Author Topic: Obama administration unveils online ID system  (Read 7980 times)

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Offline Thaeris

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
"Listen my fellow coughdumbtardscough I mean Americans, we're gonna ID you but the huge amount of computers on the basement of the pentagon the size of several football fields, will not be used to track every little thing you do and know who to bring for water-boarding weekend at CIA HQ under the patriot act and so many other excuses of Home Land Security, I swear to you that we'll not fukc you over even if we have the total impunity and power to do it so, really, c'mon why don't you believe me?"

It's funny because that might happen.

i dont like this new thing with the phones though, cell phones are evil ****ty devices and i will never own one. the only phone we have looks like something from the battlestar galactica, and i dont use it. we often keep it unplugged. google pulls that **** on me, im gonna go find another email provider.

This reminds me of the Captain in charge of my 200-level AFROTC course back at Embry, who did not personally own a cell or a home computer I believe. But do not be decieved, that man was full of win! Role models are great...
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Offline Unknown Target

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
It's less about that than Google wanting my phone number (and tracking my location without my permission).
I don't remember the phone number being a mandatory piece of information, and I'm not sure what you're on about with the location-tracking.

Saw this on Popular Science today;

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2011-04/your-iphone-automatically-tracks-where-you-go-and-when-security-experts-say

 

Offline Thaeris

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Oh. Dear. God...
"trolls are clearly social rejects and therefore should be isolated from society, or perhaps impaled."

-Nuke



"Look on the bright side, how many release dates have been given for Doomsday, and it still isn't out yet.

It's the Duke Nukem Forever of prophecies..."


"Jesus saves.

Everyone else takes normal damage.
"

-Flipside

"pirating software is a lesser evil than stealing but its still evil. but since i pride myself for being evil, almost anything is fair game."


"i never understood why women get the creeps so ****ing easily. i mean most serial killers act perfectly normal, until they kill you."


-Nuke

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Yeah, terrifying, we're all going to be put into the system and geolocated by Big Brother as part of a master plan by the same federal government that can't even coordinate policy between its own intelligence agencies.

The future's pretty scary right guys, Apple sure is doing a good job as a catspaw for the reptilians

 

Offline Thaeris

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
inorite?
"trolls are clearly social rejects and therefore should be isolated from society, or perhaps impaled."

-Nuke



"Look on the bright side, how many release dates have been given for Doomsday, and it still isn't out yet.

It's the Duke Nukem Forever of prophecies..."


"Jesus saves.

Everyone else takes normal damage.
"

-Flipside

"pirating software is a lesser evil than stealing but its still evil. but since i pride myself for being evil, almost anything is fair game."


"i never understood why women get the creeps so ****ing easily. i mean most serial killers act perfectly normal, until they kill you."


-Nuke

 

Offline ssmit132

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Saw this on Popular Science today;

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2011-04/your-iphone-automatically-tracks-where-you-go-and-when-security-experts-say
I can't read it, the browsers on the uni computer are being automatically redirected to the Australian page. Not that I have an iPhone (or any smart phone), but I was interested in reading it.

 

Offline Unknown Target

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Yeah, terrifying, we're all going to be put into the system and geolocated by Big Brother as part of a master plan by the same federal government that can't even coordinate policy between its own intelligence agencies.

The future's pretty scary right guys, Apple sure is doing a good job as a catspaw for the reptilians

I love to play the "let's take everything literally so as to disprove any possibility of misuse of a system" game. Of course I'm not implying Apple is Big Brother or is trying to steal your dataz zomgz and that they're gonna hunt you down and kill you.

What I meant was that Apple, like all US corporations, is mandated to reveal your information if requested by the government with a search warrant. Fine, if you can come up with a legitimate use for this (such as revealing where you are when you call 911, which honestly I think is the only proper use), then that's great. But do you really think that it's acceptable that Apple collects this data, secretly without telling it's users (which indicates a failing on corporate law), and now the government has the power, through a warrant, to track where you are 24/7 (which is a holdover from many warrant rights and legislation that does not but nevertheless applies to data such as this).
« Last Edit: April 21, 2011, 01:29:20 am by Unknown Target »

 

Offline Unknown Target

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Saw this on Popular Science today;

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2011-04/your-iphone-automatically-tracks-where-you-go-and-when-security-experts-say
I can't read it, the browsers on the uni computer are being automatically redirected to the Australian page. Not that I have an iPhone (or any smart phone), but I was interested in reading it.

