[General Battuta]

So you're saying that you don't need statistics, you don't need historical precedents, you can make your plans using only the power of your mind?

Well it's another possibility. I mean, I doubt the Constitution was written using just statistical inquiries.

The Constitution was written in no small part by devout rationalists and enlightenment thinkers, and many of the greatest debates surrounding it were about the actual realities of how to divide political power and make the system work.

It was written by knowing the country and how it worked. It was written by practical, intelligent men who knew how to translate an idea into action.

[Unknown Target]

Yes, and?

I bet you they didn't base their entire decision off of what the latest numbers from X were saying compared with the latest trends in Y.

Statistics are just another problem solving tool, not an end in themselves.

[General Battuta]

Exactly - but they're also the only way to test models. They're a necessary ingredient. You can't roll without them.

ed: For example, you've made claims that the people want something. How do you know they want it? How can you tell?

[Unknown Target]

Exactly - but they're also the only way to test models. They're a necessary ingredient. You can't roll without them.

ed: For example, you've made claims that the people want something. How do you know they want it? How can you tell?

Why not measure it in time?

To answer your example; one possibility of how to measure it could be that over time you measure how often an individual says they mayhave heard key phrases during the course of their day? So for every day for X number of years, Z is how often an individual hears "seems like things are getting worse", and Y is time.

[General Battuta]

Exactly - but they're also the only way to test models. They're a necessary ingredient. You can't roll without them.

ed: For example, you've made claims that the people want something. How do you know they want it? How can you tell?

Why not measure it in time?

To answer your example; one possibility of how to measure it could be that over time you measure how often an individual says they mayhave heard key phrases during the course of their day? So for every day for X number of years, Z is how often an individual hears "seems like things are getting worse", and Y is time.

Exactly, and now you're gathering population statistics. Except there are far easier and more representative ways to get the data you're after, and much better questions to ask.

ed: How many people do you think you'd need to poll in order to be sure you have a representative sample? How would you do it?

[Unknown Target]

ed: How many people do you think you'd need to poll in order to be sure you have a representative sample? How would you do it?

Honestly I just wouldn't do it. I would basically use myself as the example's barometer. If I am doing what I believe to be the right thing, I would talk to others around me and see how they reacted to some of the things I do. I would think about the results, and experiment with another course of action.

Basically, I'd think for myself, instead of wondering what the numbers said the likelihood of me thinking about something different was.

[General Battuta]

Isn't governing by that method essentially tantamount to dictatorial rule?

Why do you believe that using statistical methodology precludes thinking for yourself?

[Unknown Target]

Isn't governing by that method essentially tantamount to dictatorial rule?

Why do you believe that using statistical methodology precludes thinking for yourself?

I don't, I think that's what you're not doing, though.

These questions you ask me, why don't you answer them in your next post? Use any perspective you'd like on the matter.

[General Battuta]

No, you're missing the issue. The reason I'm asking you to supply statistics is because you make statements about how EVERYONE feels, when really you're saying what YOU feel.

If you're going to describe the attitudes of a population, you need population statistics.

[Unknown Target]

No, you're missing the issue. The reason I'm asking you to supply statistics is because you make statements about how EVERYONE feels, when really you're saying what YOU feel.

If you're going to describe the attitudes of a population, you need population statistics.

The issue is that you're refusing to answer that personal question asking you to do what?

[General Battuta]

No, you're missing the issue. The reason I'm asking you to supply statistics is because you make statements about how EVERYONE feels, when really you're saying what YOU feel.

If you're going to describe the attitudes of a population, you need population statistics.

The issue is that you're refusing to answer that personal question asking you to do what?

This sentence doesn't make sense, please rephrase it.

[Unknown Target]

Can anyone else reading this thread answer the question? Do you think any of them can help you, General Battuta?

[General Battuta]

Can anyone else reading this thread answer the question? Do you think any of them can help you, General Battuta?

What question exactly are you asking? I'm not clear on what you want answered. You want me to answer if governing by what you feel is right is dictatorial rule? Yes, absolutely. Do I think using statistics precludes thinking for yourself? No, of course not, I've already explained why.

[General Battuta]

Explain what point you're trying to make. Is your argument that decisionmakers should never consult population statistics to see what others believe before making a decision?

Are you essentially arguing that democracy should be done away with?

[Unknown Target]

The question is: what do you think I would say?

[General Battuta]

You're not sure any more. Come back when you've figured it out, and we can continue.

[Mustang19]

What is the topic of discussion here?

[General Battuta]

oh snap a flaming giboon

Originally we were trying to explain to UT why the way he feels something is does not necessarily represent the way it actually is or even the way other people actually think it is. Now I dunno, he seems to have gone off on a tangent where if you use science you are evil?

[Snail]

What is the topic of discussion here?

How not to do photo-manipulation, or so it seems.

[General Battuta]

Don't disrespect that giboon's forcefield.