the PTSD situation was not researched as throughoutle back then as it was today and B)  to diagnose a patient with PTSD was more... difficult back then.
Even the Wiki page on PTSD has a quote:

The diagnosis was removed from the DSM-II, which resulted in the inability of Vietnam veterans to receive benefits for this condition. In part through the efforts of anti Vietnam war activists and the anti war group Vietnam Veterans Against the War and Chaim F. Shatan, who worked with them and coined the term post-Vietnam Syndrome, the condition was added to the DSM-III as posttraumatic stress disorder.[85]

[General Battuta]

That's fair.

There is some evidence to suggest that modern forms of warfare involve more persistent low-level stress; I just read a paper on it.

But bad diagnoses in the past are definitely a viable alternative.

[Polpolion]

Still, they train everyone to be infantryman at first dont they? Teach everyone how to fight. As stated, war or no war, it still ****s up many soldiers bodies for life.

Yes and no. Everyone takes basic, but that isn't what teaches the infantry how to be infantry. That's AIT, and since she would go to be a nurse, she wouldn't do that unless she wants to be a medic, in which case she would go to AIT and then train to be a medic, and then be deployed. And basic only ****s your body up if you weren't prepared for it.

If it's a choice only between joining the army and changing careers, I'd advise her to join the army for a tour. But chances are there are things she can do other than joining the army to get money and gain experience.

[NGTM-1R]

The only people who recieve unified training along those lines are the Marines.

If she wants to be a nurse or medic, that's not an issue. The Marines don't have their own medical service but use that of the Navy.

[BrotherBryon]

The army does give some basic combat training to all that enlist, that is why its called basic training. Support and other technical jobs then go on to what is called MOS training where they learn their individual skill sets. For Combat line troops, we didn't go to basic. Instead we go through a program that combines both basic training and MOS training in one block. It's generally tougher than regular basic training. As for people coming out of the military with physical problems you'll see that a large portion of those are related to the job they did. I know that armored vehicles such as the M1 Abrams and M3 Bradley are notorious for messing soldiers up. I myself am starting to notice some lower back problems and I'm not even 30 yet. As far as mental problems go, I really imagine that it is going to depend on what job you have and where you're posted. A combat soldier deployed to a war zone is far more likely to develop mental problems than say a radio repair technician who never sees the front lines. I'm not saying that support jobs are not challenging in their own right. Signing up for anything guarantees a lot of long hours and doing a lot of stuff you probably don't want to do and the stress can drive some people crazy but a strong minded person should do just fine. Oh and tell her that if she plays hard ball with the recruiters she can dictate where her first posting will be, as long there is an open position at that post. Just make sure its in the contract or they can send her any where they please.

[Kosh]

If she's going to be a medic it's entirely possible they will stick her up front as a field medic. In Iraq and Afghanistan there's really no such thing as a front line though, since the insurgency will have no hesitations about going behind the lines and ****ing you up.

[BrotherBryon]

Most field medics in my experience were men. Field medics are usually attached to a combat unit and the Army has all ways been reluctant to put females in combat units. The only females I ever saw in any combat unit were in aviation units and most of those were at least warrant officers. Things may have changed since the 2nd gulf war but I doubt it. The only cases I ever heard of females finding them selves in combat situations were in either aviation units or support battalions who suddenly found themselves in an ambush while in a convoy.

[General Battuta]

Most field medics in my experience were men. Field medics are usually attached to a combat unit and the Army has all ways been reluctant to put females in combat units. The only females I ever saw in any combat unit were in aviation units and most of those were at least warrant officers. Things may have changed since the 2nd gulf war but I doubt it. The only cases I ever heard of females finding them selves in combat situations were in either aviation units or support battalions who suddenly found themselves in an ambush while in a convoy.

There was a female medic who won a medal for conduct under fire last year (or the year before) -- sounds like she did a hell of a job, including covering wounded soldiers with rifle fire.

I believe the article discussing the events suggested that female soldiers, particularly medics, often found themselves in combat simply because -- as Kosh said -- there aren't any front lines any more.

[Nuclear1]

Alright, as a member of the military (USAF but stationed on an Army post), I feel like I should say something here.

First of all, basic training. It's rough, not going to lie. Make sure she knows what she's getting into. About.com US Military has a wonderful section on it called "What Your Recruiter Never Told You" and a weekly email that gives you steps to prepare for basic. I read them before I joined them and did fine. Also, be very physically fit going into it. If she doesn't already work out several times a week, she should--aerobic and nonaerobic. I don't remember the exact stats for Army Physical Fitness Test, but it's not easy if you go in eating ding dongs and popcorn all day.

Secondly, the job itself. I'm not directly involved with any medical staff where I am except when I have a medical appointment, which I actually have at the local USAF base. Still, remember this: medics are out on patrol with the infantry. Nurses and nurse assistants stay behind the barbed wire or in field hospitals where their chances of being hurt in an attack are astronomically fewer. Deployment is not easy. It's extremely stressful, but the military does everything possible to relieve it before during and after. Believe me, they do a good job.

On the subject of combat, in addition to what I just said, ngtm1r is dead on. Only Marines put all their members through that sort of training: MCT. Army does not.

It's undeniably rewarding though. The new GI Bill is wonderful, and having all your meals, medical, dental, and housing paid for is great. The experience will pay off. You make friends you'll always keep in touch with, and you get to see the world on the government's dime.

Sorry to sound like a recruiter, which I'm trying not to do, but I felt I should give some advice.

[iamzack]

My parents were both officers in the USMC. That you end up obeying orders from people like them is one really, really good reason not to join. :P

[Dilmah G]

Well my uncle was in the Commando Regiment of the Sri Lankan Army, and I'd like to say firstly, as nuclear1 said before, basically the army is NOT the epic ****hole everyone thinks it is, where women get raped on a regular basis and you can expect to be beaten weekly. But you have to posses some kind of will and 'toughness' to succed in the military. People like Ned Flanders for example would not last a day in the military if he was for some obscure reason posted to an infantry division. They're going to shout at her and they will make her feel like she wants to quit in basic, but that's part of training, really proves how much you want to go through with this.

Personally, I don't feel that the military as a career choice is 'bad' as such, but it's definetely not for everyone. And as a nurse, all your friend will have to do is get used to the 'culture' in the military, if she doesn't like being told what to do- tell her to get over it, because not complying with orders yields some undesirable consequences. If she's okay with blood and gore, and has some appreciation for the service, she should be fine. And by the way, MAKE SURE SHE DOESN'T DO ANYTHING PVT. HAYES-esque, basically everyone in the US army knows what that is, and I won't risk elaborating on it here. From what I've been told by people I know who've served, as far as combat goes, it's not a pleasant place, especially after the adrenaline wears off and you realise what you're doing. However if your friend ever does decide to change her career preferences and become a medic/corpsman or any other job that involves being on the frontlines, no doubt the army will prepare her adequately for it, after all, it is in the military's best interests their soldiers come back alive.

[Mika]

I'm personally very much against sending women to front lines. Stories about women getting raped are also true to some part. But I don't believe there is beating involved, unless one specifically wants to go to special forces. Does US Army provide statistics for these cases? I recall reading several newspaper stories about this happening, but cannot provide links without Google searching - which I'm not interested in at the moment.

Other than that, there are multiple interesting positions for women in other places of Army. I would also recommend trying to find a civilian job first and keeping the Army possibility open if it turns out to be necessary.

Mika