[headdie]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

If it follows on from all other duke nukems then I have no doubt it will provide plenty of blow big **** up moments

[StarSlayer]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

I tend to think its best bet is to forgo putting on airs and embrace the over the top 90s vibe and really ham it up.  If its going stand out from being another generic brown FPS I think it needs to go for the throwback "Expendables" kind of idea.

That or they could create the game from Yahtzee's review.

[Scotty]

It's The Expendables concept brought to video game consoles.  It's not original.  It's not especially intelligent, but it sure as hell will be satisfying.

[SpardaSon21]

Yep.  Strippers, pig cops, acceptable collateral damage being whatever you want, and of course, one-liners.

[Mongoose]

Hell, I've been dying to play the original Duke 3D for a long time now.  I really need to buy that off GOG.

[achtung]

Hell, I've been dying to play the original Duke 3D for a long time now.  I really need to buy that off GOG.

Do that then pick up EDuke32 and the hi-res pack.

[Unknown Target]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

Seriously. I'm tired of this "games are art" bull**** that the industry these days keeps trying to push. Let us blow some **** up and laugh about it with friends - that's gaming. It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be while your protagonist is selflessly throwing himself in front of a cart of nuns and getting shots with bullets made of blood from his ex-wife that was brutally murdered in an in-game cutscene.

[headdie]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

Seriously. I'm tired of this "games are art" bull**** that the industry these days keeps trying to push. Let us blow some **** up and laugh about it with friends - that's gaming. It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be while your protagonist is selflessly throwing himself in front of a cart of nuns and getting shots with bullets made of blood from his ex-wife that was brutally murdered in an in-game cutscene.

[Kosh]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

Seriously. I'm tired of this "games are art" bull**** that the industry these days keeps trying to push. Let us blow some **** up and laugh about it with friends - that's gaming. It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be while your protagonist is selflessly throwing himself in front of a cart of nuns and getting shots with bullets made of blood from his ex-wife that was brutally murdered in an in-game cutscene.

I think that some games should be works of art like FS1&2 while others should be just fun like duke 3d. This way there's a game for your every mood.

[CP5670]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

Seriously. I'm tired of this "games are art" bull**** that the industry these days keeps trying to push. Let us blow some **** up and laugh about it with friends - that's gaming. It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be while your protagonist is selflessly throwing himself in front of a cart of nuns and getting shots with bullets made of blood from his ex-wife that was brutally murdered in an in-game cutscene.

You guys are missing the point. I'm not saying that a good game needs to have any deep story or gameplay (although in fact, these fast-paced, unrealistic FPSs usually have better gameplay and more varied weapons than the semi-realistic ones), but that there are plenty of other games that do this kind of gameplay very well. DNF certainly looks like it will be a fun game, but it's not going to be the revolutionary hit that DN3D was in 1996.

[SpardaSon21]

Can't you have fun works of art that aren't maudlin, e.g. FS1/2?

[Kosh]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

Seriously. I'm tired of this "games are art" bull**** that the industry these days keeps trying to push. Let us blow some **** up and laugh about it with friends - that's gaming. It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be while your protagonist is selflessly throwing himself in front of a cart of nuns and getting shots with bullets made of blood from his ex-wife that was brutally murdered in an in-game cutscene.

You guys are missing the point. I'm not saying that a good game needs to have a story or deep gameplay (in fact, these fast-paced, unrealistic FPSs usually have better gameplay and more varied weapons than the semi-realistic ones), but that there are plenty of other games that do this kind of gameplay very well. DNF certainly looks like it will be a fun game, but it's not going to the revolutionary hit that DN3D was in 1996.

How was DN3d revolutionary? Most of the groundwork had already been done by Doom, some 3 years earlier.

[headdie]

Even if this actually comes out, I can't see how it would impress anyone today (aside from the fact that it was released). It seems like a fun game but will essentially be just another FPS. It had to have been released 10 years ago to stand out in any way. Duke himself won't be much of a selling point today, especially to all the console gamers. Many of them have only heard of Duke at all because of the delays on this game.

Why does every game have to "impress" people?  Sometimes you just want to relax and blow **** up, and I imagine this game will provide that in spades.

Seriously. I'm tired of this "games are art" bull**** that the industry these days keeps trying to push. Let us blow some **** up and laugh about it with friends - that's gaming. It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be while your protagonist is selflessly throwing himself in front of a cart of nuns and getting shots with bullets made of blood from his ex-wife that was brutally murdered in an in-game cutscene.

You guys are missing the point. I'm not saying that a good game needs to have a story or deep gameplay (in fact, these fast-paced, unrealistic FPSs usually have better gameplay and more varied weapons than the semi-realistic ones), but that there are plenty of other games that do this kind of gameplay very well. DNF certainly looks like it will be a fun game, but it's not going to the revolutionary hit that DN3D was in 1996.

How was DN3d revolutionary? Most of the groundwork had already been done by Doom, some 3 years earlier.

It wasn't though I would have said it was closer to quake in that it had jumping, crouching and maps with rooms above rooms.