That's weird. Here's the article text:


British security researchers have figured out that iPhones keep track of where their owners go, saving data to the device and uploading it to a user’s computer when the phone is synced with iTunes. The data includes the phone’s latitude and longitude and is timestamped to the second, all of which is recorded in a hidden file--which is very much not secure.
This could theoretically be useful for anyone interested in knowing where an iPhone owner spends his or her time — advertisers, employers, spouses, parents.
Technology, Rebecca Boyle, apple, gps tracking, Internet privacy, iphones, location data, location-based services, privacy, surveillance“Apple have made it possible for anyone from a jealous spouse to a private investigator to get a detailed picture of your movements,” according to researcher Pete Warden.
To be clear, such a snoop would need access to your phone or computer and a way to extract and refine the data. It is not sent to Apple nor any third parties, as far as the researchers can tell — it’s just stored on an individual user’s devices. But it is apparently not very difficult to extract the location data from a user's computer.
Warden and Alasdair Allan say they tried to find similar location tracking code on Android phones, but could not find anything. “We haven't come across any instances of other phone manufacturers doing this,” Warden tells the Guardian.
Given Google’s penchant for location tracking and mapping, the alarm is perhaps surprising — Google’s “Latitude” app lets users see their friends on a map, for instance. But Latitude requires that users actively choose to track their location information; in this case, the user is unaware of the data collection. The Guardian reports that Apple did not comment on why the file was created or whether it could be disabled. If you upgrade to a new phone, the file is transferred to that next-generation device, which the researchers say means the data collection is not accidental.
Warden — who has previously worked for Apple — and Allan created their own app that finds the hidden file among the stored backup files on a Mac and turns it into a map. If you don’t care to visualize your travels, Warden explains how to find the file on his website.
The researchers believe the location data is obtained by triangulating the phone’s position against the closest cell phone towers, which uses less battery power than GPS. It also explains why some of the data is incorrect, as triangulation is much less precise than GPS. But the data is still alarmingly accurate, tracking your history as an iPhone owner through the months and years. Forgot that you took that trip to Boston last summer? Your iPhone didn't.
It’s not clear how this information would be used, but there are several possible explanations, including targeted mobile advertising, synchronization for location-based networks like FourSquare, understanding commuter habits, and so on.
Allan found the file while the pair were working on how to visualize mobile data, having already collaborated on other data-visualization projects including a radiation map for Japan. At first the researchers weren’t sure what it was, Warden explains on his website.
“After we dug further and visualized the extracted data, it became clear that there was a scary amount of detail on our movements,” he writes.
There is no real way to disable this logging at the moment, though you can encrypt your data to make it harder to read once it's synced to your computer. This is a big enough problem that we expect Apple will respond at some point, so we'll keep you updated if and when that happens.

 

Offline ssmit132

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Thanks. :)

What I meant was that Apple, like all US corporations, is mandated to reveal your information if requested by the government with a search warrant. Fine, if you can come up with a legitimate use for this (such as revealing where you are when you call 911, which honestly I think is the only proper use), then that's great. But do you really think that it's acceptable that Apple collects this data, secretly without telling it's users (which indicates a failing on corporate law), and now the government has the power, through a warrant, to track where you are 24/7 (which is a holdover from many warrant rights and legislation that does not but nevertheless applies to data such as this).
Yeah, that's not the sort of thing you want handed to the government without your knowledge. That sort of function shouldn't be hidden away and unable to be turned off (like you said with the "failing on corporate law") - heck, it probably shouldn't exist at all by default. At least with Latitude you have to conciously select to track your location.

 

Offline technopredator

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
A constitutional right should be if it ain't already, I have the right to be completely anonymous in my household. That would include the cellular phones acting like microphones even if you have turned it off, the trick USA Gov. without democratic consultation or even telling people about it, it had to be a leaked info. Is about what everyone needs, privacy in their homes.

