[pecenipicek]

would a comparison with a proper sound card be good as well? i have an audigy 2  zs set up, with creative drivers and soft_oal.dll in my fso folder. i found that without openal soft sound tended to clip a lot.

[QuantumDelta]

My soundcard is a Zonar D2X it really doesn't get much more 'proper'.
I had an Audigy 2 ZS and had to buy new hardware because of the soundcode so you tell me how "proper" it is >.>

[Flipside]

Creative used to have a reputation for writing crap drivers and not supporting older products the moment they released a new one, but the Audigy is the grandchild of the Soundblaster, which is more or less the industry standard for soundcards

That said, I have an EMU-1212, which is a card designed for audio-processing rather than gameplaying, and its OAL and DirectSound support are....basic... would probably be the best word.

[pecenipicek]

My soundcard is a Zonar D2X it really doesn't get much more 'proper'.
I had an Audigy 2 ZS and had to buy new hardware because of the soundcode so you tell me how "proper" it is >.>

roger that.

its still metric tons better than sound over realtek.

[Nuke]

i find that speakers matter more than sound cards for good audio. i fins the typical satellite speakers used in most computer speaker systems are horrible, id rather have speaks that have at least one tweeter, one midrange and one sub each, and an old stereo amp. want 3d sound double it up, 2 stereo amps, 4 full range speakers. of course for me 3d sound hasnt sounded 3d since the late 90s, so i stick with stereo.

[chief1983]

I've heard better 3D sound in Lemmings 3D than in a lot of games since.

[Flipside]

The thing is, there are people who are paid large amounts of money to mix things like movie scores so that, for example, music doesn't drown out an important bit of dialogue, or bring it more to the front to underline a character theme etc, it's a skill that requires far more than simply sound knowledge, since you have to understand what is important to the viewer at that moment in time. It's as much an emotional experience as an aural one.

Computers cannot do that to the same degree, it doesn't know what the player wants to hear at that moment in time, so it just has to do the best with what it has.

In truth, 3D audio is usually mixed far further to one position or another than it should be in movies, purely to emphasise the 3D balance and add depth to the sound, if anything, the problem is that computer-modelling of 3D audio is too accurate.

[Nuke]

in games i think 3d sound should be used to give the player better situational awareness. dramatic effect is secondary. granted freespace was one of the best sounding games back in the day. it granted both in appropriate proportions.

[Spoon]

It's not the level of detail I have a problem with, it's the casual shrugging off of information because 'we're trying to fix the sound code here', there are polite ways and rude ways of doing things and a simple smattering of good manners, particularly outside of GD, is not such a big thing to ask.

I've stated on a few sound code threads that I felt it was more to do with the mixing of the sounds when the audio is particularly 'busy', though apparently Taylor found some other problems as well, and I stand by that belief, but if people want to consider my input irrelevant then fine.

Stop crying man. 
It's really simple mate. Iss Mneur posted a build and asked if people wanted to test this and post back what kind of settings they used on the commandflags. The next 10 posts after mine was random divergence into talking about setups. This was irrelevant to what was asked (Iss Mneur agreed) and there's nothing bad manner about pointing that out.
Knowing what sound system a person has is fine and all if that person is actually providing feedback. If not its meaningless. I really shouldn't have to point that out, but here you go.

It is indeed quite relevant because, despite having tried for a while when I have been at my pc (hense, sorry, why I haven't popped up another video with the latest build when I have been on it), I haven't been able to repro the clipping described on Spoons machine on any of the builds, I assume, because of how much the Zonar can handle.

Well go on and test what your Zonar can actually handle. open fred, make one wing of 6 fighters warp in next to your position. No clipping? Add an other wing of 6. test again. and so forth.


Anyway, go Taylor 

[Flipside]

Stop crying man. 
It's really simple mate. Iss Mneur posted a build and asked if people wanted to test this and post back what kind of settings they used on the commandflags. The next 10 posts after mine was random divergence into talking about setups. This was irrelevant to what was asked (Iss Mneur agreed) and there's nothing bad manner about pointing that out.
Knowing what sound system a person has is fine and all if that person is actually providing feedback. If not its meaningless. I really shouldn't have to point that out, but here you go.

And once again you prove you are incapable of discussing the debate in a mature and reasonable matter with 'stop crying man' etc.

As has already been mentioned, the discussion about Soundcards etc was relevant, I'll agree it probably drifted a little, but your entire arrogant, child-like behaviour and lack of communication skills when discussing the matter has been noted.

