[Topgun]

Pirating is bad.

no more pirating from me
unless its abandonware.... or games that i won't buy anyways.... oh, and music, cus that's just like recording the radio... well I will pirate less!
that makes me a good person, right?

also, open-source FTW

[NGTM-1R]

You are a part of the rebel alliance and a traitor.

Take him away!

[Mr. Vega]

You have to follow the Utilitarian philosophy if you want to excuse/justify piracy, according to Kantian-style morality it's just wrong, period.

[Flipside]

What's the obsession with Caps-Lock titles on threads?

[TESLA]

What's the obsession with Caps-Lock titles on threads?

seconded

tis annoying

[Ford Prefect]

You are a part of the rebel alliance and a traitor.

Take him away!

I don't know why, but I lol'd.

[Topgun]

What's the obsession with Caps-Lock titles on threads?

seconded

tis annoying

BAH! just for you.


anyway, yeah, the people that create hacks, torrent software/networks ect should put that skill into making good open-source software. software for the people, by the people, for free.
but NO, they go and make the world a worse place stealing people's software!

JUST think of all the people that could get together and make a great game engine. a game that anyone can have, edit, and improve. imagine HOW AWESOME that would be!

[BloodEagle]

anyway, yeah, the people that create hacks, torrent software/networks ect should put that skill into making good open-source software. software for the people, by the people, for free.
but NO, they go and make the world a worse place stealing people's software!

You mean illegal copying, not stealing. Right? Because there's no actual theft involved.

JUST think of all the people that could get together and make a great game engine. a game that anyone can have, edit, and improve. imagine HOW AWESOME that would be!

Pretty awful, actually. I've seen some of the attempts, and they weren't pretty.

[Topgun]

anyway, yeah, the people that create hacks, torrent software/networks ect should put that skill into making good open-source software. software for the people, by the people, for free.
but NO, they go and make the world a worse place stealing people's software!

You mean illegal copying, not stealing. Right? Because there's no actual theft involved.

JUST think of all the people that could get together and make a great game engine. a game that anyone can have, edit, and improve. imagine HOW AWESOME that would be!

Pretty awful, actually. I've seen some of the attempts, and they weren't pretty.

stealing, illegal copying, it doesn't matter what you call it, the end result is the same.
The reason open-source games fail is becuase they don't have the manpower to get the games up to commercial standards
but think about this. its hard to make a crack. it takes a team of very, very talented programmers to make a crack without the source code, especially when software companies deliberately try to make it hard.
yet, there is a crack for almost every freaking game! most of which come out days before the game is actually released!
and that's just the crack devs! that doesn't include the

• Torrent software devs
• Torrent website devs
• console modders
• and anyone else involved in pirating games

if all that manpower and skill were to go into making just a couple of games, there would be serious competition for retail games devs. so you know what the software devs will have to do to keep up? lower their prices and increase their quality. the end result is that we get better games, and more free and legal choices.

[iamzack]

Wouldn't that be like trying to grab a bunch of talented but delinquent graffiti artists off the street and trying to get them to make one pretty mural of a serene landscape?

[MR_T3D]

anyway, yeah, the people that create hacks, torrent software/networks ect should put that skill into making good open-source software. software for the people, by the people, for free.
but NO, they go and make the world a worse place stealing people's software!

You mean illegal copying, not stealing. Right? Because there's no actual theft involved.

JUST think of all the people that could get together and make a great game engine. a game that anyone can have, edit, and improve. imagine HOW AWESOME that would be!

Pretty awful, actually. I've seen some of the attempts, and they weren't pretty.

stealing, illegal copying, it doesn't matter what you call it, the end result is the same.
The reason open-source games fail is becuase they don't have the manpower to get the games up to commercial standards
but think about this. its hard to make a crack. it takes a team of very, very talented programmers to make a crack without the source code, especially when software companies deliberately try to make it hard.
yet, here is a crack for almost every freaking game! most of which come out days before the game is actually realized!
and that's just the crack devs! that doesn't include the

• Torrent software devs
• Torrent website devs
• console modders
• and anyone eels involved in pirating games

if all that manpower and skill were to go into making just a couple of games, there would be serious competition for retail games devs. so you know what the software devs will have to do to keep up? lower their prices and increase their quality. the end result is that we get better games, and more free and legal choices.

