Author Topic: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...  (Read 11145 times)

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Offline Marcov

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Why do you want to find out how heavy certain ships are?
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Offline redsniper

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
To see if they'll float.
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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Well I did run into the problem of a Tiigran-Merrist heavy bomber bumping into a cruiser at full speed during a test shootout mission and giving it a velocity of some 3 m/s, so if this automatic mass calculating system would work the first time every time, it would help out a lot.

Also- I don't want my T-M bombers to sink. :p
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Offline Fury

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Why do you want to find out how heavy certain ships are?
If I know a ships (relative!) weight, mass or volume I can use that as a basis to calculate damp, rotdamp, max velocity, rotation time, acceleration, explosion radius, explosion damage, explosion blast, primary and secondary capacities, power output which in turn affects shield strength and shields and weapons regen, hitpoints, scan time and score. Probably more too and each of those can be used to calculate other values.

Then you can add modifiers wherever you see fit, for example to distinguish Fenris, Leviathan and Cain and Lilith from each other. Or tech level modifiers to make FS2-era ships better from FS1 era ships.

Bounding box volume allows me to do all that, with one caveat. A ship may be of a shape where bounding box size does not reflect the ship's actual volume, or even close enough. One such example would be the Seraphim. Eyeballing a modifier into the volume calculation would be stupid, because other ships have similar issues in different scale, such as Fenris/Leviathan (radar dome and missile turret).

So unless some bright coder can add somewhat accurate volume calculation into PCS2, the bounding box volume seems be the only option here. Unless somebody knows how to use Blender to calculate model's volume, mass or weight. I tried to comb Blender's confusing UI to find whether it could do just that, but I didn't find such option. Googling didn't reveal anything either, oddly enough. Which seems to indicate such feature does not exist in Blender.

I already have a spreadsheet including all FS1 ships where I've used bounding box volume as a base to calculate all other ship stats. It does provide very nice variety for even fighter sized ships.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2011, 01:16:42 am by Fury »

 

Offline headdie

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Why do you want to find out how heavy certain ships are?
If I know a ships (relative!) weight, mass or volume I can use that as a basis to calculate damp, rotdamp, max velocity, rotation time, acceleration, explosion radius, explosion damage, explosion blast, primary and secondary capacities, power output which in turn affects shield strength and shields and weapons regen, hitpoints, scan time and score. Probably more too and each of those can be used to calculate other values.

Then you can add modifiers wherever you see fit, for example to distinguish Fenris, Leviathan and Cain and Lilith from each other. Or tech level modifiers to make FS2-era ships better from FS1 era ships.

Bounding box volume allows me to do all that, with one caveat. A ship may be of a shape where bounding box size does not reflect the ship's actual volume, or even close enough. One such example would be the Seraphim. Eyeballing a modifier into the volume calculation would be stupid, because other ships have similar issues in different scale, such as Fenris/Leviathan (radar dome and missile turret).

So unless some bright coder can add somewhat accurate volume calculation into PCS2, the bounding box volume seems be the only option here. Unless somebody knows how to use Blender to calculate model's volume, mass or weight. I tried to comb Blender's confusing UI to find whether it could do just that, but I didn't find such option. Googling didn't reveal anything either, oddly enough. Which seems to indicate such feature does not exist in Blender.

I already have a spreadsheet including all FS1 ships where I've used bounding box volume as a base to calculate all other ship stats. It does provide very nice variety for even fighter sized ships.

I suppose using PCS2 or import the models into a 3d program, if you are using pcs2 perhaps use screen grabs to fix the positions and mark as appropriate, you could sub divide the ship into easier to manage volumes and measure it manually that way
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Offline Mars

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Not an easy task for one very simple reason: even if one were to find the volume of each ship, there's no indication of how solidly packed in the materials are, only some indication of what the materials are, and so on.

I think it's safe to assume that per unit of volume, FS2 ships are vastly heavier than steel water going ships given the propensity for using depleted uranium on the Iceni and Ares, for example. The Deimos's "collapsed core molybdenum" could be lighter than Titanium or as dense as a neutron star for all we know, but I'd guess closer to the latter.

Blue Planet puts the mass figure for the combined weight of Serkr team at 1,000,000 tons (it was informal in universe, so it isn't really even 'canon' within the BP context); a figure I actually think is pretty light. Your average coal train weighs in at about 10,000 tons.

 

Offline Fury

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Like I have already said earlier in this topic, those points are irrelevant to me as far as this topic goes.

 

Offline Wanderer

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Brief Google search yielded this: http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?84827-Calculating-the-volume-of-a-model/page3 which at least claims to compute volumes.
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Offline Fury

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Nice find Wanderer. So a python script for Blender, huh. I probably should try this one day even though it seems a tad complicated. Thanks.

 

Offline Davros

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
I know the weight of the ships
zero everything in space is weightless ;)

 

Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Wrong. Ships in space are subject to a huge number of gravitational forces. We wouldn't have orbits and such otherwise. Lrn2physics.
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Offline The E

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
I know the weight of the ships
zero everything in space is weightless ;)

Weightless does not mean massless. lrn2physics.
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Offline Davros

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
thats why i said "i know the weight" and not "i know the mass" ;)

 

Offline karajorma

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Karajorma's Freespace FAQ. It's almost like asking me yourself.

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Offline Davros

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
that link doesnt say weight and mass are the same, so it does matter

 

Offline Aardwolf

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
You are not "weightless" in space. Anywhere the acceleration due to gravity is nonzero, you have weight (relativity notwithstanding).

 

Offline Davros

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Anywhere the acceleration due to gravity is nonzero

Which is practically nowhere statistically speaking :D
« Last Edit: November 27, 2011, 04:28:29 pm by Davros »

 

Offline Thaeris

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
To see if they'll float.

There is another highly scientific program which is commonly observed in the public domain for this purpose as well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm-AkvwPdZ4&feature=related
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Offline karajorma

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
Anywhere the acceleration due to gravity is nonzero

Which is practically nowhere statistically speaking :D

So there you go, following on from that, there is pratically nowhere in space where you don't have weight.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: If I wanted to know a ship's weight/mass...
that link doesnt say weight and mass are the same, so it does matter

You have forgotten that GTVA ships have artificial gravity, and hence weight.

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