[Vir Gnarus]

Been interested in gettin a friend to experience the joy that is Freespace 2, but got a small predicament. When using MediaVPs, I see the updated graphics (textures, lighting, models, etc) in tech room, but in missions briefings and during missions they are reverted to their old counterparts. Checked for a good while on forums to find if anyone else has the issue. I only saw one instance similar, and that's the FAQ mentioning that if you don't see graphical updates in campaign, reselect mediavps in MOD in the launcher. Did that, also switched to no mod and back to that, clicked apply first, etc. etc. . No go.

I made sure to use the latest MediaVPs and the patch included (3.6.10) along with latest launcher (5.5e) and whatnot. Though I had to use StandaloneFixes-1.7z in order to fix the game lockin up just by trying to get into the tech room. Even when reverting back to the original .exes, I only get that lockup again at tech room but no change in the campaign briefing nor during mission.

[The E]

Could you run a debug build and then post the fs2_open.log from your data folder? Also, what is this StandaloneFixes-1.7z ?

[Vir Gnarus]

Thanks for the reply, lad. Much obliged.

Anyways, I've attached the log file appropriately. If you're wondering what's goin on, during debug I did the following:

1. Went to Main Hall
2. Entered tech room (saw the new models n stuff)
3. Exited tech room and went to campaign, first level of FS2 campaign.
4. Checked models in briefing, and saw they were NOT the new models. Exited briefing.
5. Checked Tech Room again to confirm that I wasn't blind, and see without doubt the models in briefing were in fact old.
5. Exited Tech room. Exited game.

Also, StandaloneFixes-1.7z is a bunch of the FSO exes obviously modified to fix some errors of some sort. I remember why I used it now, so to fix what I thought was a connection issue to FS2NETD, which apparently is cuz it's down (DURP), but strangely I thought it fixed the tech room lockup. Replacing them with the original 3.6.10 .exes and the tech room lockup magically disappeared. Weird. Anyways, it is not used any longer, but the problem with the old models poppin up in missions/briefing still is recurring.

If you're still ever curious bout the standalonefixes, here's the link to the thread I got it from:
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=55230.0

Though it no longer has any relevance to this situation.

Once again, thanks for the patience you endure with me on this matter.

[attachment deleted by Tolwyn]

[General Battuta]

This is absolutely bizarre. 

Why would the MediaVP models show up in the techroom and not in-game? Launching the mission (not justing looking at the briefing icons), can you verify that the models are, in fact, old?

What about when you enter the shiplab (press F2 or F3 or something around there)?

[The E]

Hmmm.

To be honest, the error you're describing should never, EVER happen. The models displayed in the tech room are exactly the same ones that should be used in the missions and briefings. Now, what could happen is that your detail settings (in the in-game options menu) are set ridiculously low. Make sure they are maxed out.
If that's not the cause, could you please take a few screenshots?

Now, I see you don't have ship_choice_3d enabled. Try that as well by marking the checkbox "Use models for ship selection" in the Launcher's feature tab (list type "Gameplay"). Without that, you would get the old bitmap images retail uses, instead of the actual models.

PS: Regarding the standalonefixes thing: Please don't download builds that old. Check the multiplayer and FSO support boards first.

[Vir Gnarus]

Mmk, well guess what, I did a comparison of without mediavps and with, and it turns out it was just a thing with the lighting. They are in fact the new models, but the lack of proper lighting during briefing and whatnot compared to the tech room gave the illusion they were old. So I pretty much just threw everyone - including myself - into a loop here. Forgive me for any hairs torn or headaches accrued.

However I do want to mention another issue that popped up during this. Attempting to enter a mission with the mediavps active using the newest version of the FSO exes locks up the game every time soon as I click that "Commit" button. Even the Tech room will lock up on the occasional change of ship model (randomly it seems). Yet what seems to fix all of this? Viola, the old standalonefixes-1.7z. Missions run without a hassle there, and I see no instability in neither briefing room nor tech room. Now I doubt I'm getting the best out of FSO using old exes, but I can't understand why these would work and not the newer. Should I just stick with these old ones, like an "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" scenario?

I'm thinkin of startin another thread on the matter, since it's unrelated to the first issue. Yet if the solution is simple I'll stick to here.

[The E]

Waaaaait a minute. First of all, that standalonefixes build is old enough that I suspect it to actually be incompatible in multiplayer with the builds currently in use.

Now, when you say "locks up", what do you mean? And can you reproduce that with a debug build and then post the log?