Its really amazing what people could do if motivated, and if someone were able to control all these people...
nice to hear someone else with morality, though, I will admit i have been temped recently to pirate ****, but i've been holding back temptation, and this thread has helped that.

What's the obsession with Caps-Lock titles on threads?

seconded

tis annoying

I kind of like the look of caps lock for titles or emphasis, and if a person does over-emphasis their speech, I'd like to see it translated to their posting.

[Topgun]

Wouldn't that be like trying to grab a bunch of talented but delinquent graffiti artists off the street and trying to get them to make one pretty mural of a serene landscape?

I am not saying it can be done, in fact, I know it can't be done on a large scale. but if I can get others to come to the same conclusion that I have, even if its just a few people, it would be worth it.

also, its a bit more like getting delinquent graffiti artists to do the same thing (more or less) they where doing before, the only difference is that it takes more determination (seeing as how making an open-source product is one big project, as opposed to what they are doing, a bunch of little projects)

[iamzack]

Making a game and making a premade game available are pretty different..

[Topgun]

programming is programming, even if its one big project, or a bunch of little ones.
and programming is 99% of software development.

[CP5670]

Cracks aren't only used by pirates, you know. I have always bought all my games (except very old abandonware stuff), but I never get anything these days until I can confirm that a working crack is available. I would have given up on modern games a while ago if the crackers hadn't been around to make the games usable.

[Topgun]

I know, I use cracks for all my recent games if I bought them or not, I don't want any DRM. but my argument still stands. crackers make and distribute their cracks for free, presumably to make society a better place or whatever. I say that their time would be better spent making games free legally, by helping open-source projects.
and besides, just like I said, there will always be hackers.

[blackhole]

Open source software doesn't pay the bills.

[Topgun]

neither does making cracks (they do it for free right?)

[Goober5000]

What's the obsession with Caps-Lock titles on threads?

seconded

tis annoying

Says the guy with an all-caps username.

anyway, yeah, the people that create hacks, torrent software/networks ect should put that skill into making good open-source software. software for the people, by the people, for free.
but NO, they go and make the world a worse place stealing people's software!

You mean illegal copying, not stealing. Right? Because there's no actual theft involved.

QFT.  Theft is depriving someone of something that is rightfully his.  If Alice copies a music track from Bob, Bob still has it, and Alice hasn't deprived him of anything.  It can't be equated to historical piracy because historical piracy involved theft.

That said, if something is morally permissible yet illegal, you probably shouldn't do it.

Open source software doesn't pay the bills.

But providing technical support for it does.

(That could be interpreted in a number of ways...)

[Thaeris]

Open source is indeed very nice. The only problem is I'm not skilled enough as a coder to be of any worth whatsoever to enhancing the source code. In time, though...

I've never pirated software to my knowledge, and don't intend to start. The only grey area is abandonware, which I've got no problem with. No normal person buys 10-15 year-old computer programs when the company which made them doesn't even exist anymore! ...Or, if it does, doesn't make the game any more, leaving you no choice but to buy it at often ludicrous prices (look at FS/FS2), or be stuck with software you can't run because of hardware/software compatibility issues. The only notable exception to this is probably WarCraft[insert number here] and StarCraft, which will be alive and kicking for the forseeable future. And seeing as you can now buy those titles from the parent company for very low prices, there's no reason not to.

Companies like LA and EA are really quite dim in so fervently protecting their archaic IP while not giving users the opportunity to rationally procure the software in question. That practice actually encourages piracy... Because no site like Abandonia will leave a protected title up for download, I can't get some of those neat old titles which I always wanted to try like Rebellion or TIE-Fighter. Heck, even DS is sensible enough to release the stuff too old to sell!
 
Besides, buying the real thing often is sooo much more reliable than getting the hacked version. Of course, that's really quite variable, as I don't have any titles modern enough to have that rediculously invasive DRM garbage. Most of the time it's just "insert the disk to play," after all...