[Mika]

It's about being fun, not how brilliant your orchestral score full of weeping orphans can be

Now that you mentioned it, I do think that the audio side in terms of in game music is, well I can't even put words to it, but it isn't anymore what it used to be. Back then a lot of the action tracks were really catchy and you would find yourself whistling them time by time. Maybe it is not so anymore because games are not supposed to be arcadey or something. Yeah, title tracks when the main menu opens are usually good, but I'm talking about in-game music here.

What's wrong in doing in-game music like they did in Wing Commander II, Journey to Silius, Turrican and Great Giana Sisters? Come to think of it, what's the problem in doing games like those nowadays?

Back to topic, I don't mind automatic health regeneration that much (though I like the medkits more), but it's the two weapon limit in the trailer that boggles mind. 3D Realms says that they changed the interface because they couldn't find a nice way to switch weapons with a console controller.  George Broussard mentioned that they had compensated it in level design - I don't know how well this could keep up the immersion. I do hope that Gearbox switches it back to all guns available at least for PC. I understand that this is a good choice for multiplayer where consoles would otherwise be in disadvantage, but for single player campaign in PC, I'm most likely not going to like it unless they manage to do it tremendously well.

Perhaps it is about characterization and in game rules that should be clear from the beginning. Duke is supposed to be a massive one man army so all guns available at any given time sounds reasonable by the in-game logic. However, CoD4 and FarCry 2 are supposed to be more realistic with limited carry capacity, which kicks the player back in the nadgers when he realizes that in order to frag some one, three(!) sniper shots to head are required (yes in multi). I left the game after I had lined up a perfectly good shot right to the back of the head, stabilized for a couple of seconds, shot and hit the guy only to be killed a fraction of a second later by the exact same player emptying the clip at my present location. Well, it was highly unusual and I didn't even think the game could allow that. I haven't touched either of the games after that. So perhaps it's about consistency?

[Scotty]

Perhaps, because any sniper rifle in COD4 will kill someone with a head shot unless they're using Juggernaut.  And then, if you're using stopping power, it will anyway.

[Mika]

Perhaps, because any sniper rifle in COD4 will kill someone with a head shot unless they're using Juggernaut.  And then, if you're using stopping power, it will anyway.

I think the example was from Far Cry 2 multi. There were other dumb things in COD4 multi. Note that I'm not saying they were bad games; they both had something that I liked, while they both also had some monumentally bad WTF moments. Far Cry 2 I liked graphically better, it felt more vivid (on those fields played), also I liked the rate of the game play, i.e. not too fast, not too slow. But with weapons mostly shooting peas, I really wanted to punch through that somebody else's new LCD display in LAN party after having been wasted by a guy I ambushed and shot through back of his head with a sniper rifle. From 50 meters away.

COD4 weapon effectiveness felt better, and the recoil seems a lot better. But it ends with guns and goes wrong with grenades. I don't know, after I shot a grenade in to a room that I knew had a couple of enemies inside and started to run to gun the survivors undoubtedly rolling on the floor in immense pain (if not shrapnel, then bursted ear drums), what did I get? For heavens sake, they were both on the ****ing same position and the grenade hadn't done anything! They weren't even thrown to floor! Result: immediate ownage (me) and almost a broken keyboard! Yeah, I also got pwned by a knife wielding bastard that managed to sneak next to me, but again, for a game with a such incredible sound effects, I suspected they had implemented footsteps. Experience said that if somebody is coming from the side over that wall there, he's bound to make noise that I will hear it. But no... And just what is the reason for putting tracers in those guns in daytime, to make spotting the shooter easier? And don't get me started on those air strikes.

Yes, I found CoD4 multi even more irritating than Far Cry 2's. I actually became so agitated I had to leave that LAN party. The problem was consistency. When a lot of things look realistic first, I expect it to apply elsewhere. And usually end up getting pwned for this reason and it really does become irritating after a while. The other downer was that the LAN party host couldn't find the respawn controls for CoD4 and the result was a hyperactive mess with dead people respawning in about two seconds very close to the place they died.

Luckily I don't own either of those games. Terrible gaming experience so to say. I hope that DNF will be a lot better in this respect. At least I hope they make it consistent so that it doesn't continuously let players down. If they throw realism out of window, then keep throwing it out.

[Turambar]

Pretty much everyone in this thread should go ahead and get Bulletstorm when that comes out.

I've put in an 88 hour week doing testing and i'm still not sick of it.

[Unknown Target]

Can't you have fun works of art that aren't maudlin, e.g. FS1/2?

*slap*

Freespace isn't art. It's a video game. You shoot aliens and make things go boom. Video games trying to be art is just gamer nerds trying to have something to be pretentious about. Why are suddenly *now* people discussing games being art? Because they've gotten popular enough so people might consider them that? Since when has art been (ostensibly) about a critical mass of people going "yup, that's art" (get out of here Impressionists/Modernists)? Back when Freespace was being made, there was no debate about whether or not it was "art" - Volition was making a video game for people to blow up aliens in, nothing more.

So tired of all this extra bull crap being attached to something that was never supposed to be that pretentious.

[General Battuta]

Why is art pretentious? If a picture of colored soup cans is art, how is something like FreeSpace (or Dragon Age, or Shadow of the Colossus) not art?

[StarSlayer]

Why is art pretentious? If a picture of colored soup cans is art, how is something like FreeSpace (or Dragon Age, or Shadow of the Colosssus) not art?

I don't think I'm pretentious...