[Vir Gnarus]

When I press "Commit", the game sounds like it does something for maybe 5-10 seconds, then absolutely nothing, finally giving an error that the program is unresponsive. I may occasionally even get to see one frame of the actual mission, but it's frozen solid. Music still running, but nothing.

During this debug test, I tried to even just enter Tech room with it freezing. I waited a few minutes before finally just shuttin it down.

Might as well just throw out some basic details as well:

OS: Win7 RC
VCard: Radeon X1300
Ram: 1.3 GB
CPU: AMD Athlon XP 2.1 GHz
MediaVPs: 3.6.10 (with 3610_Patch)
FSO: 3.6.10
Launcher: 5.5e


[attachment deleted by Tolwyn]

[The E]

Hmm....One thing you should do is updating the drivers to at least Catalyst 9.3.
Also, try disabling GLSL in the Launcher (it's under Troubleshooting). Yes, the game will not look as awesome, but this sounds to me like a driver issue more than anything.

Another thing to try would be to grab the latest nightly build, and try that one.

[Vir Gnarus]

I suppose the nightly build permits multiplayer, at least over direct ip?

I would like to try Catalyst 9.3, but the latest vista-based drivers that support my card range is 8.12. Everything else ATI has made only for the HD series of ATI cards. Believe me, I tried everything to get catalyst drivers working on windows 7.

The GLSL thing does the trick, so I'm gonna have to go with that until ATI gets in shape and makes Windows 7 drivers for its cards, which won't ever happen. Or wait until someone finds a fix for it. Dunno.

Anyways, thanks a lot lad for the help.

[The E]

I didn't realize that ATi had cut off support for the 1300 cards at 8.12 (I use a 1250, and they cut off those at 9.3). May they be eternally damned for it.

Now, the nightly builds work perfectly in multiplayer (and they will work more perfectly once FS2NetD comes back online).

If you want to play Multi, I would recommend heading over to the HLP IRC channel (link is in my sig), there are usually a few people there who are willing and able to play.

PS: That's the last time you get to call me "lad".

[Herra Tohtori]

Okay, so you use a Radeon X1300. I don't know if this is related, but Radeon X1600-1900 series cards are unable to run the FS2_Open's implementation of GLSL in a stable way except with a rather old driver, and we're talking about Catalyst 6 series old driver here. Might be same sort of issues here, but I'm not completely sure.

For Windows XP, there is a quick dirty fix - installing the latest driver and then regurgitating an older driver's OpenGL DLL file into FS2_Open root directory.

Unfortunately for Vista and 7 users, this does not work because the DLL in question is a WinXP image, and thus Vista and 7 will complain that it is not a valid Windows image.


In other words, you're boned if this is the case.

Without a hardware upgrade you would have to revert to Windows XP or use -no_glsl command line option. The earlier is something I doubt you would be willing to do, and the latter will make the game work but without the latest graphical goodies like normal mapping and other eventual results of the shader system.

Maybe you should exchange some liquid currency to a new GPU. It doesn't even need to be particularly new; something like a GeForce 8800 GT would probably be fairly cheap these days and would be an upgrade from the Radeon X1300, and it would let you play the game to full extent quite easily.

EDIT: I am almost 100% positive that this is what you are experiencing. Read this post to find out what's going on.

Basically, ATi did something a little different that they considered a better solution, and managed to make the drivers of the time so that they could tell their cards had Shader Model 3 support. Then later on they changed their drivers and the new drivers don't work the same as the old ones, so the FreeSpace shaders will not work correctly.

 

[Vir Gnarus]

Definitely appreciate the consistent support on the matter. It's definitely reassuring to see individuals that are persistent in helpin others. Quite certainly a step up in my book. And don't take the 'lad' thing personally, I mean it solely by gender, not age.

As for the X series, they didn't completely shut off the series by drivers, but compatibility got seriously degraded with the Catalyst 9 drivers, with the newest ones completely omitting support for anything other than HD series, period. Only the Catalyst 8 drivers and older will even go so far as to install OpenGL, whereas you're left barren with more recent drivers. They might consider making Catalyst Windows 7 drivers support older cards, but seeing as anything not an HD received legacy status, I wouldn't put my money on it.

Tested the night builds, no difference really. Same scenario. It really isn't that I'm missing all that much, what I have accessible right now is still light years ahead of the old engine, so I'm still pretty content.

Again, thanks a mil.