 

Offline Nuke

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
by their nature, broadcast transmissions (like the ones cell phones make) can be triangulated with multiple receiver locations (which is part of the communications infrastructure). so while your transmitting your transaction is logged at the tower(s) that receive your signal. based on your tx power as measured at the towers, its just a little bit of math (were talking a couple lines of code here) to figure out where you're at in relation to the towers, and since the towers locations are known, its easy to determine your exact location at the time of the call. its not rocket science, its basic trig and algebra. cell companies have many reasons to log this information. generate usage statistics and identify weak points in the grid so they know where to build more towers. this data is also used to determine billing. the fact that they dont encrypt these logs make it a massive security hole. and that is why i dont own a cell.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 09:23:22 pm by Nuke »
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Offline Nuclear1

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Quote
this data is also used to determine billing.
That, and when you get a cell phone and a number, you're assigned to a specific mobile switching center where all your calls are processed and sent to other numbers.  When you enter another switching center's sphere of influence, it registers that number in something called the visitor location register, and automatically labels that phone as "roaming".
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Offline Mars

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Does anyone still get charged for roaming?

 

Offline Nuke

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Quote
this data is also used to determine billing.
That, and when you get a cell phone and a number, you're assigned to a specific mobile switching center where all your calls are processed and sent to other numbers.  When you enter another switching center's sphere of influence, it registers that number in something called the visitor location register, and automatically labels that phone as "roaming".

this is the kinda thing i meant.
I can no longer sit back and allow communist infiltration, communist indoctrination, communist subversion, and the international communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Found a decent article that I have to at least partially agree with - It's strange many people don't consider this a problem.

http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-secret-location-tracking-2011-4

And yes, the governments are inept, stupid and outright comically absurd, but they still have very real torture centers,detention centers, and jackboot type thugs that get off on supressing you and dehumanising you. Also, this sets the stage for a very competent, calculated government (While the chance of that are low) to completely supress a population and then start stealing all their money, savings, pretty much anything, just watching the monitors to see who objects, to send their thugs to.

I mean, TSA is inept yet they still manage to get huge populations to radiate themselves in body scanners and degrade them without anyone defending themselves.
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Offline Snail

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Glad I don't have a smartphone to be honest. Proud of the fact that my mobile phone is actually a mobile phone (an old barely functional Nokia 4-year old mobile phone, but a phone nonetheless).

 

Offline Nuke

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
youre still emitting a signal, that is being picked up at multiple towers, and your tx power and timestamps are still in their databases, you just dont have your own local copy. face it triangulation is a ***** :D
I can no longer sit back and allow communist infiltration, communist indoctrination, communist subversion, and the international communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.

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Offline Scotty

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
youre still emitting a signal, that is being picked up at multiple towers, and your tx power and timestamps are still in their databases, you just dont have your own local copy. face it triangulation is a ***** :D

Uh, why?  It can also be used to locate people trapped in the wilderness and find missing and kidnapped people.  What's so wrong about anyone knowing where you are, anyway?

  

Offline Nuke

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
youre still emitting a signal, that is being picked up at multiple towers, and your tx power and timestamps are still in their databases, you just dont have your own local copy. face it triangulation is a ***** :D

Uh, why?  It can also be used to locate people trapped in the wilderness and find missing and kidnapped people.  What's so wrong about anyone knowing where you are, anyway?

that was not my point. this was mainly in response to snail's post. the point is if you're trying to stay off the radar by using an old model phone, you will fail. by simply broadcasting you are giving away your position. yes this information can be somewhat useful, it can also be exploited. i only point out the nature of the technology. i prefer to stay off the grid, so i dont own a phone at all.

i should also point out that this does not apply only to cell phones, you can do the same with any kind of radio transmission. this is how the fcc finds and fines pirate radio stations, and how the military can direct artillery to your position based on your transmission.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2011, 11:04:27 pm by Nuke »
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Offline Mongoose

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Re: Obama administration unveils online ID system
Privacy concerns aside, part of me has always been amused by the fears over cell-phone tracking, because I figured that was sort of part and parcel with the concept of a cell phone.  You're carrying around a device whose primary purpose is to send and receive radio signals...and you're worried about someone being able to pick said signals up? :p