[Spoon]

Yeah well thats like your opinion man ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Valathil]

[Spoon]

Semi serious reply. I really dont get what your issue is Flippy.
The only thing I did was say that the topic was going off track with not useful posts, instead of ya know, doing what the coders trying to fix this issue were asking. You somehow flip out over this calling me arrogant and childish.

[Flipside]

Heh, not really mad at him, I've even defended him a couple of times in situations where he's spoken his mind Just trying to remind people that this is not GenDis, and that a more 'erpson friendly' attitude outside of GenDis would not only be a boon to the poster, but also to the community.

Semi serious reply. I really dont get what your issue is Flippy.
The only thing I did was say that the topic was going off track with not useful posts, instead of ya know, doing what the coders trying to fix this issue were asking. You somehow flip out over this calling me arrogant and childish.

To quote the great Philosopher Bananarama, 'it ain't what you do, it's the way that you do it'. As I said earlier, at first you were just rude, you might even have had a point that we'd drifted a little far from the factual information required, I know you to be somewhat blunt and in GD that doesn't matter so much, but when I called you out on that, you started with the 'stop crying man' comments etc, which, rather than being an attempt to diffuse the situation ,was an attempt to inflame it. Once again, this is not GD, I expect a higher standard of communication out here.

Edit: Take the Charybdis thread as an example, how much was achieved by attacking when compared to what was achieved by rational communication?

[Spoon]

That's the thing, I don't see how I was in any way shape or form being rude. 
I really want to see this sound code fixed though.

Also, I hardly ever post or read anything in GD.

[Flipside]

Well, the matter I was referring to was actually more based around the support forum to be honest, but I won't get into that.

It's a simply matter of showing some empathy to other posters, we all want the sound code to be as good as it can be, otherwise we wouldn't be here, but turning round and dismissing people's posts out of hand because you personally consider them 'irrelevant' is not the way to achieve that. As an example:

'The discussion about different cards is interesting, but it seems to be starting to drift away from the matter at hand', is perfectly acceptable and probably correct.
'Stop the irrelevant talk about speaker set ups and audiocards and do something with this:', or 'Trying to fix the sound code here, useful feedback has been requested.' is not only somewhat offensive to the posters, it's also mildly offensive to the coders as well.

Edit: Anyway, this is starting to serve the same purpose and pull the thread off-topic, so we've both said our piece, so lets allow this thread to return to its original purpose.

[Spoon]

These last few posts are due for a split anyway, so I'm just going ahead and reply because this attitude of yours is just too dumb to let go.

is not only somewhat offensive to the posters

Offensive? Seriously? SERIOUSLY?
Come. On. 

it's also mildly offensive to the coders as well.

No its not.

Yes please.

Nobody here has been *offended* by anything man. Grow a thicker skin, this is just getting ridiculous. You want every post to have "please" included or something?
Stop overreacting to something absolutely trival.

'The discussion about different cards is interesting, but it seems to be starting to drift away from the matter at hand', is perfectly acceptable and probably correct.
'Stop the irrelevant talk about speaker set ups and audiocards and do something with this:', or 'Trying to fix the sound code here, useful feedback has been requested.' is not only somewhat offensive to the posters, it's also mildly offensive to the coders as well.

I mean, whats up with this patronising attitude? For real? You are going to 'educate' me on the proper tone of posting so I won't *offend* anyone in the future? After you called me (a personal attack on me) Arrogant, childish and lacking communication skills you are in no position to say anything on this matter.
Are you going to educate Droid803, pecenipicek, NGTM-1R, The E and Hades like this too then? Those are all pretty blunt posters.


You've taking something completely insignificant (the tone of a post, that is in no shape or form 'offensive' or 'rude' or a personal attack on anyone), blown it up to huge proporitions. Getting personally offended over nothing. Then you personally started insulting me because I told you to stop overreacting over nothing. And then in a true act of arrogance you try to preach to me the proper ways to post and phrase words. Not to mention you are trying to make it seem like you speak for everyone, that I not somehow only offended you and the other posters but also the coders. The same coders I've been actively trying to help track this problem down in this very thread.
Dude. 

[mjn.mixael]

Guys...

Chill.

[Flipside]

Oh for God's sake....

You perpetuate it and complain about other people derailing?

I'll split this bollocks out later, since I'm busy atm.

[Spoon]

You started it