[Rga_Noris]

Okay, so I always like debris, but what always got me was how ships always blew up in the exact same way. What about seperate debris sets?

An example scenario:

You shoot a Uly down, and the engine randomly selects one of the debris sets. Now, normally, the fighter would break into 4-5 chunks, but this time you see the firey explosion followed by the site of the left wing spiraling away from the rest of the now lifeless ship. It just gives some options to how things go boom. Same for capships.

I figured it would go like so when naming subobjects:

Set 1:
debris01-1
debris02-1
debris03-1

Set 2:

debris01-2
debris02-2
debris03-2

And we get the point....

Anywho, I'm no coder, so I really have no idea what I'm really asking, but I might as well through it out there.

[mjn.mixael]

Hrmmm... Interesting idea... More work for the modeller, but could be pretty neat.

[chief1983]

The FotG team has been hoping for more ways to make TIEs blow up, so this sounds cool

[JGZinv]

I offer an alternative or linking idea.

Instead of having to make all new debris, have the existing system randomly select
which debris actually get produced on death of the ship.

So say you have ship with:

debris01-1
debris02-1
debris03-1
debris04-1
debris05-1
debris06-1
debris07-1

One death it uses
debris03-1
debris06-1
debris07-1

Another death it uses
debris02-1
debris05-1
debris07-1

...and so on.

This way you get your randomness in space junk, and don't need additional debris for
existing ships.

[Rga_Noris]

Well you wouldn't need multiple sets... It would just be cool to have.

And the alternative is good, but gives less control. You couldn't actually change how a ship fractures, just which peices become visible, and this would force less debris for current ships.

Addind additional sets would allow the modder to use the feature without affecting current ships.

[Galemp]

Doesn't the engine do this already, having some debris chunks detonate as soon as they are spawned?

[The E]

Yeah, debris lifetime is essentially randomized.

[Nuke]

i kinda like it, but modeling is getting hard enough already.

[Rga_Noris]

Okay, you don't HAVE to add multiple sets... it would in no way be required. Hell, you currently don't have to have ANY debris, so I do not see why the increase in work load should effect the decision to have this feature in anyway.

[JGZinv]

It's just that little gets produced as is, so telling a modeler to go make
X amount of more debris, because you want to have randomized debris,
probably adds to slowdown of getting something "finished" - and thus makes
folks tired just thinking about it.

[chief1983]

Nonsense, just say you're maintaining compatibility with 3.6.12

[Rga_Noris]

It's just that little gets produced as is, so telling a modeler to go make
X amount of more debris, because you want to have randomized debris,
probably adds to slowdown of getting something "finished" - and thus makes
folks tired just thinking about it.

So the solution is to have no ability to do it? You're essentially saying that because an OPTIONAL feature that would improve visual quality may add OPTIONAL extra work, that we should just take away the option? Keep it as is? It's one thing to forgo a feature because visual impact would be minimal AND REQUIRE extra work, but another for one that only adds an option.

Besides, I'm well aware of the many request the community frequently makes to WIP. Modders need to learn to say "tough", especially considering the nature of my request would only offer a small amount of visual appeal, and would be entirely optional.

This is all moot of course should no coder want to code it.

[sigtau]

Well, if it stays optional... I say go for it.  Sounds like it'd be easy to code, though test-casing may require someone who can go through the full process of modeling, UV mapping, texturing, normal mapping, and POFing.

[JGZinv]

@Noris... I was explaining why you're getting the killjoy responses seen elseware
in the thread... not saying the proposal is flawed.

Optional is typically good.

[Rga_Noris]

@Noris... I was explaining why you're getting the killjoy responses seen elseware
in the thread... not saying the proposal is flawed.

Optional is typically good.

Erm... I knew that. 

[chief1983]

JGZInv's suggestion could probably be done with just a +Max Chunks: option under $Debris.  Instead of using all chunks, it could just pick a random number from the set.  Those could be combined, it could be a random chunk from a retail-like set, or from one of the subsets Noris is talking about.  If Max Chunks is higher than the number available, no biggie, just use as many as you have in the set.

[Rga_Noris]

The issue I see there is outlined with the following scenario, presuming I'm getting what your writing.

So we have two sets, one is the retail, one is another set designed to make the Uly appear as though it cracked in half, with the left wing seperating from the main body.

Uly Go BOOM! Engine picks debris01-1 (the cockpit) as one of the randomly chosen debris, but then chooses debris02-2 from the second set, which contains the main body and the right wing in that chunk, so the player gets to see two cockpits sail through space.

That's why I think multiple sets would provide the most options.

[Nuke]

maybe i was exaggerating the work involved. debris is fairly easy (and somewhat fun) to make in max with a combination of the slice tool and the ripple tool. cut up your model with slice, then do a cap holes modifier on each of the piece. you might need to use target weld to clean up the resulting edge. select the new polygons (max does this for you) and use the ripple feature to distort them somewhat and make it look like the break was more random than along a plane. i also do a weld pass with about a 0.1 threshold so as to remove any micro polies and bring together any near verts, and also to chop down the detail abit. then you uv map those new polygons and apply some generic damage texture.

[chief1983]

No you misunderstood, I didn't clarify.  If there's only a retail set, it would just pick from that.  If there's multiple sets of debris, it would pick all the chunks from the same set.

[Rga_Noris]

No you misunderstood, I didn't clarify.  If there's only a retail set, it would just pick from that.  If there's multiple sets of debris, it would pick all the chunks from the same set.

Okay, that makes sense. I suppose the only issue I would have is that if it picked from a retail, or single-debris-set-pof (SDSP), then the modders original intentions of how much debris would be shown is going to be altered, unless it would pick the entire set. SDSP's would get four or five or whatever. But so long as it was controlled be a table flag then I guess it wouldn't effect SDSP's... so I mooted my own point. YAY ME.